Author Topic: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes  (Read 9658 times)

Jocko

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Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« on: February 21, 2019, 06:47:16 AM »
According to The Committee On Climate Change report, they recommend a ban on Gas boilers for home heating, in all new houses built after 2025. Talk about cat and pigeons?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/feb/21/ban-new-gas-boilers-by-2025-says-committee-on-climate-change

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-47306766

culzean

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2019, 09:23:34 AM »
According to The Committee On Climate Change report, they recommend a ban on Gas boilers for home heating, in all new houses built after 2025. Talk about cat and pigeons?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/feb/21/ban-new-gas-boilers-by-2025-says-committee-on-climate-change

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-47306766

'The water could be heated by waste heat from industry'. quote from the BBC report.

Who are these muppets, we don't really have any industry left to produce waste heat -- same as we don't have much industry left to train all the apprentices that have suddenly become flavour of the month again after a gap of 30 to 40 years where no-one has been trained ( except as plumbers or gas fitters, tattooists, and hairdressers and tanning salon assistants ).

We missed a great opportunity to use waste heat from power stations ( like the Russians have always done) to heat local houses ( when we actually had power stations that is ).  Problem with ground source heat pumps not everywhere is suitable,  and while air heat pumps are quite economical ( about 2:1) they are nowhere near as economical as ground source ( about 4 or 5:1 ). 

A gas boiler working at 90% efficiency is a better alternative than using electricity from a gas fired power station at a much lower efficiency when generating and transmission losses are part of the equation.

Government and experts keep talking about global warming but once again over-population is never mentioned because big business ( who now have governments on their payroll ) need an ever-expanding population as a market for their goods.

to me 'expert' can be broken down into two parts
ex = former / used to be
spert ( spurt) = a drip under pressure
« Last Edit: February 21, 2019, 09:45:39 AM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2019, 09:40:09 AM »
The UK is in the top 10 of the most industrialised countries in the world. We may no longer have our heavy industry but we are still a highly industrialised nation, as a trip to any industrial estate will show.

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/10-countries-with-the-highest-industrial-outputs-in-the-world.html

culzean

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2019, 09:52:22 AM »
The UK is in the top 10 of the most industrialised countries in the world. We may no longer have our heavy industry but we are still a highly industrialised nation, as a trip to any industrial estate will show.

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/10-countries-with-the-highest-industrial-outputs-in-the-world.html

True,  but all the old heat producing industries like steelworks have pretty much been decimated.  A CNC machine or robot produces no real waste heat that can be captured and used,  and an increase in quarrying / mining is not going to heat local houses ( unless they are mining and burning coal like Germany continues to do ).

The UK produces a tiny fraction of world pollution but we seen to be determined to keep pushing up the cost of our energy to reduce the already insignificantly small amount by a vanishingly small amount.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2019, 10:11:03 AM »
All the industries I worked in spent time and money cooling waste water used for various various processes throughout the plant. Even the hospital I worked in, before I retired, had water that required cooling. Which seemed silly as another part of the system was busy hearing water! (It was an old system in an old hospital, so the waste water was just "wasted". The new system, in the new extension, uses the waste water.)

Rory

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2019, 11:07:04 AM »
I recall reading, not that long ago, that the UK was going to have Passivhaus regulations by 2016 and part of that was there would no gas in the house.


I'd love to improve our mid-60's house but I think it's got such fundamental construction issues - lots of cold bridges etc - that it needs knocking down and rebuilding.  I wonder who'd like to pay for that?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2019, 11:09:48 AM by Rory »

richardfrost

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2019, 11:32:46 AM »
I have a relatively new boiler and will (next week) have completed a programme of replacing all my radiators. I have to say I would really rather have been able to install hard wired oil filled, individually controlled radiators in every room. Next time around, I will seriously consider this. In the meantime, I may look into the practicality of individually timed thermostatic valves in every room.

