Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk4 2020 - => Topic started by: sportse on July 05, 2022, 06:42:48 PM
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I’d been fairly impressed with the standard tyres fitted to my EX - not outstanding in any area but ok in most.
Winter driving in sub zero temperatures was ok with good grip for a standard tyre.
The only slight disappointment was wet weather performance with a bit less grip than I would have liked.
Until now, the tyres were wearing very well.
However in the last 2-3k miles, wear has shot up - I don’t know if they don’t like the warmer summer temperatures with long motorway drives, or if the tyre wear just increases rapidly as they wear beyond a certain point with these.
In tyres I’ve had before the wear rate was consistent with miles travelled up until they needed changing.
My rears are still 5mm but the fronts are now down to 3.5-4mm, so will need changed before winter.
Mileage so far is only 16k miles, so maybe 18-20k total before they will need replaced.
I had hoped for maybe 30k on the fronts with a low powered hybrid that smoothly applies power but it’s going to be quite a bit less.
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Hi Sportse, Like you I am generally pleased with the Yokohama tyres and have just checked my tyre depths.
I find that based of 11000 miles, the wear is fairly even, with the rears a being 6.2-6.0mm and the fronts 6.0-5.7mm, which I guess is commensurate with yours, given the difference in mileages. The tyres on my previous Jazz cars were Dunlop and were far worse than this.
I don't however agree with your premise of the smooth drive, promoting a good mileage.
The Mk4 power, particularly torque is significantly more than the previous Jazz, which will improve acceleration and the general 'get up and go' of this model, and I'm sorry to say, that human nature being what it is, if the power is there, then you will use it, at some point. :D :D
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I haven’t really seen the traction control light, so maybe the tyres are quite grippy and actually working harder than it appears.
They are more readily available now through Kwik fit/etc than when I looked last year. Price around £105 so not too bad for a quality tyre.
I used to have Dunlop tyres on a previous car, good in the summer but very hard in the winter with little grip. On my Yaris the car actually used to skid sideways when driving very slowly around car parks in the winter with full lock. The tyres were on the edge and with little grip they just slid.
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Can't remember now which of my Jazzes it was but I replaced a set of Dunlop SP2030s at 13,000 miles when they were down to 3 mm.
I haven't done enough miles to assess the Yokohamas. With my current low mileage it might be age rather than wear that causes me to replace.
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Seriously not happy with the supplied tyres here. The car has just has its 2nd years service @8k miles
Fronts are down to 4.0 and 4.2 mm. That is ridiculous rate of wear by anyones standard. We have not changed our driving style since our previous car (09 mk2 owned from new) and the tyres lasted far longer (Cross Climates were the last ones fitted) and our driving style has not changed.
As I say, not impressed.
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I am also quite satisfied with the supplied Yokohama, grip is pretty good and they were surprisingly good on a torrential rain motorway trip.
As for wear, I only do a very low annual mileage in my Jazz, yet to hit 5k as it comes to 3 years old, however, since the car is front wheel drive, driven mostly directly from an electric motor(always off the line) its unrealistic to expect 30k from front tyres.
As pointed out by Kenneve, electric drive delivers a significantly higher torque when pulling away compared to the usual ICE/clutch. You only have to look at the poor tyre life experienced by many owners of full EV's, even worse than the Jazz.
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Just had my fronts (Yokohama Blu) replaced after only 11000 miles
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However in the last 2-3k miles, wear has shot up
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If only the front tyres suddenly rapidly deteriorate you might want to check the wheel alignment.
(have you within the last 2-3k miles hit a larger than normal pothole or hit the curb at an unfortunate angle?)
The Yokohama Blue Earth (ES32) tyres have an expected milage of above 25k miles according to this source:
https://www.tyrereviews.com/Tyre/Yokohama/BluEarth-Es-ES32.htm
(as you can see: They are rated "average" in most categories with a high in "comfort" and lows in "wear" and "wet grip")
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Our Jazz was delivered in September 2021 with Vredestein Quatrac all-season tyres (instead of the Yokohama Blue Earth) at our request. Now, after more than four years and over 35,000 km (22,000 miles), both front tires still have just over 5 mm of tread.
We're glad we chose the Vredestein all-seasons back then.
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I managed 28k with the original Blue earths. Just before the 3rd service which included its first MOT, I decided to change them. There was 3mm on the fronts, and 5mm on the backs. I kept the best back one as a spare, which had nearly 6mm on one linear tread. I found them to be good in all conditions, and I don't hang about in driving style. . I would have got them again if my local area fitters could get them, but they couldn't. I have now fitted TOYO proxes comforts, that actually were higher in the braking/quietness/wet weather grip ratings than the Blue earths.. and better than Michelin equivalents too. £100 a corner fitted, I just hope they wear as well as the Blue earths.
