Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums

Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk1 2002-2008 => Topic started by: Jocko on June 02, 2018, 05:21:10 PM

Title: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 02, 2018, 05:21:10 PM
My MOT is due in the next 4 weeks, so today I had my son-in-law do a pre-MOT test (he is a certified MOT tester, but since moving on to trucks he no longer practices). I am pleased to say, everything seems okay. He isn't able to do the emission tests so that may still pose a problem, but I am hopeful! He did find the exhaust heat shield was loose (I have experienced the odd rattle from under my seat), but a large washer fixed that.  He cleaned up and greased a couple of brake pipes too.
Normally he just puts the car in for its MOT and either him of the garage does any repairs, but with the new rules he wanted it checked over first. He phoned his mate, and it goes in on Wednesday morning for the real thing. The garage is a truck specialist, so it had to be fitted in with their VOSA schedule.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on June 03, 2018, 09:57:26 AM
Normally he just puts the car in for its MOT and either him of the garage does any repairs, but with the new rules he wanted it checked over first.

Speaking to my MOT man, for most vehicles not much has changed, despite the scare stories in the press. The main differences are in the wording on the certificate.

Ours is due to expire in a couple of weeks, hopefully I will be able to get it in this week.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 03, 2018, 11:07:21 AM
It is the bit about not being able to drive the vehicle away if a dangerous fault is recorded. He would go and do the repair, himself, at the garage (the boss is a mate), but it is easier to check beforehand and avoid the inconvenience.
Seemingly, they are still not allowed to remove wheels at the MOT, so disc and pad checks are a bit of a lottery.
My pads are hidden when the wheels are on. Without removing the wheels you cannot realistically check them.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: VicW on June 03, 2018, 03:48:35 PM
I asked my son, an MoT tester, about the new MoT regs and not being able to drive a dangerous vehicle away. He said there is nothing the tester can do to stop it being driven away he can only advise the driver of the rules, he has no legal powers. Someone is going to say that the tester can keep the car keys but that means that the tester is now responsible for the vehicle on his premises and business insurance. Remember this doesn't need to be an old car it may be only three years old. This anomaly in the new regulations has been brought to VOSA's attention along with other things.

Vic.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 03, 2018, 05:16:02 PM
I asked my son, an MoT tester, about the new MoT regs and not being able to drive a dangerous vehicle away. He said there is nothing the tester can do to stop it being driven away he can only advise the driver of the rules
Nothing has actually changed, other than the wording being made clearer. It was always an offence to drive an un-roadworthy vehicle and an MOT failure means a vehicle is not roadworthy.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on June 04, 2018, 11:04:37 AM
Nothing has actually changed, other than the wording being made clearer. It was always an offence to drive an un-roadworthy vehicle and an MOT failure means a vehicle is not roadworthy.

Exactly.

MOT testers have always had the ability to mark a defect as 'dangerous' in their opinion, and if you were to be subsequently pulled over with a serious defect uncorrected, then you could well end up being handed a PG9 prohibition from use.

The problem is that some testing garages have taken to using the word 'dangerous' on MOT failures in order to pesuade customers to leave their vehicle and have work done immediately, or spend more fixing minor defects. I saw a scan of a refusal recently where one of the several items marked as *DANGEROUS* was a split front wiper blade. Hopefully, now that dangerous faults are now recognised as a specific category with subsequent consequences, this sort of thing should be less common.

It goes back to something I was saying on an earlier thread, find a tester you can trust and stick with them.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 04, 2018, 11:09:53 AM
Garages will go back to the pre-MOT, off the system test, as they once did. £20 for a quick check over, nothing on the system, word of mouth report.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 06, 2018, 12:40:50 PM
Car passed its MOT, with an advisory.
Nearside Front Suspension arm pin or bush worn but not resulting in excessive movement rear bush (5.3.4 (a) (i))
No idea what that refers to so I'll leave it to my mechanic to speak to the MOT tester.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on June 06, 2018, 10:10:36 PM
Car passed its MOT, with an advisory.
Nearside Front Suspension arm pin or bush worn but not resulting in excessive movement rear bush (5.3.4 (a) (i))
No idea what that refers to so I'll leave it to my mechanic to speak to the MOT tester.