There is a proposal from Northern Gas Networks for a town gas to natural gas style conversion to hydrogen. When I read the proposal, it seemed to make a lot of sense to me.

https://www.northerngasnetworks.co.uk/2018/11/23/hydrogen-blueprint-unveiled-to-make-over-3-7-million-homes-near-emission-free-by-2034/

Kenneve

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2019, 12:32:30 PM »

I'd love to improve our mid-60's house but I think it's got such fundamental construction issues - lots of cold bridges etc - that it needs knocking down and rebuilding.  I wonder who'd like to pay for that?

Perhaps you would like my house, a typical 1932 built semi, no cavity walls! don't ask what my gas bills are!

Jocko

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2019, 01:01:05 PM »
I rent a flat which has no cavity walls, no insulation, no double glazing and two and a half 1960's storage radiators. On a cold winter evening we just go to our bed. Our electricity bill shows low, medium, and high consumption for a similar house. Our bill is 2.5 x the high consumption. Why don't we move? We cannot afford any better.

peteo48

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2019, 01:05:52 PM »
I recall reading, not that long ago, that the UK was going to have Passivhaus regulations by 2016 and part of that was there would no gas in the house.


I'd love to improve our mid-60's house but I think it's got such fundamental construction issues - lots of cold bridges etc - that it needs knocking down and rebuilding.  I wonder who'd like to pay for that?


I've actually been in a Passivhaus near Northwich in Cheshire. It's owned by a friend of a friend and he is a bio chemist of some sort so a clever man. He bought a 3 bedroomed house and used the spare equity from the sale of a larger house to get this property up to Passivhaus standards. The sum of £85,000 seems to spring to mind but I might be wrong here. Anyway, it needs little or no heating. The insulation is on a scale I've never seen before and the windows have absolutely no draughts at all. So much so there has to be some specialised ventilation system. One figure that did stick in mind was that they spent £15 per month on all their energy needs.

richardfrost

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2019, 01:21:32 PM »
I rent a flat which has no cavity walls, no insulation, no double glazing and two and a half 1960's storage radiators. On a cold winter evening we just go to our bed. Our electricity bill shows low, medium, and high consumption for a similar house. Our bill is 2.5 x the high consumption. Why don't we move? We cannot afford any better.
I would suggest you look at a free standing oil filled radiator then Jocko. I have one in my extension and the heat it can put out is impressive and yet it costs very little to run. It is a wonderful option to have when you need to add a boost to a system which is just not coping - in our case when it is really cold outside and there is a lot of glass in that room.

guest7494

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2019, 01:42:10 PM »
The UK is in the top 10 of the most industrialised countries in the world. We may no longer have our heavy industry but we are still a highly industrialised nation, as a trip to any industrial estate will show.

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/10-countries-with-the-highest-industrial-outputs-in-the-world.html

True,  but all the old heat producing industries like steelworks have pretty much been decimated.  A CNC machine or robot produces no real waste heat that can be captured and used,  and an increase in quarrying / mining is not going to heat local houses ( unless they are mining and burning coal like Germany continues to do ).

The UK produces a tiny fraction of world pollution but we seen to be determined to keep pushing up the cost of our energy to reduce the already insignificantly small amount by a vanishingly small amount.


I agree,Your absolutley on the button.

Rory

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2019, 01:46:24 PM »

Perhaps you would like my house, a typical 1932 built semi, no cavity walls! don't ask what my gas bills are!

I'd never thought about it before, but I guess without a cavity the entire fabric of the house is a cold bridge.

John Ratsey

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2019, 03:35:40 PM »
I'd never thought about it before, but I guess without a cavity the entire fabric of the house is a cold bridge.
The thermal performance can be improved by such measures as an internal lining of insulation-backed plasterboard or an external layer of expanded polystyrene covered by rendering. Plus a foot of fibreglass insulation in the attic. Flats have fewer external surfaces so should be cheaper to improve *although be careful with external insulation).

I've got an infra-red thermometer which makes it easier to find the cold spots. Improving them is another matter.
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Rory

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Re: Ban on gas heating for new UK homes
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2019, 05:14:41 PM »
Improving them is another matter.

It's a can of worms insulating and sealing up a house that was never meant to be like that, especially in the attic.  An old builder friend is dead against cavity wall insulation if the house wasn't built with it in.  Mind you, it's rarely fitted properly (kept away from the outer brick skin) even on new houses.

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