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As pointed out by Kenneve, electric drive delivers a significantly higher torque when pulling away compared to the usual ICE/clutch. You only have to look at the poor tyre life experienced by many owners of full EV's, even worse than the Jazz.
That is down to the weight of full EVs though, which is significantly greater than a Jazz.
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For years when I've needed new tyres always brought either Michelin continental or good-year
just had a look Black-circles etc and the blue-earth in Jazz size have better ratings than the
three makes I've always brought , going on that and I've no complaints and cannot notice any
wear after 10,000 miles I will stick with them when replacement time arrives.
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As pointed out by Kenneve, electric drive delivers a significantly higher torque when pulling away compared to the usual ICE/clutch. You only have to look at the poor tyre life experienced by many owners of full EV's, even worse than the Jazz.
That is down to the weight of full EVs though, which is significantly greater than a Jazz.
Agreed, it is a combo of weight and direct high torque through the drive wheels. The output of the Jazz is pretty low compared to many EV's which helps extend tyre life.
I still think 30k is unrealistic for many people given the drive train, but certainly it's possible with a light right foot, which seems to be normal for many Jazz owners, given the average age of owners.
I have always found longer motorway trips extend tyre life compared to stop/start city driving.
Personally I never skimp on tyres, I've always changed around 3.5mm, always with a top rated model from one of the top brands. Mind you, recently I seem to be changing cars quicker than I can wear tyres out :-[
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I'm a bit unconventional (for the UK) in running two sets of wheels, original Yokohama summer tyres for the summer and winter legal all seasons when there is possibility of adverse conditions. I'd be happy to use my Goodyear Vector all seasons all year round but might as well get some mileage out of the Yokohamas .
I did 27K miles in my 2021 Mk4. Had I done this with only the Yokohams I would probably needed to replace them at least once, then sold the car with nearly new tyres.
By sharing mileage approx 50/50 with the Goodyears neither set were anywhere near needing replacement when the car was sold. I kept the goodyears of course and now using them on my 2024 car. I estimate both sets will again outlast my ownership of this car Buying one set of all season tyres will have saved me buying replacements tyres for two cars. If I do need to replace the all seasons before this I will be able to keep them for use on a third car (my next car or I could sell the wheels/tyres) . No temptation to buy budget tyres because the car will be sold soon plus the advantages of having winter rated tyres in adverse conditions.
I wouldnt say the Yokohamas wear particularly quickly, but faster than the Goodyear Vectors. (I drive approx 50% low wear motorway and 50% high wear conditions. ) Modern fuel efficient tyres tend to have less tread depth when new (sometimes less than 7mm) which reduces rolling resistance and use rubber compounds that maximise grip rather than mileage. On the plus side they can reduce annual fuel costs by up to 5% which can offset some of the cost of more frequent tyre replacement.
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I’ve used Yokohama Blue Earths for a while now both on my last Prius and now on the Jazz
I think they are excellent tyres
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I cannot understand why in the UK anyone needs to change tyres 'seasonally'. I appreciate our Scandinavian friends might feel it necessary.. but not in the UK.
I have driven all over the country, in all types of weather. We regularly take winter trips into the lake district, Peaks and Scotland. Very wet weather, through flood washed roads in valleys and occasional snow. The Blue earths have been great.. and as I said previously, I don't hang around but I do drive within the limits of the conditions. The new TOYO are rated a step higher regarding wet weather braking, so I am confident they too will suffice whatever the UK weather throws at them.
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I won't need new tyres for ages yet but out of curiosity I looked at the 185/55-16 selection on Camskills. The Yokohama Blue Earth is rated at A for economy, B for wet grip and 67 dB for noise. This is their top rating for economy and noise and next to top for wet grip. There was nothing else matching this; better wet grip would mean sacrificing economy or noise or both.
I've not used Camskills but I have used Black Circle. They said my car needed 185/60-16 (Crosstar I believe) and gave two different ratings for the Yokohama tyre; one as above, the other worse!
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Yes, there are two different versions of that tyre. Looking exactly the same looks. ES32 R2425 has ecomomy rating C and ES32D R9249 has rating A. I bought the latter ones for my GK5 Jazz. I thought it was only available in size 185/55R16.
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Yes, there are two different versions of that tyre. Looking exactly the same looks. ES32 R2425 has ecomomy rating C and ES32D R9249 has rating A. I bought the latter ones on my GK5 Jazz. I thought it was only available in size 185/55R16.
