Pre-existing transmission fault

[guest6440]

Hello everyone, I would imagine that this has been asked before, but I wondered if anyone could help.

I bought my 2005 Honda Jazz with full service history at 31,000miles. She has now done 43,000miles and the gearbox is packing up. I bought this car on finance 14 months ago as it was recommended as a reliable model, as I work with people that have disabilities and it was vital that I had a reliable car.

The car started making noises underneath and, as she was on a recall for airbags, I asked them to have a look. Gearbox is going, they said. I couldn't believe it! I can't afford to get that car repaired. I called Honda UK and they muttered something about a good will gesture and haven't heard anything since. The garage I bought it from want over £1000 to fix it. The finance company need proof that the fault was there to start with. The transmission repair company I called said they had seen lots of these vehicles with it and Honda are denying all knowledge.

Can anyone suggest a lead so I can pursue this with Honda? They know there is a problem there. In all other respects the Jazz is a super little car and I would have continued to upgrade with that model, but not if I am going to get problems like this. The power of dreams. More like the power of nightmares!!

If anyone can help I would really appreciate it. Thank you

[culzean]

http://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=97.msg9351#msg9351

Plenty on this forum about gearbox whine,  comes down to a single bearing in the gearbox,  the box may be noisy but it will never fail.  Some people have had luck with molyslip quietening it down.  This bearing is more likely to go on cars that have spent a lot of time in traffic in the lower gears as this puts extra strain on the bearings,  my Wifes MK1 (which did mainly local miles) was making a little noise at about 50K, only had it replaced at around 80K when it got very noticeable  (not replaced by Honda,  cost £500 ) my MK1 which I moved on at over 110K had spent more time on main roads and was still OK when I traded it in. Strange thing is the garage showed me the bearing,  it spun OK and didn't make a noise,  but it is a thrust bearing (helical gears are quieter but put end thrust on the gearbox shafts) so pitting was more than likely on thrust face.  I have always used Molyslip in gearbox, but it is more of a prevention than a cure once the bearing starts to make a noise.

I don't think Honda will be interested in 2005 model though unfortunately - other members have had it repaired for less than £500 though,  search for noisy gearbox or just gearbox on this forum.

[guest3823]

I had my gearbox get very loud in first and second gear. It was an input shaft bearing or something.

I called around a few garages. Most places were not interested without me coming in and them doing an assessment for a charge.

I spoke to my regular garage where I get my servicing and MOT done. He told me that he does not do that work but he told me the place to go in Norwich. He said that even the main dealer will probably just take out the gearbo and send it to him.

It did cost £700 ish to fix. 

The Local Honda dealer did give me a ball park figure of over £1000 as they had done one recently.

Sadly it is a common problem. The place I took it, back in June, had already done 6 Jazz's that year.

[guest6440]

Thank you Jem and Culzean for the information. I will look into your suggestions. I can't believe that Honda have their head in the sand over this. It makes me not want to buy a Honda in the future, in case this happens again. Lots of money and very bad customer service from Honda UK. 

[guest1372]

What does this noise sound like?  Dry gears / like water flowing in a pipe / a low frequency drone?
Is it noticeable in it's early stages by revving it or listening to an idling engine with the bonnet up, in neutral and dis/engaging the clutch?

It would be nice to know how to spot the early stages of this, both as an owner and for a potential purchaser.
--
TG

[madasafish]

Thank you Jem and Culzean for the information. I will look into your suggestions. I can't believe that Honda have their head in the sand over this. It makes me not want to buy a Honda in the future, in case this happens again. Lots of money and very bad customer service from Honda UK. 

NO maker in the world will offer free repairs on a car 10 years old.. Try it on a Ford after 3 years and one month ... and they will laugh at you.

[guest3823]

I believe they extended the warranty on them because of the problem but I think they stipulated that it have to have a full dealer service history.

The noise I had was a whine when moving off in first and then in second. It got less as the speed increased.

It was a real noticeable whine a bit like the whine you get when you reverse fast.

[culzean]

Thank you Jem and Culzean for the information. I will look into your suggestions. I can't believe that Honda have their head in the sand over this. It makes me not want to buy a Honda in the future, in case this happens again. Lots of money and very bad customer service from Honda UK. 

NO maker in the world will offer free repairs on a car 10 years old.. Try it on a Ford after 3 years and one month ... and they will laugh at you.

I agree, they did extend period to 7 years I think, which they did not have to do except as goodwill gesture , other makers would have told you to go take a jump.

[guest5505]

I've been quoted £300 to £350 to fix mine

Just keep running it and save up for the repair. It's annoying for sure but it's an 11 year old car so you can expect the odd problem

[Rory]

A big bill is depressing but the Government was paying people to scrap car at 8yrs old a few years ago - expecting any manufacturer to chip in on an 11yr old car is unrealistic.  The other thing is that what many manufacturers do on less old cars is maybe offer 50% goodwill - but the franchise dealer's repair price will be 2x what an independant garage could do the repair for.

One of our cars is 12yrs old and I'm well aware that the next fault will probably render it an economic write-off.

[culzean]

A big bill is depressing but the Government was paying people to scrap car at 8yrs old a few years ago - expecting any manufacturer to chip in on an 11yr old car is unrealistic.  The other thing is that what many manufacturers do on new cars is maybe offer 50% goodwill - but the franchise dealer's repair price will be 2x what an independant garage could do the repair for.

One of our cars is 12yrs old and I'm well aware that the next fault will probably render it an economic write-off.

When main dealers charge £80 an hour labour the bill soon mounts up (the actual bearing parts cost very little, but getting the gearbox out on a front drive car is a pain ( I have done clutches and gearboxes on Rear drive cars and it is easy-peasy).  Independent garages are probably half that hourly rate.  The extra dealer cost is for the coffee and the quick clean your car gets + the 'overheads' of more non-productive staff.

[guest6440]

Hi all and thank you for your posts. The noise that is coming from the gear box, is not a whine. It sounds like a rotating noise that shouldn't be there  ( I know that sounds a bit odd). It has become more noticeable since the Honda Garage took a look at it. You notice a difference in the sound when you put the clutch in and out.

[guest6441]

I had the same problem on my 2005 1.2, it started whining at about 50,000 miles and quickly deteriorated to a growl within a couple of thousand miles. I took it to a local transmission repair shop and they effected the repair within a couple of days for £600. They were not surprised to see a Jazz in the repair shop and seemed very familiar with the issue.

[guest5505]

Hi all and thank you for your posts. The noise that is coming from the gear box, is not a whine. It sounds like a rotating noise that shouldn't be there  ( I know that sounds a bit odd). It has become more noticeable since the Honda Garage took a look at it. You notice a difference in the sound when you put the clutch in and out.

I think you need to have the problem diagnosed by a small local independent garage you can trust. Try to use someone who is recommended to you.

The guy I use is just a one man band in my village. He will remove the gearbox and send it off to a gearbox specialist for fixing.

[guest6230]

It's a well known fault on Honda gearboxes affecting both Jazz and Civics. Here's how to repair it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDuuzzORk4c

On eBay there are repair shops that specialise in replacing input shaft bearings and can do it in a day. Unfortunately to get at the bearing you have to tear the box apart.