Author Topic: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts  (Read 373 times)

bill888

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 231
  • Country: gb
Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« on: February 22, 2021, 11:36:22 AM »
I'm looking to replace the front brake discs, and looking for any advice or tips on what extra tools I may need to buy to undo the 17mm caliper carrier bolts.  The bolts haven't been touched in 13 years and there is usual surface rust from UK weathering.  Google search indicates they are tightened to 80 lb ft (110 Nm), same as wheel nuts, at the factory, but they will need far more to undo the rusty bolts imho.

Will I have to resort to using a dirty great long breaker bar like in this video?
https://youtu.be/Xqv9ZlEyi_8

I don't have access to any air powered tools.

Longest wrench I possess is 16" torque wrench.   I did briefly try hammering the end of a 9" fixed bar ('T' bar?) handle attached to a 17mm socket with a wooden mallet, but all it did was 'bounce'.

Thanks in advance.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2021, 12:19:27 PM by bill888 »
2007(57) Jazz 1.4SE CVT-7 (GE3 - made in China)

olduser1

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1290
  • Country: 00
  • My Honda: Jazz EX 2015 CVT Elite Pack
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2021, 11:55:11 AM »
Plenty of  plusgas leave overnight try again then if still stuck more plusgas allow to dry off apply heat. Plusgas is flammable.

Jocko

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 6937
  • Country: scotland
  • Fuel economy:
  • My Honda: 2006 GD5 Jazz 1.2 i-DSi S in Vivid Blue Pearl
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2021, 12:07:11 PM »
Use this style of socket.



Not this kind.


sparky Paul

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3034
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2015 GG6 Jazz EX 1.4 I-VTEC / 2008 GE3 Jazz SE 1.4 i-DSI
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2021, 12:14:53 PM »
They'll be a lot harder to shift than wheel nuts if they haven't been off for a long time. You can sometimes shift them with a " ratchet and a bit of humpty, but a 2ft breaker bar makes it easy if they're stubborn. Watch your knuckles if you try with the ratchet.

Pipe on a t-bar handle may also get you out of a hole, if you don't have any particular affection for your t-bar.

+1 for 6 point sockets. At least Honda fit real hex bolts, and not external torx or splined bolts as some manufacturers fit.

Breaker bar is a handy tool for carriers, and essential for driveshaft/hub nuts and subframe bolts.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2021, 12:18:04 PM by sparky Paul »

bill888

  • Topic Starter
  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 231
  • Country: gb
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2021, 12:32:35 PM »
Thanks for all the suggestions so far.   Earlier, I was trying to use a crappy old 9" T-bar with 12 pt 1/2" socket (no available pipe to extend the handle).

I have a newer set of half decent 6 pt sockets but only in 3/8".

Basically, I need Plusgas, 6 pt 1/2" socket set, and a 2ft 1/2" breaker bar.

I had a quick look on Halfords website and surprised they don't seem to sell long breaker bars.  Toolstation and Amazon have some for less than 20 quid or is that false economy?

Draper 600mm for 17 ?
https://www.toolstation.com/draper-breaker-bar/p72665

Update: My local Toolstation and FFX are out of stock of the Draper.  Ordered a 14 Sealey AK730 600mm from FFX - different knuckle design.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2021, 03:53:27 PM by bill888 »
2007(57) Jazz 1.4SE CVT-7 (GE3 - made in China)

sparky Paul

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3034
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2015 GG6 Jazz EX 1.4 I-VTEC / 2008 GE3 Jazz SE 1.4 i-DSI
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2021, 01:04:03 PM »
I had a quick look on Halfords website and surprised they don't seem to sell long breaker bars.  Toolstation and Amazon have some for less than 20 quid or is that false economy?

Draper 600mm for 17 ?
https://www.toolstation.com/draper-breaker-bar/p72665

I think the one I use day to day is a Draper like those at Toolstation, and it's done everything I've asked of it. I managed to break the knuckle on a " Britool bar I had at work, it did get some abuse though. Replaced it with a Teng, which I still have.

If the bolt heads are clean and not corroded, you may get away with a 12 point socket, but 6 point are always preferable on tight stuff.

Carrier bolts should be studlocked, so heat is usually preferable to penetrating oil, but a breaker should do the job without either.

olduser1

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1290
  • Country: 00
  • My Honda: Jazz EX 2015 CVT Elite Pack
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2021, 04:08:35 PM »
I find a 3' length of tubing helps, at a pinch off cut from scaffolding can provide the key. Still favour a dose of plusgas overnight.

embee

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 61
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2018 Jazz SE CVT
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2021, 04:25:04 PM »
Machine Mart Pro range of tools is a lot better than you might think, I have been pleasantly surprised. They have a wide range of breaker bars
https://www.machinemart.co.uk/categories/?search=breaker%20bar

An alternative approach would be an impact driver, again MM have a range
https://www.machinemart.co.uk/categories/?search=impact+driver&Brand=Clarke
Cordless are way more convenient but if you don't already have cordless tools it's a bigger outlay. They also have 240V versions which work well, I've used their 450Nm version before.
I have pneumatic and cordless Makita impact wrenches to cover most eventualities, cordless is most convenient by far if you're using one at all regularly, if not the corded ones are fine.
If using an impact wrench you do really need to use impact sockets, "regular" sockets can and do break with a powerful impact driver. You can always use impact sockets with hand tools, so might be worth considering anyway. I picked up a Halfords set with a voucher a couple of years ago and they have been very good.