It is all very weird. On the Yokohama site the 185/55-16 is the only one with the A/B/67 rating. The 185/60-16 is not listed with the ES32 tyres. The 185/60-15 fitted to the Elegance is listed as available as ES32 but it has a C/C rating. That is odd since the WLTP ratings for the Elegance are better, perhaps due to the lower weight.
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Based on this PDF (https://ipaper.ipapercms.dk/NicChristiansenGruppen/honda/label/jazz/?_ga=2.87952984.1144495635.1655811041-656723536.1655811041&page=1) from honda.fi website, I assume that Jazz uses the following tyres:
Elegance: Yokohama R6084 (https://eprel.ec.europa.eu/screen/product/tyres/612141) (fuel efficiency B)
Advance: Yokohama R6078 (https://eprel.ec.europa.eu/screen/product/tyres/612138) (fuel efficiency C)
Crosstar: Dunlop 582243 (https://eprel.ec.europa.eu/screen/product/tyres/652866) (fuel efficiency B)
This would explain why Advance has worse MPG than Elegance, but it doesn't explain why Crosstar has even worse MPG.
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Yes that must be right. It looks like the Honda OE tyres are not listed on the current Yokohama Website. Mine do indeed say 185/55-16 with a speed rating H and load index of 87 which is not the same as the one on the Yokohama site or listed by the UK suppliers. Not very special at all really with a C and C rating.
I'd always imagined that the Crosstar was aerodynamically less efficient than the regular models.
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I cannot understand why in the UK anyone needs to change tyres 'seasonally'. I appreciate our Scandinavian friends might feel it necessary.. but not in the UK.
I have driven all over the country, in all types of weather. We regularly take winter trips into the lake district, Peaks and Scotland. Very wet weather, through flood washed roads in valleys and occasional snow. The Blue earths have been great.. and as I said previously, I don't hang around but I do drive within the limits of the conditions. The new TOYO are rated a step higher regarding wet weather braking, so I am confident they too will suffice whatever the UK weather throws at them.
I did for a few years when I had a BMW 540i Touring. My job involved extensive flying and I was often travelling to Heathrow in the very early hours of the morning to catch flights. Running winter tyres gave the confidence to be able to get to the airport irrespective of what the weather threw at me, especially as it was often around zero or below on many 3am drives during the winters.
Would my summer tyres have done the job, probably most of the time, apart from getting off the drive should there have been ice or snow on my drive/road at that hour of the morning.
Now retired, I just stick with stock tyres, but i do consider a possible future change to all-seasons for my other car for the odd winter trip to Scotland to visit my daughter, but I still need to weigh up the small risk of bad weather for the 1 or 2 trips vs the reduced tyre performance during the remainder of the year.
The Jazz will remain on stock tyres, no complaints with the Yokohama's
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According to the label on my car and also the handbook and brochure, Honda specify the 87 load index tyres rather than the more common 83 rated ones. The 83 is rated at 487 kg or 974 kg for the front axle and the brochure says 946 kg max so not a big safety margin. The 87 is rated at 545 kg - a big safety margin.
In the UK it looks as if replacing the original 185/55-16 Yokohamas with the currently listed ones may mean you get the marginal 83 load rating.
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According to the label on my car and also the handbook and brochure, Honda specify the 87 load index tyres rather than the more common 83 rated ones. The 83 is rated at 487 kg or 974 kg for the front axle and the brochure says 946 kg max so not a big safety margin. The 87 is rated at 545 kg - a big safety margin.
In the UK it looks as if replacing the original 185/55-16 Yokohamas with the currently listed ones may mean you get the marginal 83 load rating.
Which is why I didn't go for these, and Black circles cannot obtain the OEM fit... hence me going for the TOYO.
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Just to join in. I had the unfortunate experience of a flat on Tuesday this week. An even more apalling experience with the outsourced Honda Assistance from the AA to a.n.other company. The first company failed to check the tyre, said they couldn't tow a hybrid and went away. A further 3 1/2 hours later, the AA arrived reinflated the tyre pushed the huge staple into it and escorted me the mile to the garage. Excellent. It became clear that the matching Yokohamas are not available in the UK. Multiple tyre stockists only offered the lower rated, on order, and local Honda dealer said could not be sourced in the UK and fitted two Davanti tyres onto that axel. It was a very cold and horrid experience. Only 5 minutes away from my local Honda main dealer who were very good both over the phone and when I got there.
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I also had a puncture on my 2024 Jazz, but fitted my space saver to get home. I couldn't find the correct Yokohama 87H anywhere, but then I found three part-worn ones on an auction site. I bought one for £43 delivered. It has over 6mm of tread and no visible damage at all. My local tyre place fitted it for £10. Result!
