Author Topic: Sides of front seats splitting  (Read 144014 times)

NetworkMan

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 100
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2025 Advance
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #180 on: December 23, 2025, 03:55:51 PM »
Is this the one?

https://autocatalogarchive.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Honda-Jazz-2020-UK.pdf

Highlighted by bullet points on page 28 and again on page 30.


RuthieB

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 301
  • Country: gb
  • Fuel economy: 1348566
  • My Honda: 2021 Jazz e-HEV EX and 2020 CRV e-HEV EX
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #181 on: December 23, 2025, 05:42:07 PM »
Yes that’s exactly the same brochure albeit a different edition; mine was 05/20 and this one is 08/20 so they misrepresented the trim leather/fabric trim description in 2 editions of the brochure!

The detail, pics and pages numbers are all exactly the same it’s just the part number in the pale grey “disclaimer” that is different!
From the advert "Who knows where you’ll go?"

FMIB

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 193
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: Jazz
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #182 on: December 24, 2025, 05:29:47 AM »
Its clear the seat sides are a type of "artificial leather" and cracking within such a short period of time is not acceptable and Honda should look at how to rectify this for those owners whose cars are out of warranty, as well as future owners.(I dont believe the extended warranty from year 3 onwards covers this)
This could be done in numerous ways such as free replacement of the base to a contribution to the cost of replacement.

However, their get out of jail card is in the small print on the last page of the brochure:

These specification details do not apply to any particular product which is supplied or offered for sale. The manufacturers reserve the right to vary their specifications, including colours, with or without
notice and at such times in such manner as they think fit. Major as well as minor changes may be involved. Every effort, however, is made to ensure the accuracy of the particulars contained in this
brochure. This publication shall not constitute in any circumstances whatsoever an offer by the Company to any person. All sales are made by the Distributor or Dealer concerned subject to and with
the benefit of the standard Conditions of Sale and Warranty given by the Distributor or Dealer, copies of which may be obtained from them on request. This publicity material applies to the UK only
Trade Descriptions Act (1968). Whilst efforts are made to ensure specification accuracy, brochures are prepared and printed several months in advance of distribution and consequently cannot always
immediately reflect either changes in specification or in some isolated cases the provision of a particular feature. Customers are always advised to discuss specification details with the supplying Dealer
especially if your model selection is dependent upon one of the features advertised.

RuthieB

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 301
  • Country: gb
  • Fuel economy: 1348566
  • My Honda: 2021 Jazz e-HEV EX and 2020 CRV e-HEV EX
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #183 on: December 24, 2025, 09:24:42 AM »
Thanks FMIB

On the basis of your comment regarding the disclaimer it would appear that Honda could put anything in the brochure without any fear of reproach.
There has to be a threshold in this regard.
In this instance I believe that threshold has been exceeded and in claiming “Leather” in two brochures when Leather has never been provided in any of the mk4 models is either a major mistake or just blatant misleading deception.
It’s owners of early EX/Sr? models who are suffering the consequences of this error or deception that are now suffering the consequences having been led in the decision making process that the trim comprised of durable materials and no cheaper unfit for purpose synthetics.
My father had a Triumph Herald with vinyl seats back in the 60s and never had a problem Like this!
From the advert "Who knows where you’ll go?"

NetworkMan

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 100
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2025 Advance
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #184 on: December 24, 2025, 09:31:07 AM »
We may have discussed this before but with help from Chat GPT

can a uk company get out its responsibility under trade descriptions act by stating in the small print that the information may not be accurate?


Short answer: **No.** A UK company generally **can’t escape liability** for misleading descriptions just by adding small-print wording like *“information may not be accurate.”*

Here’s the clearer breakdown.

### Trade Descriptions Act (and what replaced it)

* The **Trade Descriptions Act 1968** made it illegal for businesses to give **false or misleading descriptions** of goods or services.
* For consumer cases today, it has mostly been **replaced by the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPRs)** — but the principle is the same.

### Why “small print” doesn’t save them

Under UK consumer law:

* A business **cannot contradict a misleading main message** with a disclaimer hidden in small print.
* If the **overall impression** given to an average consumer is misleading, the business can still be liable.
* Courts and regulators look at **what a normal customer would understand**, not just whether a disclaimer exists.

In other words:

> You can’t say “This product does X” in big letters, then quietly say “may not do X” in tiny text and expect that to cancel it out.

### When disclaimers *might* matter

Disclaimers can sometimes help **only if**:

* They are **clear, prominent, and specific**
* They **don’t directly contradict** the main claim
* They don’t mislead about something **material** (price, performance, origin, safety, etc.)

