Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk4 2020 - => Topic started by: BigRon on August 29, 2020, 01:58:06 PM
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Been comparing Torque Lite against Car Scanner ELM OBD2 both are free and come with adverts. Torque lite has a limited sensor range which increases on purchasing the Pro version (£2.95). Whereas Car Scanner has a more expansive sensor range which is exactly the same as the Pro version (3.69), also it allows you to select make and model of car. I have set the app for Honda Honda/Acura hybrids (going to play with the other options in Honda). On purchasing both lose the adverts.
I am running the apps on a Lenovo 7" tablet (TB-7104F) at one point thought that the OBDII had failed transpired that going from one to the other they interfered with each other (force stop one of the apps solves the problem).
Both offer similar option of displays with Torque being more elaborate and mimicking normal car dials, see attached pics.
I decided to update both to Pro versions unfortunately Torque Pro is freezing up and not allowing to be setup, car scanner pro is working fine without the annoying adverts.
My preference is for Car Scanner Pro since it allows you to select make and model.
Ultimately the decision personal. Hope this is of use and interest.
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Hi! Thanks for this.
I’m looking to get one of these apps, but was wondering if there’s one that logs the data, perhaps by time, so I can evaluate the trip after it completes. Speed, MPG, correlation between rpm and speed MPG etc. I don’t want to distract myself with too many parameters while driving, but would be nice to do some sort of driving analysis to improve efficiency.
Thanks!
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Car Scanner does log data and I am pretty sure most of them do, not sure exactly what you can do with it since I am not interested in collecting data and analysing it.
Since car scanner is free and I think with no time limit, you only have to live with the adverts although £3.69 shouldn't break the bank.
If you do get left everyone how you get on, an ODDII will cost you anything from £5.00 to £20.00 and upwards.
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Thanks. I'll try Car Scanner and also see if I can get it to log data. I told Torque Lite to do logging but couldn't find any log file.
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I needed to move the car and I remembered to try Car Scanner. Quick conclusion - it's better than Torque. It logs data by default (see https://www.carscanner.info/records/ ) but I can't see where to change the 0.1 second interval. Data export is possible but the attached show the graphs for the four data items I set up on the dashboard. These show:
1. The engine idles at about 1650 rpm
2. The battery charge increased from 30% to 49% in about one minute
3. The engine temperature increased from 15C to 40C in the same minute
The OBD volts were 11.7 before the engine started. That's surprisingly low as I checked the 12V battery a couple of days ago and it was 12.4V.
Unusually, the car switched off the engine with the HV battery at only 49%, perhaps because it sensed that the vehicle had stopped its initial short move. There was some further shuffling of the vehicle during which time the battery dropped back to 44%.
Comparing Car Scanner's HV battery charge with the vehicle's 10 segment gauge revealed that 3 segments on the car's gauge is anything between 30% and 39% (etc) so the normal battery charging up to 6 segments can mean anything between 60 and 69%. I'll try to remember to run Car Scanner tomorrow when I have to do a short trip across town to the dealer.
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The OBD volts were 11.7 before the engine started. That's surprisingly low as I checked the 12V battery a couple of days ago and it was 12.4V.
If the 12 volt battery is lead acid then at 11.7 volts it will be at <20% charge :o
https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_measure_state_of_charge
This says fully discharged at 11.9 volts
https://www.mmbalmainauto.com.au/PDF/State_of_charge_12_volt_batteries.pdf
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If the 12 volt battery is lead acid then at 11.7 volts it will be at <20% charge :o
https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_measure_state_of_charge
This says fully discharged at 11.9 volts
https://www.mmbalmainauto.com.au/PDF/State_of_charge_12_volt_batteries.pdf
I checked the battery a few days ago out of curiosity as the battery in my HR-V would get down to 11.8V if the vehicle wasn't used for a couple of weeks but was still capable of starting the engine (although the auto-stop would go on strike for a while). While my digital voltmeter might not be accurate I would expect the OBD sytem to give the right voltage. I'll have to continue with my 12V battery monitoring to get a better understanding of whether there's a problem but a tired 12V battery won't prevent the engine starting as the HV battery is used.
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Two more sets of Car Scanner graphs for a 4 mile urban trip with plenty of stops.
The HV battery never reached 60% charge as the car would switch to EV mode whenever there was deceleration.
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You can export the data from car scanner as a .csv file which can then be imported into a spreadsheet.
Go into Data recording, press and hold the file you want to export, select export, select csv #2 and then choose where you want to save the file or you can email to wherever you want to send it.
One of the parameters I am looking at is "Fuel Line Input" aka Fuel Tank Level, on 3 journeys today the logged fuel level on the move ranged from 22.0 litres to 36.8 litres. Sensor in the tank seems to be highly sensitive, contact app developer to see if there is a way of changing the sensitivity (he is a russian lawyer who does this in his spare time).
Will have a look at Torque Lite to see if it has the same problem with fuel gauge.
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You can export the data from car scanner as a .csv file which can then be imported into a spreadsheet.
