Mk4 2021 Jazz Brake failure

[Tox Laximus]

I went though this whole thread and found a notice about the Japan recall, this will be handy for people to print out to show their dealers in case they try to deny it.

PS. I've attached the page so you don't have to look for it.

[Jazzdriver]

Since this concerns brakes, shouldn't DVSA insist on a recall?

[Karoq]

Yesterday's Saturday Telegraph motoring section.
Anyone with Jazz/Crosstar HR-V, CR-V or Honda E 2018 -2022 contact HONDA CUSTOMER SERVICE.
I have only very basic editing tools on my laptop. To make the article legible, I had to take 3 separate pics. I hope you can all make sense of it.
Am I glad I sold my e:HEVs HR-V & CR-V

[Bristol_Crosstar]

From that article it implies all the refresh models (Elegance, Advance etc) aren't affected

[Tox Laximus]

Thanks for the article Karoq, it's useful to print out to show to stubborn honda dealers.


Have there been any accidents or near misses, do ABS and stability assist also fail with every case?

[Lord Voltermore]

Since this concerns brakes, shouldn't DVSA insist on a recall?

DVSA dont regard it as a serious fault if ,among other things, you are  warned about it by warning lights.

https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-recalls-and-faults/report-a-serious-safety-defect 

[Jazzdriver]

Since this concerns brakes, shouldn't DVSA insist on a recall?

DVSA dont regard it as a serious fault if ,among other things, you are  warned about it by warning lights.

https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-recalls-and-faults/report-a-serious-safety-defect

Yes, I had already seen that on their website, but the problem concerns brakes.  And brakes are pretty important.   Who knows what  might  happen?

We seem to be behind some  other countries.  For example, China (a huge market) has sometimes taken severe action against manufacturers, such as making them provide a warranty for a certain number of years.

[ColinB]

Yes, I had already seen that on their website, but the problem concerns brakes.  And brakes are pretty important.   Who knows what  might  happen?

I think DVSA's stance is that you get the warning of the failure before you drive, therefore it's not a safety issue. Braking performance is irrelevant if the car is stationary. Anyone who ignores that warning and drives off is just plain stupid, and you can't legislate for that. No-one has reported a failure whist driving (?), which definitely would be a safety issue.

[Tox Laximus]

Yes, I had already seen that on their website, but the problem concerns brakes.  And brakes are pretty important.   Who knows what  might  happen?

I think DVSA's stance is that you get the warning of the failure before you drive, therefore it's not a safety issue. Braking performance is irrelevant if the car is stationary. Anyone who ignores that warning and drives off is just plain stupid, and you can't legislate for that. No-one has reported a failure whist driving (?), which definitely would be a safety issue.

With our Jazz the fault came on while driving after 2 miles, later that day on our driveway the fault came on after pumping the brakes, when the AA man came the fault did not show on the dash but the pedal was going to the floor.

Intermittent faults are the worst to diagnose and can happen at any time and the cars sensors might not detect it at all.

[NoelM]

https://www.hondaeforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1568

[Lincolnshire Rambler]

I dont see how the system cannot fail during a normal braking application ?
Perhaps if the brake simulator fialures during a normal braking application the handbrake braking is applied as a fail safe? Just that itself could cause an accident as the handbrake application when driving causes a full on emergency stop…
No doubt after the first crash is reported because of a failed brake simulator the lack of UK recall by honda may change its position …

[Kremmen]

Am I getting the wrong impression ?

Looking at the posts it seems to me that failures are mostly occuring just into year 3 shortly after a brake fluid change during service ?

As posted a few times, mileage is unimportant

[Spodric]

Am I getting the wrong impression ?

Looking at the posts it seems to me that failures are mostly occuring just into year 3 shortly after a brake fluid change during service ?

As posted a few times, mileage is unimportant

Assuming that the official explanation provided by Honda Japan is correct (there is no reason to think Honda's engineers have got it wrong) internal corrosion is causing these brake simulator sensor failures to occur after about 3 years have elapsed since manufacture. The time factor seems more relevant than mileage, servicing, brake fluid change, etc.

Scheduled brake fluid change after 3 years should be regarded as correlation, not causation.

We the affected Jazz owners don't want to go down that speculative "brake fluid change" rabbit hole. The obvious consequence would be to shift responsibility for this inherent manufacturing defect away from Honda. I hold Honda directly responsible, not the supplying dealer who does my servicing.

Please desist!

[csp]

Honda UK & Honda Europe must make a formal statement & fully support existing owners of Mk4 Jazz plus other models at risk of this manufacturing fault otherwise owners will not replace their cars with another Honda!  DVLA must put pressure on Honda to do the honorable thing & recall cars as well as provide replacement cars if the fault occurs until the car has been repaired! Surely this is a legal requirement!

[Tox Laximus]

Maganged to get the article from the telegraph in whole page and segment, added recall notice.

Print and shove in the face of your honda dealer.