Author Topic: Getting a MK4 perhaps.  (Read 40010 times)

emp

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2026, 10:48:11 AM »
thanks. I understand Colin's point, I was not really aware of the "glare" problem. In a traffic jam I will definitely use P (park) but I think for a simple traffic light I just use the brake pedal.

So maybe someone can confirm when using "brake and hold". If it is initialized it shows up on my driver screen that it is activated. I assume that when I drive the brake lights go out, right? Even while it is still activated? Only when I come to a standstill e.g. in front of a traffic light, the brake lights stay on? When I then press the gas pedal the brake lights go off again even though "brake and hold" is still activated. Am I correct?

I just asked chatgpt and it confirms my assumption  :)
« Last Edit: May 01, 2026, 10:54:42 AM by emp »

Downsizer

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2026, 12:08:48 PM »
You’re correct.

CB72

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2026, 03:57:49 PM »
I find the brake hold doesn't give a smooth pull away,  it has a slight jerk when moving off, must be due to brake releasing with the wheels powered, I'm not keen on it, so reluctant to use brake hold unless I'm in for long wait, for example at a railway crossing. I'll try the hand brake next time though.

emp

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2026, 04:06:57 PM »
I find the brake hold doesn't give a smooth pull away,  it has a slight jerk when moving off, must be due to brake releasing with the wheels powered, I'm not keen on it, so reluctant to use brake hold unless I'm in for long wait, for example at a railway crossing. I'll try the hand brake next time though.

what is the hand brake? I had one in my Suzuki SX4 2013 but I have no hand brake in my Honda Jazz Crosstar 2026. You mean park (P)?  In my opinion "Brake and Hold" works just fine. Only thing is you need to activate it when you restart the car because at restart it is turned off.

CB72

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2026, 04:19:51 PM »
The hand brake is the little switch in front of the drive selector, I suppose you could call it the finger brake  :D
The manual calls it the Electric Parking Brake Switch.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2026, 04:27:09 PM by CB72 »

sebastiand

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2026, 11:13:12 PM »
Handbrake = parking brake : braking with the brake discs / rotors.
Classic hand brakes brake pulling two cables under the car (manual mechanism, similar to a bicycle) connected to the brake calipers. And you have different levels.
Electric parking brake is the new version braking electronically by just pressing a button (should also be on the caliper assembly).

These brakes despite of using the calipers are not as strong as using the brake pedal / hydraulic. But are strong enough to hold the cars weight on a slope when parking)

"P" Park: not sure in the jazz tho. But In regular A/T is a position that can brake using the gearbox 'parking pawl". It is not recommended to brake with this if the car is moving because the weight of the vehicle falls on the this metal piece. It's better to brake / lock the car with the caliper before selecting P. (By using the hand brake or electronic brake, then selecting N position, releasing the brake pedal for a second before switching to P
Does this also apply to the Jazz hybrid e-CVT when parking on a slope?
« Last Edit: May 02, 2026, 11:26:00 PM by sebastiand »

Lord Voltermore

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2026, 09:58:15 AM »
I think terminology has been influenced a bit by the USA ,where A/T has been the norm for years.  Many Americans call the  handbrake the 'Emergency' brake  ( sometimes shortened to 'e-brake' )  and regard it primarily as an emergency way of stopping the car if the foot brakes fail.
Many will routinely park relying just on 'P'. Americans do  also  sometimes call it a parking brake, so presumably some will also set it when parking, especially if its hilly.  But as an exception rather than normal routine. 

As sebastiand says  with conventional A/T at least  ,' P' relies solely on a metal pawl , which put crudely is jammed into  the equivilent of the gears .  (maybe its a bit more sophisticated than I have described it   ;D ) If this pawl breaks or wears , the car would be free to roll downhill.

I usually park a manual car left in gear and also set the handbrake.  and with  with an automatic I set P and apply the handbrake.  Even on a level location.      Only exception might be if I intend to leave the car  for some time  on a secure and level  private driveway when I might  select P but leave the handbrake off so it doesnt jam due to rust etc.   

BTW  the electric handbrake switch   can still be used as an emergency way of stopping the Mk4.   If you flick it up with your finger whilst the car is  moving the car  will brake. Keep doing so for long enough it will brake to a stop.    For  a second or so the retardation is quite gradual.  So if a curious passenger unexpectedly flicks  the switch the driver wont be too disturbed by it.   But soon after the rate of braking increases  quite sharply  to the point the car will stop as rapidly as it would with the footbrake.  It stops much better than most cars do in an emergency using  just a conventional handbrake  lever. 

