Author Topic: Electric cars  (Read 694348 times)

culzean

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #240 on: October 02, 2017, 09:09:38 AM »
Watched the Fully Charged review of the new Volkswagen E Golf - and I want one. It is a classic Golf but an EV to boot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9LZNQBfm9U

If you wait 12 months you will pick one up for less than half  price of a new one LOL, caveat emptor !
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Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #241 on: October 02, 2017, 09:39:30 AM »
There is currently a £4,500 grant towards the cost of a new E Golf, plus the current scrappage scheme. Makes buying a new one at the moment rather attractive. A 2016 model will cost about £21K with a new one £32K minus discounts, so no real incentive to buy a second hand car.

peteo48

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #242 on: October 02, 2017, 10:34:21 AM »
Watched the Fully Charged review of the new Volkswagen E Golf - and I want one. It is a classic Golf but an EV to boot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9LZNQBfm9U

If you wait 12 months you will pick one up for less than half  price of a new one LOL, caveat emptor !

The pricing of EVs - generally - is a bit of a tangled web. For example the headline price of a new Nissan Leaf 30 kwh car may be around £27,000 but almost nobody pays that. I asked car wow to get me some quotes from Nissan dealers for a brand new 30kwh Leaf (as an academic exercise) and you were looking at £19,000 tops and the cheapest offer I got was £18,500 so the depreciation looks horrendous but that's only if you were daft enough to pay the sticker price.

An interesting little twist in the market at the moment is Nissan's scrappage scheme. You can chop your old diesel in against second hand Leafs - this seems to have firmed up the prices especially on the 30 kwh Leaf which is almost as expensive second hand as car wow can do a new one for.

And finally, even more than most cars, EV's are typically leased or PCP'd.


Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #243 on: October 02, 2017, 12:09:23 PM »
You have to be careful with the Nissan Leaf. Often you think "that's a great price", then find out the battery is on a lease.
Talking of Nissan Leafs. There is a taxi firm, here in Kirkcaldy, using the Nissan Leafs, and NHS Fife has bought a fleet of  Nissan e-NV200s, to replace their small vans.
These ones are in Northumbria.


guest1372

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #244 on: October 02, 2017, 02:44:56 PM »
At ex-colleagues company where VW Group is a client, they have an e-Golf & 4 GTE in the pool, the latter of which are first choice over a fairly wide range of other desirable stuff.
--
TG

Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #245 on: October 02, 2017, 03:24:53 PM »
The GTE is very desirable too, being a Plug in hybrid. Has more oomph and, of course, greater range.

culzean

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #246 on: October 02, 2017, 04:53:06 PM »
The reason people lease or pcp EV is battery, its like with an ICE car saying you can have the car for £150 a month,  but if you want the petrol tank it will cost you an extra £80 a month,  or you can buy the petrol tank outright for £8000, but we advise you to get petrol tank insurance because if it goes bad a service replacement petrol tank will cost you about £5000.

As Jocko says, most cheaper used EV have battery on lease, so add £70 to 80 a month to running costs,  and who would pay good money for a 4 year old EV with battery owned outright, with a chance that battery may go bad at any time.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2017, 05:11:14 PM by culzean »
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Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #247 on: October 02, 2017, 05:51:51 PM »
That is one good reason to buy a car new and buy the battery outright. If you treat the battery correctly there is no reason why it won't last the life of the car. The e-Golf’s 24 kWh lithium ion battery pack is covered with an 8-year, 100,000 mile warranty. Volkswagen says they developed the battery pack with the “intention of it having 80 per cent of its original capacity after 10 years’ use.” The target is based on an electric vehicle travelling about 9000 miles annually.

