Author Topic: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen  (Read 2261 times)

John Ratsey

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #45 on: August 11, 2018, 06:56:38 PM »
Why would you do that? Just turn the key all the way and the engine will start in less than half a second.
The objective was to avoid having to divert my attention to the touchscreen once the vehicle is moving. 

andruec

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #46 on: August 11, 2018, 11:04:19 PM »
The Honda Jazz doesn't require a key at any point (other than it being somewhere in the vehicle). Just press the brake pedal and push the button. In less than a second the engine will be running. And like I posted last time - I have never waited a few seconds in any vehicle and never had any problems (ignoring obvious faults). If the sensors require a delay to get stable the ECU would simply not turn the engine over.

The reason modern engines turn over immediately is because the ECU is ready and willing to go. There is no need to do anything special - the electronics will prevent the engine from doing things it's not ready to do. You should learn to trust them ;)

The fact that on your keyless entry Jazz that when you open the car the ignition is probably already on and ECU awake and powered up
Absolutely not. That would be a silly and possibly dangerous way to design a car. People sit in cars or open the doors for various reasons and no manufacturer is going to power up the ignition and fuel pump just because people are inside the cabin or the doors have been opened. You could drain the battery in a couple of hours just sitting having a picnic or admiring a view!

I don't know who has told you that it's necessary to wait a while after turning on the ignition but the only vehicles that is occasionally needed on is diesels in cold weather. All 'healthy' petrol fueled vehicles can go from ignition off to turning over happily in less than a second with no ill-effects.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2018, 11:18:49 PM by andruec »

Skyrider

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #47 on: August 12, 2018, 09:22:55 AM »
I used diesel cars exclusivly for about 30 years before I bought my first Jazz in 2016. The indirect injection diesels would need the glow plugs to be used for every cold start and in some cars these were initiated for a few seconds by opening the door. When direct injection diesels were introduced the glow plugs were only required for very cold starts but were also used for emmision control purposes and remained on for a short period after a cold engine start. I agree with andruec, petrol cars do not require any pre pressurisation of the fuel system to start, direct injection petrol cars usually have an electrically powered lift pump in the fuel tank, as do diesels, to supply the engine driven high pressure  fuel pump which which all direct injection cars require to produce the fuel pressures required for direct injection.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2018, 08:22:21 PM by Skyrider »

Kenneve

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #48 on: August 12, 2018, 10:44:29 AM »
Hi Andruec

Many thanks for your reply, I had naively thought it might be possible to download the program from the Info Unit and make a simple change, which basically says the 'OK' button has been pressed. Obviously there is far more to it then that.

My only programming experience goes back to the early 1990s when I programmed CNC machine tools, using 'G' codes etc, on Fanuc and Siemens controllers. Had to be very careful not to miss out the 'G1' code (feed), after previously using the 'G0 code (fast traverse)!!!!

Has anyone asked Honda, why they insist on the requirement to confirm the safety notice every time you start the car?
I suppose it's another edict/regulation from the EU. Sooner we are out the better!!

andruec

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #49 on: August 12, 2018, 11:44:37 AM »
Has anyone asked Honda, why they insist on the requirement to confirm the safety notice every time you start the car?
You could try asking them but they'll probably just quote the manual back at you. That's what they did when I asked why auto stop on the CVT required me to keep the brake pedal pressed. Their answer was that releasing the brake pedal cancelled auto stop :-/
Quote
I suppose it's another edict/regulation from the EU. Sooner we are out the better!!
Can't agree with you on that. A bad idea to start with and in danger of turning out to be a disaster that is neither one thing or the other. But this is not the time and place to discuss that.

culzean

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #50 on: August 12, 2018, 12:10:42 PM »
@Culzean

The engine driven high pressure fuel pump on the 1.5 GDI (L15B3 engine as fitted to the Jazz)  is on the end of the exhaust camshaft under a foam rubber (sound deadening?) Cover. The same place as the vaccum pump is on the 1.3,  the 1.3 has a vaccum pump as the Atkinson cycle does not produce enough inlet manifold vaccum to operate the brake servo.

I will accept a virtual box of hen's teeth.  ;D

I read Jazz model GD1 (8 valve twinspark) rather than Gasoline direct injection - my fault should have read post properly,  anyway waiting for fuel gauge to settle before starting is harmless enough activity and hardly deserved abuse from certain members...

Engine driven vacuum pumps have always been fitted to diesels because they do not generate any vacuum in inlet manifold, and now same with atkinson cycle engines. Direct injection required very high fuel pressure to overcome compression in engine,  as the fuel is injected pretty much at top of piston stroke for maximum benefit and to avoid knocking with 15 or 16:1 CR common on direct injection petrol engines like Mazda Skyactive.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2018, 12:39:13 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

andruec

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #51 on: August 12, 2018, 12:12:35 PM »
@Culzean

The engine driven high pressure fuel pump on the 1.5 GDI (L15B3 engine as fitted to the Jazz)  is on the end of the exhaust camshaft under a foam rubber (sound deadening?) Cover. The same place as the vaccum pump is on the 1.3,  the 1.3 has a vaccum pump as the Atkinson cycle does not produce enough inlet manifold vaccum to operate the brake servo.

I will accept a virtual box of hen's teeth.  ;D

I read Jazz model GD1 (8 valve twinspark) rather than Gasoline direct injection - my fault should have read post properly,  anyway waiting for fuel gauge to settle before starting is harmless enough activity and hardly deserved abuse from certain members...
Who has been abusing you? Disagreeing and trying to enlighten someone is not abuse.