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Just had the cars 3 year service today, all of 4800 miles from new.
Tyre depths recorded as follows:
NSF 5.5mm
OSF 5.5mm
NSR 6.1mm
OSR 6.4mm
Mostly short in and out of town trips, stop start.
Extended the Warranty for another 2 years at a cost of just under £650 for peace of mind to match the 5 year service plan.
Now reading the 2 pages of exclusions!
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Just to join in. I had the unfortunate experience of a flat on Tuesday this week. An even more apalling experience with the outsourced Honda Assistance from the AA to a.n.other company. The first company failed to check the tyre, said they couldn't tow a hybrid and went away. A further 3 1/2 hours later, the AA arrived reinflated the tyre pushed the huge staple into it and escorted me the mile to the garage. Excellent. It became clear that the matching Yokohamas are not available in the UK. Multiple tyre stockists only offered the lower rated, on order, and local Honda dealer said could not be sourced in the UK and fitted two Davanti tyres onto that axel. It was a very cold and horrid experience. Only 5 minutes away from my local Honda main dealer who were very good both over the phone and when I got there.
To avoid this situation I got a full size spare and carried it in the boot, that way Assistance could change the wheel and i'd be on my way
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After 1 year and 6800 miles my Yokohama blue earths are 5.5 mm front and 6.5 rear.
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To avoid this situation I got a full size spare and carried it in the boot, that way Assistance could change the wheel and i'd be on my way
I got a full size spare, jack and wrench, so that I can change the wheel myself without Assistace.
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Yes that's the solution. We did have a full size spare and jack on the last car. But were put off this by the differently shaped boot space.... ho hum.
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Oh yes, I know that is then a problem.
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After 1 year and 6800 miles my Yokohama blue earths are 5.5 mm front and 6.5 rear.
After 21 months just replaced Yokohama blue earths with Hankook Ventis primes at 32,000 miles, original rear’s still have about 3mm tread left. ;D ;D
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After 1 year and 6800 miles my Yokohama blue earths are 5.5 mm front and 6.5 rear.
After 21 months just replaced Yokohama blue earths with Hankook Ventis primes at 32,000 miles, original rear’s still have about 3mm tread left. ;D ;D
I would have gone for the Yoka again without hesitation, but just couldn't get them here.
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After 21 months just replaced Yokohama blue earths with Hankook Ventis primes at 32,000 miles, original rear’s still have about 3mm tread left. ;D ;D
I think those are the Hankooks my dealer used to replace my Yokohamas
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Just had my second service on the Sport. A bit of a mystery I had an advisory on my front left tyre as it's down to 4.5mm (on the inner and outer edges) but the car's only done 6000 miles, they asked me if I wanted it replaced (I didn't). The right tyre was 5.5mm which is about what I'd expect and the rears were over 6. They said it looks like one of the fronts must have been replaced due to a puncture as the wear difference is a lot. I haven't had any punctures but the car wasn't new when I bought it, it was a demonstrator 4 months old with 2K miles on the clock. I'm wondering whether they replaced the front left with a used tyre from another Honda (both front tyres seem to be the same Yokohama Blue type), or it was driven hard over those early miles and they replaced the right one with a new. Looking back at the first service there was a similar difference then, so it looks like the wear has been pretty even between the first and second services. I've always assumed a tyre doesn't need changing until the tread gets down to 3mm with the legal requirement 1.6mm?
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Its not uncommon for dealerships to take a wheel from another car in their used stock to make their best stock perfect . Maybe because the original tyre had a puncture, or the wheel rim had been damaged by light kerbing.
Yes its recommended replacing tyres at 3mm . But they may have suggested replacing the tyre because its also advisable to have approximately the same depth of tread for both tyres on the same axle. A difference of 1mm is not ideal as one side may clear standing water better than the other But the same could happen if one side is a deeper puddle.
But just replacing one tyre would be no improvement .You would now have 5.5mm and 6.5 mm instead of 4.5 and 5.5 ;D Plus they might not be able to supply exactly the same make and model of tyre - which is also important for equal tyre performance.
Those who sell tyres would probably say the ideal solution is to buy two tyres. :o But I can understand not wishing to do this.
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I would just keep driving. What's the wear in rear?
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I would just keep driving. What's the wear in rear?
Since I don't do many miles I think I will leave it until next year's service and see what the situation is then. The rears are fine with min 6mm.
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So you don't rotate between front and rear, do you?
In seasonal tyre change I always switch between front and rear to wear tyres evenly. Of course keeping tyres always on the same side.