culzean

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #248 on: October 02, 2017, 06:40:43 PM »
One thing to remember with an EV battery is that you are only allowed to access 75 to 80% of its rated capacity, this is to protect the battery as no battery ever likes to be fully discharged, as it will damage the battery chemistry. The real world range of e Golf is about 120 miles, with economy mode available for longer range where the car switches off air on, heating etc.  I read in a few articles that with EV things like heated seats and heated steering wheel are fitted instead of normal 'whole car' heating because it gives an 'impression' of the car being warm, but uses less energy. The normal yardstick of 3 (normal) to 4 (economy) miles per Kw/h for EV would lead you to believe that e Golf with 24kw/h battery should have a range of 75 to 100 miles max, so they must be using regeneration to top up battery. The original 24kw/h battery fitted to a Nissan Leaf would only give 70 miles range.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #249 on: October 02, 2017, 07:30:15 PM »
The e-Golf has a 35.8 kWh battery, driver selectable regenerative braking and, according to Jonny Smith of Fully Charged, he got 130 miles without using regenerative braking and without reducing the output by selecting Eco or Super Eco modes. There is also a Heat pump optional extra which reduces the electric power usage of the heating system by recycling heat from ambient air and waste heat from the drivetrain components. Mind you, most of my driving is done with no heating on anyway. I normally only do 4 miles at a time, and, to save fuel by letting the engine warm up, I leave the heater matrix closed off. Only time I put the heater on is when the coolant temperature achieves 80°C, which only ever happens on my weekend 80 mile jaunts. And I reckon the e-Golf will happily manage 80 miles, plus a bit of cabin heat, on one charge.
Mind you, that's a moot point, as I will be moving south of Edinburgh before getting an EV (whatever I go for), so I won't have my 80 mile weekend trips!

culzean

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #250 on: October 02, 2017, 08:26:31 PM »
The e-Golf’s 24 kWh lithium ion battery pack is covered with an 8-year, 100,000 mile warranty.
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peteo48

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #251 on: October 02, 2017, 08:56:14 PM »
On the Leaf my information is that a majority on the second hand market have the battery bought - ie not on a lease of £70 per month. Some of the more enlightened dealers - Chorley Group Motors in the North West for example - have all their used stock as battery owned - they buy out the leases if the car has one. They have realised that "flex" cars, as they are known, are pretty much unsellable on the used car market.

It's much more of a problem with the Renault Zoe.

But something you should always check.

Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #252 on: October 02, 2017, 10:04:33 PM »
The e-Golf’s 24 kWh lithium ion battery pack is covered with an 8-year, 100,000 mile warranty.
That is the old model. The one I am looking at is the new one with the bigger battery. Still 8 year, 100,000 miles though.

Jocko

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #253 on: October 02, 2017, 10:15:08 PM »
From VW UK site:

e-Golf 136PS BEV
Maximum speed (where law permits)   93mph
Gearbox   Direct Drive
Torque   214 lbs.ft
Power   136PS
Acceleration (0-62mph)   9.6 sec
CO2 Emissions   TBA
Payload   480kg
Battery Type   Lithium Ion
Max Power   TBA
Nominal Capacity   35.8kWh
DC Charge Time   60 minutes
AC Charge Time   650 minutes
Nominal Voltage   323V
Battery Weight   318Kg
Range, NEDC cycle   186miles
Battery Warranty   8years
« Last Edit: October 02, 2017, 10:17:11 PM by Jocko »

culzean

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Re: Electric cars
« Reply #254 on: October 02, 2017, 10:28:15 PM »
Performance a bit disappointing, my Civic with 140ponies (about same power as VW claim) does 0-60 in 8.2 sec and over 130mph (speed limit permitting LOL). Also sounds luvverley.

Could it be that at 1540kg the VW is a bit porky compared to Civic at 1300kg.

Read in auto car review that VW gets to 60 OK, but 'runs out of steam' after that, what does that mean when going up a hill at 70 or over ?

If you look on EV car forums they complain that NEDC figures for range are even less accurate than mpg figures claimed for ICE vehicles, and if you get near 80% of claimed range you are doing very well, and more variables with a battery to affect range. In tests I read on Tesla a decent run on motorway at 70 dropped the range from claimed 320 down to just over 200 miles, that has never happened to any ICE car I have driven.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2017, 10:52:43 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

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