Go into Data recording, press and hold the file you want to export, select export, select csv #2 and then choose where you want to save the file or you can email to wherever you want to send it.
One of the parameters I am looking at is "Fuel Line Input" aka Fuel Tank Level, on 3 journeys today the logged fuel level on the move ranged from 22.0 litres to 36.8 litres. Sensor in the tank seems to be highly sensitive, contact app developer to see if there is a way of changing the sensitivity (he is a russian lawyer who does this in his spare time).
Will have a look at Torque Lite to see if it has the same problem with fuel gauge.
Movement of fuel in the tank ( despite baffles ) will move the level sensor float. And if car parked on slope or angle as well, due to flat shape of Jazz tank any movement or slope makes a big difference to reading, ( although sensor should be mounted near centre of tank ). Can only expect accurate reading with car on level ground.
The flat shape of tank means a reduced movement of float from full to empty as well, may be that is why Jazz has possibly the most fuel of any car left when fuel light flashes, about 7 litres.
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You can export the data from car scanner as a .csv file which can then be imported into a spreadsheet.
Go into Data recording, press and hold the file you want to export, select export, select csv #2 and then choose where you want to save the file or you can email to wherever you want to send it.
One of the parameters I am looking at is "Fuel Line Input" aka Fuel Tank Level, on 3 journeys today the logged fuel level on the move ranged from 22.0 litres to 36.8 litres. Sensor in the tank seems to be highly sensitive, contact app developer to see if there is a way of changing the sensitivity (he is a russian lawyer who does this in his spare time).
Will have a look at Torque Lite to see if it has the same problem with fuel gauge.
Movement of fuel in the tank ( despite baffles ) will move the level sensor float. And if car parked on slope or angle as well, due to flat shape of Jazz tank any movement or slope makes a big difference to reading, ( although sensor should be mounted near centre of tank ). Can only expect accurate reading with car on level ground.
The flat shape of tank means a reduced movement of float from full to empty as well, may be that is why Jazz has possibly the most fuel of any car left when fuel light flashes, about 7 litres.
I know that but on vehicles with normal fuel gauges they don't tend to bounce about as you drive along.
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I know that but on vehicles with normal fuel gauges they don't tend to bounce about as you drive along.
The fuel gauge is designed to display the amount with a steady display. The info you are seeing is raw data which will be processed before it reaches the gauge in the car. Think of the display as a "Rolling Average".
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In old days fuel gauge needles were turned by a bimetall spring heated by the current coming from the fuel float potentiometer, which provided slow movement of the needle, effectively thermomechanical averege value of the level. Nowadays with software controlled gauges the presented fuel level is mathematical average from last few tens of seconds. That's what needs to be done in spredsheet too.
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Thanks, will try that as see how it looks.
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You can export the data from car scanner as a .csv file which can then be imported into a spreadsheet.
Go into Data recording, press and hold the file you want to export, select export, select csv #2 and then choose where you want to save the file or you can email to wherever you want to send it.
One of the parameters I am looking at is "Fuel Line Input" aka Fuel Tank Level, on 3 journeys today the logged fuel level on the move ranged from 22.0 litres to 36.8 litres.
I had figured out the CSV export but didn't like the 0.1 second data interval. I would need to write a simple data pre-processing program to turn the 0.1s into bigger intervals to make the data more manageable. At the moment the Car Scanner graphs provide enough info.
I was also looking for the fuel gauge data as I would have liked a better estimate of the gauge value before I refilled the tank. Since I couldn't see anything obvious I didn't pursue this but it would be good to know what tank capacity range one segment on the fuel gauge represents.
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Go into Vehicle Settings and set the fuel tank capacity to 40 (default is 50) then look for Fuel Line Input in the sensor list. When I first started using it, apparently there was 45 litres in the tank.
I was working on the data from a journey today and the "fuel gauge" ranged from 22 to 36.8 litres. Took an average of 41 readings and plotted that, still ranges between 30.5 and 34.5. When the car is not moving you do get a stable reading, comparing the Honda fuel gauge is reading much higher I think than the Car Scanner (Honda has lost 3 bars Car Scanner is down to around 31 litres) not down the maths for the bar count.
Regards the 0.1 second interval I have contacted the app developer to see if this can be changed but he has not come back yet, but I think the issues is app is may be looking at all the available sensors and not just in my case the six I have set in the page I am using.
If you manage to write a simple data pre-processing program could you let me know as I would be interested.
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You can export the data from car scanner as a .csv file which can then be imported into a spreadsheet.
Go into Data recording, press and hold the file you want to export, select export, select csv #2 and then choose where you want to save the file or you can email to wherever you want to send it.
One of the parameters I am looking at is "Fuel Line Input" aka Fuel Tank Level, on 3 journeys today the logged fuel level on the move ranged from 22.0 litres to 36.8 litres.
I had figured out the CSV export but didn't like the 0.1 second data interval. I would need to write a simple data pre-processing program to turn the 0.1s into bigger intervals to make the data more manageable. At the moment the Car Scanner graphs provide enough info.
