Author Topic: End of the all petrol jazz  (Read 1435 times)

Jazz999

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End of the all petrol jazz
« on: February 24, 2020, 08:01:56 PM »
Well folks, have spoken to 4 different dealerships today, and they all confirm to my suprise that Honda will not be selling the all petrol jazz alongside the hybrid.. when they gone, they gone.  I thought they may continue to provide the all petrol cars over the next 12 months at least, until they get a good feel of sales of hybrid .  So all you jazz lovers, get used to the idea of having an automatic . I for one won't be going to hybrid anytime soon, paying out lots of extra cash for petrol and battery.  I just bought a new EX last week, and will run it into the ground now, so at least Honda won't be getting my new car money every two years. Shame really, I am a big Jazz fan
I guess Honda must be hoping that all its current owners are going to buy honda hybrid jazz for the next vehicle. Good luck with that Honda
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 08:13:23 PM by Jazz999 »

Jocko

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2020, 08:15:43 PM »
I have never bought a new car (the newest I ever owned was three-year-old). My current Jazz will be 14 later this year. If you keep your EX for 14 years you will just be in time to buy a Hybrid before it becomes illegal to sell them in the UK (unless they change the cut off to 2032 as has been mooted).
After driving automatics for 25 years, before this Jazz, I would be happy to go to another auto, as long as it is not a CVT.

Jazz999

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2020, 08:28:40 PM »
Yes will I hope it lasts me 14 years, then I won't need to buy a car at all, with all the money I will save over the next 14 years, I will use a taxi everytime I go out and still be quids in. Automatics never been my thing, and never will be.

monkeydave

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2020, 08:46:11 PM »
they are going to be sorry, i change my car quite regular but now i bought this jazz as its the last petrol 6 speed manual and i will be keeping it for a very long time

so i think they will loose quite a bit of money if they are all cvt hybrids starting at £18.5k

the 2022 euro 7 doesnt help either as well as the jumping around with banning dates from 2040 to 2035 to 2032

somehow i cant ever see electric cars taking over the 35 million normal cars in this country with the amount of people living in flats and terrace houses unable to charge at night

they are going the right way of destroying the car industry but that is the plan isnt it? stop private mobility for the plebs, these greenies have a lot to answer for
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 08:53:07 PM by monkeydave »

trebor1652

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2020, 09:26:21 PM »

Jazz999

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2020, 09:51:39 PM »
Yes I think they find out the hard way. Even though the write up says they expect a dip in sales during launch period, they expecting it to pick back up, but I think they may find out that life isn't how you think it may turn out. 18 grand for entry level..hahaha, just wait a couple of years until all the ports are full of un sold hybrids, and they will be heavily discounted just to make space

Rory

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2020, 10:04:07 PM »
Honda seem to be really struggling right across Europe.   The Honda e is getting quite a good reception and might turn out to be a bit of a cult car.  Honda better hope so!

MartinJG

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2020, 10:15:47 PM »
I think it is quite possible and feasible that we will see a scenario in the future where battery 'top ups' are purchased at your local fuel station. They already have the facilities and logistical advantages in place to provide a retail service and a ready prepared fast charge 'battery pack swap' makes sense to me for a number of reasons. Much of the recharging could be carried out overnight at lower rates at a special facility rather than just going up in smoke at the power stations and would simply be delivered to the fuel station. Clearly, the manufacturers will have to come to an industry standard generic specification. I am sure Shell 'Et Al' will be delighted to oblige. What is more, subject to the usual stringent safety standards, they will be forced to compete both in terms of price and quality/technology. Seems really quite straightforward to me. I see no sensible reason why this country could not be at the forefront of such a logical development.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 10:21:45 PM by MartinJG »

ColinB

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2020, 10:27:06 PM »
I think it is quite possible and feasible that we will see a scenario in the future where battery 'top ups' are purchased at your local fuel station. They already have the facilities and logistical advantages in place to provide a retail service and a ready prepared fast charge 'battery pack swap' makes sense to me for a number of reasons. Much of the recharging could be carried out overnight at lower rates at a special facility rather than just going up in smoke at the power stations and would simply be delivered to the fuel station. Clearly, the manufacturers will have to come to an industry standard generic specification. I am sure Shell 'Et Al' will be delighted to oblige. What is more, subject to the usual stringent safety standards, they will be forced to compete both in terms of price and quality/technology. Seems really quite straightforward to me. I see no sensible reason why this country could not be at the forefront of such a logical development.
There is already competition in the EV charging market, but the indications are that this is not necessarily resulting in benefits to the motorist:
https://www.whatcar.com/news/electric-vehicle-charging-%E2%80%93-what-does-it-really-cost/n16833
No reason to believe that'll improve in future, so if you don't have the ability to charge at home, you'll get ripped off.