Just some thoughts. It depends a bit how you view investments in tools.

bill888

  • Topic Starter
  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 231
  • Country: gb
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2021, 06:22:32 PM »
@olduser1, sadly no scaffold pole or iron pipe available to me unless I was to go and buy it.

@embee, I didn't know you could buy 'corded' impact wrenches which are more affordable.

« Last Edit: February 22, 2021, 06:26:19 PM by bill888 »
2007(57) Jazz 1.4SE CVT-7 (GE3 - made in China)

sparky Paul

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3034
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2015 GG6 Jazz EX 1.4 I-VTEC / 2008 GE3 Jazz SE 1.4 i-DSI
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2021, 08:09:22 PM »
I didn't know you could buy 'corded' impact wrenches which are more affordable.

Those impact drivers work surprisingly well, even the cheap ones. Ideal for the DIYer that isn't going to be using it every day, and being corded isn't usually an issue. The only problem is that you can't always get them onto awkward bolts if access is tight.

A breaker bar is cheap, and works - that's the only reason I recommend them. You don't need impact sockets either.

bill888

  • Topic Starter
  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 231
  • Country: gb
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2021, 08:20:26 PM »
I was looking at various Youtube videos.  The Lidl Parkside corded 450 C3 1/2" impact driver offers 320 Nm loosening torque and lower 100 Nm tightening torque, sold mainly for 'undoing' wheel nuts.  All for 35 quid with some sockets too.  Whether a local Lidl offers them for sale is another matter.

I did note these corded impact drivers seem to be quite big (long).

450 C3
https://youtu.be/BgNnWQP0_hA

Newer 50 corded model is 550 A1 compared to a cordless 400Nm model
https://youtu.be/X09_LPV3Nhw

Cordless 70 400Nm Parkside vs 200+ 250Nm Bosch
https://youtu.be/Cns9pL3g6dY
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 06:30:12 AM by bill888 »
2007(57) Jazz 1.4SE CVT-7 (GE3 - made in China)

sparky Paul

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3034
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2015 GG6 Jazz EX 1.4 I-VTEC / 2008 GE3 Jazz SE 1.4 i-DSI
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2021, 08:32:19 PM »
They can be a bit bulky, hence the comment. Fine if you're doing something straight on, such as wheel nuts or carrier bolts, but not always helpful around the suspension.

I think most of these cheap Chinese ones are pretty much the same, they pop up periodically around that price in the discount supermarket 'middle aisles', and cash & carry places. Once they've sold the ones they have allotted to each store, that's it until next time.

UKjim

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 157
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2005 Jazz SE CVT
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2021, 09:20:47 PM »
Can someone recommend a reasonably priced cordless impact wrench which would be good enough for wheel nut removal etc?

sparky Paul

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3034
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2015 GG6 Jazz EX 1.4 I-VTEC / 2008 GE3 Jazz SE 1.4 i-DSI
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2021, 09:42:48 PM »
Can someone recommend a reasonably priced cordless impact wrench which would be good enough for wheel nut removal etc?

Depends what you consider reasonable, some of the branded battery ones are very pricey.

The cheapest end of the market, Lidl also do a 20V battery version which uses the 20V battery that fits all sorts of power tools and garden implements. When they have them, they are around 60 - similar ones from other retailers are usually 80+

Lots of reviews online, and videos on youtube.

embee

  • Approved Member
  • *
  • Posts: 61
  • Country: gb
  • My Honda: 2018 Jazz SE CVT
Re: Any advice for undoing caliper carrier bolts
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2021, 11:44:56 PM »
Top brand cordless tools with Li-ion batteries are now very good. The fundamental issue is that you really need to carefully decide which brand to sign up to. The batteries are probably the most significant part of the investment, and once you decide on your brand you're more or less committed to that for all your tools.

Personally I'm with Makita, but Bosch, De Walt, and Milwaukee are all reliable good quality stuff with pretty big range of tools. I still have some 3Ah batteries which are nearly 10yrs old, one is getting a bit tired but still usable. The problem I've seen with other folk who have used for example Ryobi is that not only are the tools much less robust but the batteries don't last, a couple of years and they are shot.

If you only want one specific tool then it's a different matter. If you are likely to want more cordless tools then I'd always recommend paying the extra for the big name stuff, see what the tradespeople use for the evidence. There are some good online retailers of the big brands at fair prices, very often 10 or 20% less than the well known outlets. You can save big money by getting bare tools (no case, no battery, no charger etc) once you have the basic kit.

Some retailers I've had good deals from are https://www.lawson-his.co.uk/ , https://www.ffx.co.uk/https://www.howetools.co.uk/
No commercial connection, just good service experience.

Tags:
 

anything
Back to top