Honda Jazz 2008 ABS Problem - [SOLVED]

[hemant007]

Greetings, I recently bought an old Honda Jazz, hoping that it would be nice car.
However it has ABS light on, and I am hoping I can sort it out with help from great people on this forum.

This is what I have tried so far:
1) disconnected negative terminal from Battery, waited for an hour before reconnecting - ABS light still on.
2) under bonnet, the fuse box suggest 40A is for ABS, so I checked continuity using multimeter, which is fine, should I be checking any other fuses inside the car?
3) With ignition on (without starting engine) I tried to hear the ABS pump - I can hear it slowly, no vibration even rouching screw driver - If I can hear pump rotating does that mean pump is fine or there is possibility it may not be working as it should ?

I think next step is to check the sensors for which I should get a scanner to check which sensor I should be checking, do I need to take out wheel to be able to check sensor wire and sensor or is there any other simpler way ?

Please suggest what else I should be checking, any simple steps before trying more complex checks ?
Many thank in advance.

[cavosavosk]

Scanner is best to pull fault codes. Though you need some fancier one which can access ABS, i had it done for 20€ with his Honda HDS unit. Generally there can be only 2 type of codes there.

Either some short circuit code to the ground, that generally directs your attention to the ABS module under the bonnet (in my case it was busted brushes on the DC motor) or a code for a wheel sensor.

Quick test without scanner can be done with multimeter, i did it with my electrician friend. We pulled out the connector going to the module and checked voltages or resistance/continuity on it. I dont know much about that (i am mechanical engineer, not an electrical engineer ), i only got told that everything shall be good on the sensor side and that the issue might be the electronics in the ABS module or the DC motor.

[hemant007]

(in my case it was busted brushes on the DC motor)

Thank you, Is it possible to take out the motor part only to change brushes without disconnecting all the brake lines / take out whole thing ?

[cavosavosk]

(in my case it was busted brushes on the DC motor)

Thank you, Is it possible to take out the motor part only to change brushes without disconnecting all the brake lines / take out whole thing ?

Yes, i described it in another post on forum, should be below this one

[hemant007]

Scanner is best to pull fault codes. Though you need some fancier one which can access ABS, i had it done for 20€ with his Honda HDS unit. Generally there can be only 2 type of codes there.

Either some short circuit code to the ground, that generally directs your attention to the ABS module under the bonnet (in my case it was busted brushes on the DC motor) or a code for a wheel sensor.

Hi, using the scanner, I am getting this error:

53-1 ABS motor pump relay short circuit

I checked ABS fuse, but can't find any relay in fuse box, is there any ?
should I still give it a try with brushes replacement or Can this be pump circuit problem inside pump ? So I should look for whole pump replacement?

[hemant007]

I also wanted to check what is the exact size of brushes I should buy and the length of copper wire so I can buy before opening the motor and hopefully finish the job same time. thank you

[cavosavosk]

Hi, motor pump short circuit code is most definetly the brushes being busted (and also rotor is dirty at the mating surface where it meets those brushes, you would see it if you disassemble the motor).

I wouldnt look for new pump just yet, you can drive the car even if the motor is separated from the pump (i did it like that for a day) of course you want to cover the hole somehow, tape or a piece of plastic bag, Up to you

Regarding the size of those brushes, i literally just took them out (i had em in small plastic bag) and brought to a nearby store specialized in hobby electronics, motors and such. They gave me similar sized ones which needed to be sanded down a bit.

If you don't think you gonna be able to split the motor apart, i would suggest finding a shop which specializes in brush DC motors and can do the brush change for you.

[hemant007]

Thank you, I am going to try replacing the brushes :-)
I have ordered ABS pump brushes which are 5x5x 13 mm - will I have to sand it to 10mm ?

[hemant007]

They gave me similar sized ones which needed to be sanded down a bit.

I have ordered ABS pump brushes which are 5x5x 13 mm - will I have to sand it to 10mm ?

[hemant007]

Greetings, I took out the pump motor but not sure how to open to access the brushes for replacing.
Attached photo of pump, Please advise how ?
 Thank you

[hemant007]

I tried to test the motor, by quick probe tester, it does rotate, so can it still have brushes problem ? Please advise.
How do I open this pump shown in photo to change brushes?
Looking forward to advise, thank you

[cavosavosk]

Hello! Sorry for the late reply.

I said above that i am NOT SURE on the size of the brushes, i did it like 6 months ago...

Regarding splitting of the motor, i pried off the black metal cover from the metal plate with a screwdriver iirc, and then we were doing it in a vice, holding the metal plate in vice and hammering out the shaft from bearing... Its hard to explain how to do it over a text message for me (as i am not a natural english speaker). So i rather suggest taking to some local repair shop which can do the refurbish for you.

Regarding on how should the motor spin, i am attaching a video link on how our motor was spinning after we fixed it. It should be really strong and you shall not be able to stop it by hand.

https://youtube.com/shorts/Rrg0vzS163I?si=4-HHMghpfmChuWoL

[hemant007]

I could open the motor, and changed the brushes,
Problem solved, ABS light is gone.
Many thanks for all your help, and guidance.

[cavosavosk]

Awesome, glad it helped.

I suggest a bit of hard braking to let the motor spin so you test it thoroughly

[hemant007]

Thank you,
for others benefit, the ABS pump motor brushes size needs to be 4 x 4.5 x 10 mm -
If you buy bigger, you can sand it carefully.

To take out the ABS pump motor - open nuts using 4mm hex / allen key,
Mark the alignment of metal plate with black housing so you know where it sits,
then to take out the metal plate, you have to pry off using small screw driver, the magnets are holding them in black pump body, 
I did not separate the bearing from shaft - to take out old brushes - there is a small white clip at the end of housing for brush which is holding brush with spring in place, so I removed the white clip, then spring and brush comes out,
I cut the copper wire of worn brushes, inserted new brushes and soldered the copper wire of the brushes.

Then we put back things together, the 2 washers on the back of shaft needs to be put as per picture on other post ( https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=10794.0 ) -
bigger one first with wings facing in and then small ring on top, then close the black lid carefully, and press plate (align the plate in place before pressing).
You may want to test the motor with 12v dc.

Now to put the motor back in the car to rest of the ABS pump body, you have to carefully align the centre and connection pins, I observed the middle shaft is NOT straight pin with exact centre, you have to observe carefully and align before pushing the motor in.
finally Install 4mm nuts.