Sounds like the rear wishbone bush, the doughnut shaped one with the vertical bolt. Probably a small tear in the rubber or detaching of the bush from the outer shell, which will deteriorate in time.

About 15 quid for both bushes, or about 25 quid for a pattern wishbone complete with bushes and new balljoint.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 07, 2018, 06:01:18 AM
(https://www.parts-honda.uk/thumbs/honda_cars/auto/17SAA601/IMGE/930_930/FRONT-STABILIZER-FRONT-LOWER-ARM-Honda-Cars-JAZZ-2006-12-S-5-speed-manual-B__2700.jpg)

That would be my take on the matter too, if it wasn't for the fact I replaced the wishbone, complete with bushes and ball joint, 18 months/13,000 miles ago.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on June 07, 2018, 09:17:52 AM
That would be my take on the matter too, if it wasn't for the fact I replaced the wishbone, complete with bushes and ball joint, 18 months/13,000 miles ago.

It's not beyond the realms of fantasy, especially if the wishbone fitted was one of the cheap unbranded ones - these are a bit of a lottery.

Time permitting, I prefer to refurbish the original wishbone if possible using good quality bushes like Lemforder, or for Jap stuff, Blueprint is the obvious choice - both of which are often sourced from the OEM.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 07, 2018, 10:20:44 AM
Or the guy was maybe a bit heavy handed with the pry bar!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on June 07, 2018, 10:05:42 PM
Or the guy was maybe a bit heavy handed with the pry bar!

Of course Jocko, bushes and balljoint rubbers are favourites. I'm too used to a cooperative MOT tester with some common sense.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 08, 2018, 06:12:32 AM
He is a very cooperative MOT inspector, but it is a station for trucks and buses, so perhaps he saw movement because he is used to applying force to heavy suspension components. VOSA does the testing of the heavy vehicles, but Tommy does the pre-testing and repairs.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: guest4219 on July 01, 2018, 09:06:42 PM
My 02 Jazz CVT is due its MOT in late August , so I'm having a "no record" MOT check done this week.
If it's going to cost a bomb to pass, I will need to consider if the cost is viable when compared to the value of the car. 
WBAC have given an on-line quote of £1090, so that probably means they want to pay around £700/800 for it. As it stands, I can sell it as road legal with a couple of months ticket left and the VOSA history  will show just  the pass for the expiring MOT.
Man maths coming up!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on July 01, 2018, 09:58:10 PM
You have to decide what it is worth to you and if it is worth the cost of repair. I have always felt that if a car has been reliable then it is worth hanging on to. You may buy another to replace it and, though good for an MOT, it may be a money pit in other respects.
I think your valuation could be a bit high. I have recently been getting insurance quotes, and one told me that mine was only worth £600 for insurance values!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on July 03, 2018, 08:19:32 AM
You have to decide what it is worth to you and if it is worth the cost of repair. I have always felt that if a car has been reliable then it is worth hanging on to.

As they say, better the devil you know. Check for anything obvious, then shove it in for a test - you may be pleasantly surprised.

I think your valuation could be a bit high. I have recently been getting insurance quotes, and one told me that mine was only worth £600 for insurance values!

I was thinking the same. Ours isn't exactly in pristine condition, and it's not a CVT, but your insurance valuation is roughly what I paid for our 08 plate last year.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: guest4219 on July 03, 2018, 09:52:10 PM
I had the pre-MOT today and had it been an official test it  would have passed with a couple of advisories.
Anther year of Jazz ownership looms!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on July 04, 2018, 07:15:17 AM
Out of interest, why bother with a pre-MOT? Is it just so you can repair the advisories and keep them off the record? How much does it cost?
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on July 04, 2018, 07:34:37 AM
It is just to avoid having to illegally drive a vehicle, certified as dangerous, away from the station for repair. The vehicle would be no less dangerous and illegal, it would just not be on the DVLA system as such. My pre-MOT cost nothing, as my son-in-law did it for me!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on July 04, 2018, 08:45:08 PM
My pre-MOT cost nothing, as my son-in-law did it for me!