Even then, they’re not a free pass.

### Bottom line

* **Misleading descriptions are unlawful**, regardless of small-print caveats.
* **Small print does not override consumer protection law.**
* Regulators like **Trading Standards** can still take action.

If you want, you can tell me:

* what kind of product or claim you’re thinking about, or
* whether this is for homework, a real dispute, or general understanding

and I can tailor the explanation or point you to the right rules.


....This may be from an AI system but it does confirm what I suspected was the case.


NetworkMan

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 100
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2025 Advance
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #185 on: December 24, 2025, 09:38:43 AM »
A car maker claimed that the seats were part leather in the bullet points highlighting the features of the specific variant.  It turned out that it was synthetic leather and it failed after three years but less than five.

On those facts, the car maker (and usually the dealer) would **not be able to rely on small print** to get out of responsibility, and the description **“part leather”** is the key issue.

Here’s how UK consumer law looks at it.

---

## 1. Was “part leather” misleading?

Yes — **if no natural leather was used at all**.

Under UK law, a product is misleading if it gives the **average consumer** a false impression about a **material characteristic**. Upholstery material absolutely counts.

* **“Leather”** in ordinary consumer understanding means **animal hide**, not synthetic.
* Describing seats as *“part leather”* strongly implies **some genuine leather content**.
* Calling fully synthetic material “leather” (or implying it is) has repeatedly been treated as misleading by Trading Standards.

So if the seats were **entirely synthetic**, the description was almost certainly **false or misleading**, regardless of any disclaimer.

---

## 2. Why a disclaimer won’t help them

Even if the brochure or website said something like *“specifications may change”* or *“details may not be accurate”*:

* Disclaimers **cannot correct a false core description**
* Bullet-point features are treated as **prominent claims**
* The law looks at the **overall impression**, not buried caveats

A court or Trading Standards would almost certainly say:

> A consumer is entitled to rely on a clear feature list without needing to second-guess it.

---

## 3. What about the failure after 3–5 years?

This strengthens the case.

Under the **Consumer Rights Act 2015** (or Sale of Goods Act if older):

Goods must be:

* **As described**
* Of **satisfactory quality**
* **Durable**, taking account of price, description, and expectations

Car seats described as “part leather” would reasonably be expected to:

* Last **significantly longer** than 3 years
* Not degrade prematurely compared with genuine leather

If the synthetic material failed early, that supports:

* **Misdescription**, and
* **Lack of durability**

---

## 4. Time limits (important)

* Consumers can bring a claim for **up to 6 years** in England & Wales (5 in Scotland)
* After the first 6 months, the consumer must show the fault was **inherent** (e.g. poor material, misdescription)

In your scenario:

* The **misdescription itself** doesn’t “wear out”
* Evidence like brochures, specs, or archived web pages is powerful

---

## 5. Likely responsibility

Usually:

* **The dealer** is legally responsible to the consumer
* The **manufacturer’s claims** are still relevant evidence
* Trading Standards may be interested if the claim was widespread

Possible remedies (depending on age and value):

* Partial refund
* Repair or replacement contribution
* Damages reflecting the difference in value between real leather and synthetic

---

## Bottom line

* Calling fully synthetic seats **“part leather”** is very likely **misleading**
* **Small print does not protect** the seller or manufacturer
* Failure after 3–5 years strengthens the argument that the product was **not as described or durable**

If you want, I can help you:

* Frame this as a **legal argument**
* Draft a **complaint letter**
* Assess whether it’s worth **small claims court**
* Work out **what evidence matters most**

Just say which direction you want to go.

NetworkMan

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 100
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2025 Advance
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #186 on: December 24, 2025, 09:42:30 AM »
..... so you guys with faulty seats - go to it!!!

ColinB

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1554
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2015 Jazz 1.3 SE manual in Milano Red
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #187 on: December 24, 2025, 10:23:31 AM »
Another small but possibly significant point. When you bought the car, your contract was with the dealer, not directly with Honda UK. So any possible legal action can only be against the dealer. It was their error in relying on the brochure to represent the car and not pointing out to you that the material was different to the description. It's up to them, if they want to, to take action against the party who misrepresented the car to them, ie Honda UK.

Bristol_Crosstar

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 521
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2023 Jazz Advance Sport
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #188 on: December 25, 2025, 09:10:10 AM »
It appears the splitting seats issue only happens on the earlier, EX models. Has anyone had the same issue with Advance models, I haven't had any problems with my 2-year old Sport?