I was also looking for the fuel gauge data as I would have liked a better estimate of the gauge value before I refilled the tank. Since I couldn't see anything obvious I didn't pursue this but it would be good to know what tank capacity range one segment on the fuel gauge represents.
To setup a fuel gauge go into Vehicle Settings and set the fuel tank capacity to 40 (default is 50) then look for Fuel Line Input in the sensor list. When I first started using it, apparently there was 45 litres in the tank.
See the attached JPEG files one is one from car scanner showing fuel gauge data plotted out, the other two are the data from car scanner processed through Excel and Powerpoint to give the JPEG files. I averaged groups of 41 data points and used the middle time marker of each group.
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Here is the car scanner JPEG
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Can you post a link to the app in play store please?
I'm not sure im installing the correct app.
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Can you post a link to the app in play store please?
I'm not sure im installing the correct app.
Go into Google Play Store and type in Car Scanner, see attached screenshot for the correct app.
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Car Scanner does log data and I am pretty sure most of them do, not sure exactly what you can do with it since I am not interested in collecting data and analysing it.
Since car scanner is free and I think with no time limit, you only have to live with the adverts although £3.69 shouldn't break the bank.
If you do get left everyone how you get on, an ODDII will cost you anything from £5.00 to £20.00 and upwards.
I’ve tried car scanner, and it’s impressive. I think it uses US Gallons on the MPG calculations though. Still not sure. But it records data really well. I’ve just used it for a few trips so far, but I’m curious to find out how accurate it’s MPG computations are. Easily the best OBD2 App I’ve used to date.
https://apps.apple.com/gb/app/car-scanner-elm-obd2/id1259933623
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I’ve tried car scanner, and it’s impressive. I think it uses US Gallons on the MPG calculations though. Still not sure. But it records data really well. I’ve just used it for a few trips so far, but I’m curious to find out how accurate it’s MPG computations are. Easily the best OBD2 App I’ve used to date.
https://apps.apple.com/gb/app/car-scanner-elm-obd2/id1259933623
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Open car scanner. In the startup window top right hand corner is a fuel pump icon and a cog (settings) icon.
Tap settings icon, select Interface & Units, scroll down and there you can select various parameter setting e.g. US gallons/Imperial gallons etc.
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Thanks! Got it. My MPG on carscanner is lower than the Dino by about 20 percent. I’ve set my engine size as 1.3 and 4 cylinder. Is there anything else that needs setting that could influence MPG?
Perhaps I Just need to record A lot more trips to calibrate the settings to get it more accurate.
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Not sure, possibly fuel tank capacity default is 50L.
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If anyone used and OBDLink adapter (I'm using the LX adapter), the standard "OBDlink" app works very well too.
I'm able to read:
Speed
Coolant temp
Engine rpm
Engine calculated load
SOC
HV voltage
HV current
I already logged several trips in different driving conditions, and put the data on an excel file.
I'm trying to put the data on a chart, anyone can suggest something?
@John Ratsey do not trust too much the OBD adapter for measuring the 12V battery, the measurement is done by the adapter itself, and the quality of the components changes a lot between different adapters.
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In my other cars I always used dash command tool and I worked great, here where could I found the OBD port?
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Thanks to all for the suggestions here.
In the app "Car Scanner ELM OBD2", which "Connection profile" should I choose. ("Honda Fit GK3" doesn't seem to work fully.)
Can anyone recommend a £10 to £20ish OBD2 bluetooth adapter that works with the Jazz and with the app "Car Scanner ELM OBD2" please. I gather that picking a compatible (and low-cost) adapter is awkward, because of fake adapters flooding the market.
I have tried the below "Torque" adapter. But I cannot read many values, eg battery current charge and discharge. So I don't know if I have the wrong "connection profile" or a dodgy Chinese adapter, or both?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Torque-Pro-Elm-327-Bluetooth/dp/B01AC7I7BO/ref=asc_df_B01AC7I7BO/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=310668964056&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=3088605360543807250&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006567&hvtargid=pla-592196470004&psc=1
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Thanks to all for the suggestions here.
In the app "Car Scanner ELM OBD2", which "Connection profile" should I choose. ("Honda Fit GK3" doesn't seem to work fully.)
Can anyone recommend a £10 to £20ish OBD2 bluetooth adapter that works with the Jazz and with the app "Car Scanner ELM OBD2" please. I gather that picking a compatible (and low-cost) adapter is awkward, because of fake adapters flooding the market.
I have tried the below "Torque" adapter. But I cannot read many values, eg battery current charge and discharge. So I don't know if I have the wrong "connection profile" or a dodgy Chinese adapter, or both?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Torque-Pro-Elm-327-Bluetooth/dp/B01AC7I7BO/ref=asc_df_B01AC7I7BO/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=310668964056&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=3088605360543807250&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006567&hvtargid=pla-592196470004&psc=1
I used Honda/Acura hybrids
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Interesting
Car scanner when set to show fuel in tank in % stops reading after reaching 92%, (in car setting I set 40l tank)
And GOM starts recalculate km to empty after reaching same 92-91% of tank capacity