MartinJG

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2020, 10:36:43 PM »
I think it is quite possible and feasible that we will see a scenario in the future where battery 'top ups' are purchased at your local fuel station. They already have the facilities and logistical advantages in place to provide a retail service and a ready prepared fast charge 'battery pack swap' makes sense to me for a number of reasons. Much of the recharging could be carried out overnight at lower rates at a special facility rather than just going up in smoke at the power stations and would simply be delivered to the fuel station. Clearly, the manufacturers will have to come to an industry standard generic specification. I am sure Shell 'Et Al' will be delighted to oblige. What is more, subject to the usual stringent safety standards, they will be forced to compete both in terms of price and quality/technology. Seems really quite straightforward to me. I see no sensible reason why this country could not be at the forefront of such a logical development.
There is already competition in the EV charging market, but the indications are that this is not necessarily resulting in benefits to the motorist:
https://www.whatcar.com/news/electric-vehicle-charging-%E2%80%93-what-does-it-really-cost/n16833
No reason to believe that'll improve in future, so if you don't have the ability to charge at home, you'll get ripped off.

Competition has never done anyone any harm. Besides, it should keep the greenies happy, assuming that is at all possible or even desirable... :)

PS - Re the article linked, if I am right, these charging stations will be phased out entirely.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 10:38:37 PM by MartinJG »

John A

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2020, 06:41:37 AM »
My 2016 Jazz is the first automatic car I've owned, apart from the revs not rising directly in response to road speed when accelerating, and not having to use a clutch, I've not had to adapt my driving style to it. Driving a 6 speed manual version I seemed to be changing gear all the time to keep the engine in a sweet spot, not a worry with the automatic.

But, the current prices don't give me an economic reason to change, and the environmental impact of bringing a new car onto the roads must be close to any savings due to the reduced fuel consumption. So I'll wait a couple of years and pay about half the new cost just like I did with my current car  :)

ColinB

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2020, 07:57:10 AM »
PS - Re the article linked, if I am right, these charging stations will be phased out entirely.

I assume you mean that you think battery swapping will be the way forward and hence there’ll be no need for charging points?
Maybe:
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/big-reads/power-shift-battery-swapping-our-way-across-china
That’s one manufacturer building their own battery swap infrastructure for their own cars. I have no idea whether £23 for a new battery is expensive in China, but you can bet it wouldn’t be that cheap in Europe, so my original point - that EV motoring won’t necessarily be cheap without home charging - still seems valid.
But what are the chances of every single EV manufacturer agreeing to standardise on a universal battery design? None of the proponents have done that so far:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charging_station (Scroll down to the section on battery swapping)
Interesting that the EV market leader (Tesla) started down this road but has given up, and at least one of the other start-ups has gone bust.
So it would be nice if the charging & range anxiety problems could be solved by swapping the batteries out, but the omens are not good.

culzean

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2020, 08:25:52 AM »
Problem with swopping batteries,  you may take care of yours and when you swop you end up with an older battery that has been ragged and neglected ( like maybe even being left on someones driveway fully charged all the time - which is a killer for Li-Ion chemistry ).  Most BEV are built around the battery anyway,  and they are large and very heavy and not easily removed - and the chances of car makers agreeing on a standard is remote.   The reason why the idea of using BEV batteries to store grid power is really bad is that it subjects the battery to many more charge and discharge cycles than it would normally see,  and that degrades the battery.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

culzean

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2020, 08:29:13 AM »
Honda seem to be really struggling right across Europe.   The Honda e is getting quite a good reception and might turn out to be a bit of a cult car.  Honda better hope so!

Europe has always been a tiny market for Honda - with UK probably their best in this neck of the woods. The USA, Japan and Asia are their key markets,  where they are respected for their engineering and styling....
« Last Edit: February 25, 2020, 08:47:02 AM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: End of the all petrol jazz
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2020, 09:13:20 AM »
Fully Charged did a live event in Texas, and though heavily US-centric it was quite interesting in their views on Tesla and the viability of the "old school" car manufacturers. Their view was that Ford, GM, VW and the like would have to merge or go out of business as the world changes to BEV vehicles. There was one European voice in the audience, but the panel was not really for listening.
Regarding battery swapping. I think it may happen if the technology doesn't overtake it, but not in this century.



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