ChrisNewman

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #52 on: August 14, 2018, 04:49:56 PM »
Has anyone asked Honda, why they insist on the requirement to confirm the safety notice every time you start the car?
I suppose it's another edict/regulation from the EU. Sooner we are out the better!!
In my email exchange with Honda, hoping they could ease my touch screen problem, before they effectively said I was stuck with it, and I resorted to this forum, I included:
Now that we are only too well aware of the warning, it would be best if we could stop it appearing at all, or for the radio to revert to its normal display after a brief period. When starting from home, the warning doesn’t appear until after I have reversed the car off our drive, and am trying to navigate my way around the cars parked in our close. By this time, having to try a number of times to get the virtual button to operate to remove the known warning and restore the normal radio display it is nothing but a dangerous distraction. If the warning is important, it should appear immediately on inserting the key to start the car!

Honda’s reply included:
The warning message on the screen is integral to the vehicle and is not able to be removed for safety compliance reasons.  The connect system is a computer and can therefore take a few seconds to respond when first starting the car up. This is because the computer is loading.

I’ll be amazed if nonsense like this disappears when we leave the EU, but in my opinion it would even be worth putting up with things like this dangerous “safety” procedure to stay in.

andruec

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #53 on: August 14, 2018, 04:55:18 PM »
Honda’s reply included:
The warning message on the screen is integral to the vehicle and is not able to be removed for safety compliance reasons.  The connect system is a computer and can therefore take a few seconds to respond when first starting the car up. This is because the computer is loading.
Yup, similar to what I got back. Just describing the behaviour back to you. You can imagine a telephone conversation with them:

You: It's raining outside and you didn't bring my umbrella.
Honda: If you go outside in the rain without an umbrella you'll get wet.

Has anyone ever got a useful response from them?
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 09:18:31 PM by andruec »

Rory

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #54 on: August 14, 2018, 05:41:38 PM »
Has anyone ever got a useful response from them?

Some years ago they were helpful and constructive.  Now they're not.  Odd really, you'd think with Honda UK sales flat-lining they'd be keener to engage more positively with loyal customers - they haven't got very many of them.

ChrisNewman

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #55 on: November 08, 2018, 09:18:36 AM »
An irritation with the RDS TA system implemented on the Jazz is that if you get an announcement that isn't relevant to where you are, you want to get rid of it quickly: the only obvious way  to do that is using the touchscreen so you're back to the prod-several-times-and-hope problem. I went for a long time cursing that until someone in this forum pointed out that you can cancel the announcement quickly using the "Hang-Up" phone button (the centre one of the three on the lower left quadrant of the steering wheel). I don't think that's in the handbook so might not be widely known. Maybe if your son is informed about that he'd be more inclined to leave TA switched on when he has the car ?
Honda may have omitted to mention in the manual that the "Hang-Up" phone button can cancel traffic announcements, but they have made sure we can’t use it to avoid the distraction of having to clear the touch screen warning!  If I know that TA is set on, and leave the touch screen to grey out, the "Hang-Up" phone button only brings up the standard warning and OK “button”.  Once the warning has been cleared, it is a very convenient way to cancel traffic announcements, but if I push the wrong button of the three on the lower left quadrant of the steering wheel, I get plagued with messages relating to a phone, which I struggle to work out how to clear, never having connected a phone to the car!

With thanks,
Chris

ChrisNewman

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #56 on: November 08, 2018, 09:24:12 AM »
If only, everyone's fingers, worked to the same parameters! Mine are affected by a lifetime in Engineering......

The prodder, works instantly.....




And now lives, here. For instant access.....




It perfectly, matches the colour of the car, too!  ;)
I borrowed a plastic stylus from my son, and it had no effect on the touchscreen.  I then tried a steel coach bolt, using the spherical cap, and it worked fine, even after I’d covered it with a party balloon to eliminate any risk of scratching the touch screen.  Then my wife bought a set of two styli, one of which looks like yours, from Poundland.  These seem to work consistently, although I find using them more distracting, because it takes more concentration, to touch the “button” with one of these rather than my finger.  Perhaps my best strategy (short of Honda producing a firmware update to eliminate the dangerous, distracting need to clear the screen warning) will be to try once after each start-up with my finger, and resort to the stylus if the screen ignores my finger.

Thanks again for everyone’s help,
Chris

culzean

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #57 on: November 08, 2018, 09:48:24 AM »
There are several types of touch screen, the two main ones are resistive and capacitive - I have dry skin on fingers and touch screens sometimes don't work on capacitive type. You can poke a resistive screen with just about anything,  but capacitive screens ( i-phone and it looks like Honda touchscreen  ) need something a bit more special, try licking your finger before touching the screen ( like a lot of people have to do before they can separate a thin plastic bag ).

https://www.dummies.com/education/internet-basics/2-types-of-touchscreens-to-know/
« Last Edit: November 08, 2018, 09:55:15 AM by culzean »
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peteo48

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #58 on: November 08, 2018, 11:57:58 AM »
The touchscreen thing is irritating - I doubt if it is down to the EU though. More specifically, it does seem a bit erratic. I've found that the actual tip of my finger doesn't always work so I use the softer skin on the inside of my finger if that makes sense. That usually works. Are these things sensitive to body heat?

Downsizer

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Re: Problem of poor sensitivity of audio touch screen
« Reply #59 on: November 08, 2018, 12:33:44 PM »
Look for touch screen stylus on eBay and you can find a pack of 10 for £1.69, or 3 packs for 2.  I've been giving them away to friends with iPads etc.

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