I recommend that Mk4 owners go somewhere quite with no other traffic, and  try it out for themselves.  Start from a modest speed ,maybe 20 mph/30 kph and just flick the handbrake switch  up with your finger. The car will start to slow, but as this increases you may become shocked by just how powerfully the car can brake with just the flick of a finger. .   But its easy to just to release the switch and the car resumes as as normal.   After trying this a few times I found I control the rate of braking as easily by finger as I could by the foot brake.  Obviously this is not the intention,  but it did give me confidence that in the unlikely event the foot brakes failed I could still have good control over braking. 
It also a good idea to 'initiate' anyone else who might drive the car into this safety feature, and indeed anyone who might regularly travel as the front seat passenger. 

I like electric handbrakes.  The only thing they cant do is 'handbrake turns' . But few drivers do those anyway.  ;D
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Jazzik

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2026, 10:59:57 AM »
There is a pleasant side benefit to braking using the electric handbrake as an emergency brake. When the handbrake is applied, both the front and rear brakes are activated.
We all know that, especially in hybrids, the rear brakes are normally used very little, resulting in rusting brake discs.
However, the discs can easily be kept rust-free and clean by occasionally (on an empty road and after taking another good look in the rearview mirror!) applying the cleaning trick with the handbrake.
Result: clean and shiny brake discs, even the rear ones.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2026, 11:03:56 AM by Jazzik »
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sebastiand

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2026, 12:08:07 PM »
The electric parking brake (electronic handbrake) doesn't only actuates in the two real calipers? (Rear wheels only).

https://global.honda/en/tech/Electric_Parking_Brake_EPB_Automatic_Brake_Hold/

Or basically my doubt is that you can force hydraulic brakes in 4 wheels using the EPB while moving?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2026, 12:12:45 PM by sebastiand »

Hicardo

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2026, 12:27:09 PM »
Love the Brake Hold feature, use it every drive  8)

Jazzik

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2026, 12:35:53 PM »
The electric parking brake (electronic handbrake) doesn't only actuates in the two real calipers? (Rear wheels only).

https://global.honda/en/tech/Electric_Parking_Brake_EPB_Automatic_Brake_Hold/

Or basically my doubt is that you can force hydraulic brakes in 4 wheels using the EPB while moving?
Did you read this: https://global.honda/en/tech/Electric_Parking_Brake_EPB_Automatic_Brake_Hold/  ?

Part of the text (the "cleaning" emergency brake mode ;)):

"It is also possible to activate the hydraulic brakes in front and rear wheels by pulling and holding back the parking brake switch while moving."
« Last Edit: May 03, 2026, 12:51:40 PM by Jazzik »
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Lord Voltermore

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2026, 12:55:21 PM »
If you apply the electronic parking brake whilst stationary it only actuates the two rear electric powered parking brake callipers. 

But i'm fairly sure if you flick up the  handbrake switch whilst moving  the system employs the full abs braking system to apply all 4 brakes hydraulically .The stopping power seems too powerful and well controlled to just be the rear electric calipers.   And as  Jazzik points out all 4 brake discs are  cleaned of rust.
I think the Honda tech info has been dumbed down a bit .(simplified  ;D
.
I vaguely recall reading its part of the fail safe system that duplicates braking systems, so if one part fails, braking function is largely   maintained.  If for instance the  foot brake hydraulic cylinder and circuit fails due to a leak , flicking  the handbrake switch will still activate the electric driven power brake servo and abs pump , and all 4 brakes will probably activate including abs functions. .  Alternatively if the electric power brakes/abs  pump side of things fails  the basic hydraulic foot brake system should still be working and quite likely also the  rear electric powered parking brake calipers.

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ADCO

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2026, 02:49:11 PM »
Attached is a screen grab of the magnificent Prof. Kelly explaining the workings of the i-MMD drive from a video on the Weber University website. It shows the pawl and ring which is engaged when selecting P. or Park Mode. Not a good idea to try to engage while moving  ???

ColinB

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2026, 06:04:53 PM »
what is the hand brake? ...  I have no hand brake in my Honda Jazz Crosstar 2026.

I still can't work out if this is a wind-up. Is there really someone out there, driving a car, who doesn't know what a handbrake is or whether their car has one?

Sure, the terminology (hand- or parking-brake) might be confusing for someone who's not a native English speaker, but there's always been a legal requirement for such a device and every car will have one. The old-style lever may have been replaced by an electric switch, but it's still an independent means of ensuring the car doesn't move when stopped (and even, as others have said, stopping the car in the event of a brake failure). Read the manual?

Kremmen

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Re: Getting a MK4 perhaps.
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2026, 04:50:26 AM »
That's the one thing that was a concern for me. If you have a brake failure then you are relying on an electronic component working to bring you to a stop.

With the old lever and cable you knew you had a reliable failsafe
Let's be careful out there !

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