RuthieB

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 301
  • Country: gb
  • Fuel economy: 1348566
  • My Honda: 2021 Jazz e-HEV EX and 2020 CRV e-HEV EX
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #189 on: December 25, 2025, 09:39:13 AM »
A car maker claimed that the seats were part leather in the bullet points highlighting the features of the specific variant.  It turned out that it was synthetic leather and it failed after three years but less than five.

On those facts, the car maker (and usually the dealer) would **not be able to rely on small print** to get out of responsibility, and the description **“part leather”** is the key issue.

Here’s how UK consumer law looks at it.

---

## 1. Was “part leather” misleading?

Yes — **if no natural leather was used at all**.

Under UK law, a product is misleading if it gives the **average consumer** a false impression about a **material characteristic**. Upholstery ……..

An excellent posting here from Network Man (and also Colin B) that breathes further clarity into the circumstances and options moving forward in the situation.

Much appreciated for the an ongoing mission in the New Year!

Thanks to all our Clubjazz contributors, we got there with the Brake Feel Simiulator Module recall, sorry “Product Improvement”, let’s try and get success and a “Product Improvement “ on this seat issue.

Happy Honda Christmas!
From the advert "Who knows where you’ll go?"

coldstart

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 859
  • Country: ch
  • Fuel economy:
  • My Honda: MY24 Jazz Adv
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #190 on: December 25, 2025, 09:00:28 PM »
Shouldn't we include weight, butt-width and height of the main drivers into the equation? ;)  :D

On a more somber note: The seat's position and load could play a role!
And let's not forget about cleaning products/habbits! (aggressive cleaning products might affect the synthetic "leather" as well.)


5thcivic

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 596
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: Jazz EX e:HEV and E
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #191 on: December 26, 2025, 08:08:56 PM »
I don't have any sign of a problem yet, but if you put your fingers down the side of the hard plastic rim the synthetic comes out of is very rough on the inside, as if it's still a moulding edge that has not been smoothed.

I wonder if some matching colour thick duct tape applied neatly on the outside so you can't really see it, then over this hard plastic edge and down the inside makes the rubbing as the seat is compressed less on this coarse. scratchy inside edge?

RuthieB

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 301
  • Country: gb
  • Fuel economy: 1348566
  • My Honda: 2021 Jazz e-HEV EX and 2020 CRV e-HEV EX
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #192 on: December 27, 2025, 08:25:40 PM »
I think that in the vast majority of instances the cracking / splitting/ delaminating pattern happens above that plastic area and isn’t caused by abrasion.

Affected owners may want to try using the door lock hasp as a handle/ push off point to lever themselves out of the car to avoid compression of the bolster cushion…..?

From the advert "Who knows where you’ll go?"

Lord Voltermore

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3275
  • Country: gb
  • Fuel economy: 66.6 mpg
  • My Honda: 2024 advance
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #193 on: December 28, 2025, 09:55:08 AM »
The inner edges of the rigid side panel are quite sharp, which might cause some abrasion or cuts. But I think its made worse by how tightly the plastic panel grips  the fabric  (shame on you Honda for calling it  'leather' in advertising >:( )

 When you put weight on the side bolster  the' leather effect material'  tends to get squashed deeper behind the side panel .   When weight is released the  inherent springiness of the seat cushion returning to its original shape has to pull any extra  side material  now tightly  trapped behind the side panel  by physically pulling on the 'leather' ( :P) and it rips/tears along  lines of weakness. 

I think the manufacturers tried to solve this by using a Buffalo hide principals. Thicker Real  leather is stronger.  But thicker PVC imitation  leather merely has a thicker coating of pvc  to split.

In the spirit of Christmas I will reveal my latest scientific research  on this subject.   My Daughters 'Velcro dog' greyhound spent a lot of time on the sofa having her soft  thin leather belly affectionally stroked.  Nice and supple.     Also when my own   belly needed to expand due to   excessive  food consumption I had  to loosen my belt  to release  my trapped shirt.   The solution is seats more like jogging bottoms than corsets.  Simples.  ;D   Seasons greetings everyone. :-*
   
My IQ test came back negative

5thcivic

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 596
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: Jazz EX e:HEV and E
Re: Sides of front seats splitting
« Reply #194 on: December 29, 2025, 07:39:06 PM »
Like I said I don't have the probelm yet, but from the pictures here the rips are in exactly the position the PVC would be when compressed with the weight of a person. And we all can shift from side to side somewhat in the car even if imperceptibly when cornering or braking which could worsen the wear.

Tags:
 

Back to top