Author Topic: Bar inside of rear axle loose  (Read 304 times)

tarnbrae

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Bar inside of rear axle loose
« on: April 12, 2019, 12:47:27 PM »
Hi all,

New to the forum but have tried a search and can't seem to find anything.

I have been hearing a metallic knocking noise from the rear of the car for a while and after a few trips to the garage we have found the source of the noise to be the lateral bar running the width of the car in the rear axle within the rear axle.

I'm afraid i'm not technical enough to know what this part is called or what it does! And neither are the Honda garage up the road it seems.

Does anyone know what this could be and if it may have any nasty side effects as the car seems to drive normally at the moment.

The bar is only visibile when looking at the rear axle from front to back, as it sits right within the 'U' shape of the rear axle beam. In the centre of the car there is a rectangular box section which this bar passed through. And it seems to be loose only on one side.

One again any help or knowledge would be appreciated!

Thanks


Jocko

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2019, 02:52:42 PM »


There should be nothing loose. It sounds like the beam axle has snapped.

JazzyB

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2019, 03:33:53 PM »
Surprised to hear the Honda garage doesn't know what it is

Anyway it's a torsion bar to control the amount of flexing in the rear end

Iirc when I was last under my car there was some movement in that very bar but not the noise you describe

Jocko

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2019, 04:09:01 PM »
The entire back axle acts as an anti roll bar. It should be fixed both ends.

culzean

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2019, 05:46:07 PM »
The entire back axle acts as an anti roll bar. It should be fixed both ends.

+1

Exactly so, the whole of the rear beam is self contained and called a 'torsion beam' and I have never noticed any extra bars when I have been under the car. It does not need any anti-roll bars as the two back wheels are already linked together by it, unlike the front wheels which would be free to do their own thing if not for anti-roll bar.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

tarnbrae

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2019, 07:39:08 PM »
Thanks for your replies.



Not the most exciting vid ever but at 1:05 in the above video resembles the section which is moving. I reckon that the torsion bar has maybe cracked then. A part which I dont think can be bought/replaced.




Jocko

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2019, 09:08:13 PM »
You could get a rear axle from a scrap dealer.

Jocko

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2019, 06:42:01 AM »
I was thinking about what I would do under these circumstances (may come to pass as I have a rattle from back end I have never been able to identify). I would take it to my local blacksmith/welder and have him TIG weld it for me. He could do that in situ, with little heat and chance of damage to surrounding components. Maybe not as good as replacing the axle but better than it flapping about, loose.

sparky Paul

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2019, 08:39:17 AM »
I was thinking about what I would do under these circumstances (may come to pass as I have a rattle from back end I have never been able to identify). I would take it to my local blacksmith/welder and have him TIG weld it for me.

I'm guessing the OP's bar has snapped inside, or near to, the damper in the middle, or possibly at the end where it turns down the trailing arm. I'm not sure any weld would hold long as this bar is subject to a lot of torsion. The bar acts like as a strengthener to the beam axle, effectively an anti-roll bar, limiting the twist on the u-shaped section, and in particular saving the welds from fatigue.

Honda garage don't know what it is?  ???

Personally, I would go for a secondhand axle as per Jocko's original suggestion, it's not that big a job to do.

For yours Jocko, a rattle from the rear axle is sometimes the centre damper that has failed, this is just bolt on.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2019, 08:43:51 AM by sparky Paul »

Jocko

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #9 on: April 15, 2019, 11:15:37 AM »
A dynamic axle damper. Never even knew that was there. Is that not what used to be called a "Bump stop"?

sparky Paul

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2019, 12:14:51 PM »
A dynamic axle damper. Never even knew that was there. Is that not what used to be called a "Bump stop"?

I think that 'damper' (no.s 2 & 10 in the diagram) is just there to centre and stop the bar (dynamic axle) bouncing about (i.e. rattling) in the beam axle. The rubber either wears or disintegrates and falls out, so you have metal against metal rattling.

Bump stops are generally the rubber blocks that the suspension hits at the limit of compression, sometimes fitted inside the coil spring, sometimes external on the chassis. Most common on independent suspension.

Jocko

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2019, 12:41:51 PM »
Agreed. The diagram doesn't show how it ties in with the rest of the car and I am too old and stiff to get underneath and have a look!

sparky Paul

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Re: Bar inside of rear axle loose
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2019, 05:27:57 PM »
The diagram doesn't show how it ties in with the rest of the car and I am too old and stiff to get underneath and have a look!

Indeed, it's floating in mid air on the diagram. It actually fits within the front of U-channel of the beam axle and acts as a spacer to centre the round bar (or 'dynamic axle' as they call it), and bolts to the channel to secure it.

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