There's some sense in that, I give mine the once over before the test - but I usually have an idea which bits need closer looking at.

I don't think I would pay for a no-record MOT. The chances of being pulled on the way home must be pretty slim, and if you get stopped with two bald tyres, or any other serious defect for that matter, it wont matter whether you have a MOT on record or not.

I went through the new system for entering faults with my MOT man, he was showing me some of the convoluted wording. His current bugbear is that a perfectly good balljoint with a damaged rubber is now a fail, whilst play in a balljoint or TRE, which could rapidly turn nasty, is only a 'monitor and repair if necessary' and a pass. Most of the 'dangerous' category faults should be fairly evident from visual inspection or driving.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: guest4219 on July 05, 2018, 08:20:10 PM
The pre-MOT, in my case, was to enable me to decide on the feasibility of keeping the car.
Had it failed with major money chunks being needed, I could either flog it to WBAC or Evans Halshaw, or PX it for a replacement ca,r WITH two months MOT left on it.
Try selling a car with an MOT fail!!!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: JohnAlways on July 06, 2018, 08:58:51 AM
Quote from sparky Paul: "I went through the new system for entering faults with my MOT man, he was showing me some of the convoluted wording. His current bugbear is that a perfectly good ball joint with a damaged rubber is now a fail, whilst play in a ball joint or TRE, which could rapidly turn nasty, is only a 'monitor and repair if necessary' and a pass. Most of the 'dangerous' category faults should be fairly evident from visual inspection or driving."

My son put his Jazz in last week, it failed on a Major fault.
The rubber on the drop link ball joint had split. No play or wear just a split rubber. Picture od failure notice attached

I consider that pretty good result considering he has had it 11 months and probably not opened the bonnet!

Pain in the neck to be a major and he put it in a month to early, I offered to look at it first but he declined.
I probably wouldn't have gone looking for that anyway unless it was obvious. Another check for me to do.

I assume it was Kwik Fit that did the testing (over the road from him) so he left it for repair.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on July 06, 2018, 02:57:42 PM
My son put his Jazz in last week, it failed on a Major fault.
The rubber on the drop link ball joint had split. No play or wear just a split rubber.

'Major Fault' - what a farce. My man said "they can be nearly hanging off and I can't fail 'em, but a nick in the rubber..."

Not bad though, he must be happy with that. £9 for a factor part, I've just done one before ours was tested. It was knocking though, I wouldn't have checked the rubbers either.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: sparky Paul on July 06, 2018, 03:03:07 PM
Try selling a car with an MOT fail!!!

I know, that's how I usually buy them! Not this Jazz though, that came with 11 months MOT.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Denis on July 14, 2018, 11:02:50 PM
My 55 plate Jazz SE passed today with no prior inspection, but to be fair I did treat it to a new exhaust from the Cat back, and three new calipers and new pads all round earlier this year. With just 70000 on the clock its going to last me another four years at least.
Interesting to note my average mpg has crept up from 50 to 52.3 since the new exhaust!
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: madasafish on July 15, 2018, 06:56:48 AM
The improvement in mpg is probably due to the hot summer.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 01, 2019, 06:22:03 PM
Car had its 2019 Pre-MOT this morning. John found a few things, but he thinks they would just be advisories. Both wishbones have tiny splits in rear joint, brake pipes have some surface rust, but not excessive, and Kwik Fit back box has an incompletely welded seam which is showing signs of snuffling. As box is not quite 18 months old I phoned Kwik Fit and was told to bring it in and they would replace it FOC. I arranged to take it in Monday morning.
John is going to discuss wishbones with MOT inspector on Monday morning, and if he says change them, we will change them.
Title: Re: Pre-MOT check.
Post by: Jocko on June 03, 2019, 10:12:09 AM
Took car into Kwik Fit, first thing, and they checked it out. Showed me that exhaust wasn’t leaking. Mechanic put his hand over tailpipe, to build up back pressure, and there wasn’t a whisper at suspect joint. When he released back pressure it was like a gun going off, so there was plenty pressure there.