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Recently make me chuckle because the manual suggests rotating wheels/tyres but now you don't get a jack and I'm sure servicing doesn't include a rotate which would be far easier when all 4 are off the ground
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So you don't rotate between front and rear, do you?
In seasonal tyre change I always switch between front and rear to wear tyres evenly. Of course keeping tyres always on the same side.
To be honest I can't remember the last time I bought a new tyre I do so few miles. My previous car, a Crosstar, was a demonstrator when I bought it and I had it for three years and sold it with the original tyres, probably the same for my previous Jazz as well.
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So you don't rotate between front and rear, do you?
In seasonal tyre change I always switch between front and rear to wear tyres evenly. Of course keeping tyres always on the same side.
I NEVER have newer tyres on the front. The difference in grip between front and back on a wet/icy/snowy road can lead to an uncontrollable car taking you straight to the scene of the accident.
Also I have the same brand and depth of tyre on each axel (similar to the above but side to side grip)
Remember tyres are the only contact you have with the road and are the only things keeping you on it.
NEVER skimp. What price do you put on your and your families life?
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So you don't rotate between front and rear, do you?
In seasonal tyre change I always switch between front and rear to wear tyres evenly. Of course keeping tyres always on the same side.
I think there are advantages both for and against rotating front to rear. It evens out tyre wear which might mean you never need to replace tyres during your ownership of the car. Especially so if your annual miles/kilometers is shared between two sets of tyres , summer and winter.
But should you ever need to replace tyres you will have to buy 4 at once, not just 2. And may be selling the car soon afterwards .Or you might be tempted to fit low budget tyres,which the next owner (or their surviving relatives) will not thank you for.
Years ago, at least in the Uk, it was normal to put your 'best' tyres (with most tread) on the front as it did most of the braking and traction .
But the latest recommendation is to have your 'best' tyres on the rear as most drivers find it easier to recover from a front wheel skid than a rear one. (experienced Nordic drivers may know better ;D )
Routine swopping front to rear will ,at times, be contrary to this recommendation.
Although I do share mileage between two sets of tyres I have decided not to rotate either set front to rear . Fronts have remained fronts on both sets so they do have less tread than the rears, as per the latest recommendation. I'm not convinced about the recommendation and might soon consider putting the most tread on the front for my winter set. These are already 5 years old and showing little sign of tread wear. If I dont even up the wear they might expire from old age rather than tread depth. ;D But it depends on my long term plans.
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If there is significant difference in tyres, the better ones shall defenitely be in rear. As a Nordic driver I van confirm this. But when rotating tyres, there won't be any significant difference. And I do prefer to have all four tyres same age and type, and get all four replaced at same time. The tyres are different, and my experience is that by having all four same type and age keeps the car handling more balanced, more like Honda engineers designed it.
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I do prefer to have all four tyres same age and type, and get all four replaced at same time. The tyres are different, and my experience is that by having all four same type and age keeps the car handling more balanced
So what's the thinking if you have a puncture, do you replace all four?
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So what's the thinking if you have a puncture, do you replace all four?
Fortunately, a puncture can usually be repaired. At least here in Poland...
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I do prefer to have all four tyres same age and type, and get all four replaced at same time. The tyres are different, and my experience is that by having all four same type and age keeps the car handling more balanced
So what's the thinking if you have a puncture, do you replace all four?
That is a fair question. Luckily during the last 35 years I have oly once had such s puncture, which was not possible to repair. And further luck that those tyres were already worn out and I was planning to replace them in few weeks anyways. So the answer to your question is that I need to consider the situation in case such unlucky damage happens again.
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Mine are bald on the outer shoulders after 19k miles
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Mine are bald on the outer shoulders after 19k miles
In this case you should should either and/or have the wheel alignment checked and/or moderate your cornering speeds ;)
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On previous Mk4 had Dunlop Ensave EC300 when new, hopeless on ice or water got rid eventually at 21764 mls and had Goodyear EfficientGrip Performance 2 fitted. Much improved grip on wet.
Transferred these tyres on wheels to new Jazz Mk4 at 24000 miles as I had wheels painted matt black which I think takes away cheap sort of look from normal Crosstar wheel appearance.
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Low tyre pressure will cause tyres to wear on the outter edges. High pressure will cause more wear in the center of the tread. Stick to the manufacturer's recommended settings and check once a month.
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I managed 28k miles on the OEM Yokos, and there was still around 5mm left on a couple.
I couldn't get any Yokos at our local fitters, so went with Toyo proxes comforts. They had as good and better performance specs than Michelin/Conti equivalents, yet only £100 each. So far they have completed 17k miles and have been great, with 7mm still evident at each corner.