Author Topic: Driving Test Requirements  (Read 3605 times)

jonathan

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Driving Test Requirements
« on: January 28, 2019, 11:11:18 AM »
Good Morning All to you driving instructors/examiners.

Can i ask a question to settle.....

When you are travelling a dual carriageway (30mph) left hand lane with a fixed central reservation barrier and approach a side turning residential road on your left (30mph) and (20mph) should you glance into the road to ensure that there are not vehicles turning into the carriageway.

What is expected on the driving test??

Additionally, when you approach any road crossing, large or small would you get penalised in your test if you glanced to see if any vehicles were crossing or planning to enter your road...

Hope someone can help...

Thanks in advance.

Jonathan

Jocko

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2019, 11:49:27 AM »
I would have thought you would be penalised for not checking. Item 21. Junctions: Observation.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/659103/dl25-driving-test-report-form.pdf

Ozzie

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2019, 09:38:02 PM »
Hiya,
If you are continuing on the carriageway, past the side turning, a glance from a distance is just part of the general observation of driving you are not necessarily required to look into the junction as you pass it, unless you feel it is required.
If you are turning in to the junction look for hazards, pedestrians, parked cars, skips etc to ensure it is safe to proceed, if its not slow or stop as is required.

Ozzie, 23 years a driving instrutor

jonathan

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2019, 09:30:21 AM »
Good Morning,

Quick question if i may to all you Jazzy driving instructors.

On the approach to this mini roundabout (with a left turning of roundabout ahead and straight on)

If you are approaching the  mini roundabout and due to carry straight on up the hill. There is a car approaching the mini roundabout or even a car/s 5-6 car lengths away from the mini roundabout (cars approaching not indicating) , so presuming cars are going straight on, would you stop and wait for the approaching cars to leave the roundabout? or proceed with cautions i.e, in 1st gear rolling slowly across the mini roundabout as cars approach fro other side. Hope this makes sense....

Thanks

Jonatrhan

Jocko

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2019, 09:53:28 AM »
I am not an instructor, just an experienced driver, but in this age of indicating when you feel like it I would wait to see where they were going. If they were far enough back that I could negotiate the roundabout without impeding their progress then I would go. I regularly negotiate a similar roundabout and as well as indicators you have to assess vehicle speed and position in the road.

culzean

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2019, 09:53:54 AM »
The first rule of safe driving is never to assume  ( assume = ASS you make of U and ME ) what other vehicles are going to do,  many people do not signal their intentions when approaching a roundabout and most don't even bother to go around those mini-roundabouts,  they just drive straight across the centre.  My wife calls the tiny ones 'fantasy islands'........

If another vehicle has their wheels over the give way line before you and decides to turn across in front of you,  even though they are not signalling then you are in the wrong.

Are you asking the question for 'a friend' or have you been involved in a accident under the circumstances you describe ?
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

jonathan

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2019, 10:14:10 AM »
Are you asking the question for 'a friend' or have you been involved in a accident under the circumstances you describe ?

No, My wife is learning to drive and has this query....

Thanks to all for the thoughts. if in doubt play safe...

Jocko

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2019, 10:24:11 AM »
If another vehicle has their wheels over the give way line before you and decides to turn across in front of you,  even though they are not signalling then you are in the wrong.
According to Rule 185 of the Highway Code: give priority to traffic approaching from your right,
So it is not just once they cross the give way signs that they have priority.

d2d4j

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2019, 10:59:30 AM »
Hi

I think these mini roundabouts should be removed

A lot were put in where junctions used to be and there not good at all

I have had so many near misses with vehicles going to fast and there only about a car length so not much before an accident

Also, since these were put in, there’s usually 3 entries/exits where we are, and delays are larger because where 3 cars approach, they all wait then they all set off again then stop then go...

The worse are those at speed or with 1 mini roundabout, most do not even look - I know because I watch them (you can clearly see the driver) so even when I have entered I always check to see if an approaching vehicle first looks to see traffic and gauge how fast there going - most blindly just go straight through whilst I stop to avoid accident- and they simply unaware of it....

In terms of who would be at fault - a minefield I think

Many thanks

John

Jocko

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2019, 11:12:05 AM »
Raising mini roundabouts slightly, just a couple of inch kerb, would deter the straight line motorists, but wouldn't impede buses and trucks that are unable to go round them. Mind you, that would cost the councils money. They are happy to slap down some paint.
Around here all new housing and business parks have proper roundabouts installed, before construction starts, to allow easy access to the "main" road. There is one stretch I use where there are about 5 roundabouts with left and right stubs, where new estates have had planning permission.
The other thing would be strict enforcement if rules at mini roundabouts, but that will never happen.

culzean

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2019, 03:10:34 PM »
If another vehicle has their wheels over the give way line before you and decides to turn across in front of you,  even though they are not signalling then you are in the wrong.
According to Rule 185 of the Highway Code: give priority to traffic approaching from your right,
So it is not just once they cross the give way signs that they have priority.

Yes maybe on a big island it is obvious that they are on the island and approaching you from your right and have right of way because they are already on the island and on bigger islands if you see a vehicle just entering the island at an entrance to your left and they have to do a circuit of the island pretty much every driver will judge whether they can enter the island without impeding the other vehicle, if everyone did not enter an island when another vehicle was anywhere on it traffic would grind to a halt. 

Mini islands with maybe 3 exits all very close together are a pain. Interesting discussion here,  http://www.roadsafetyknowledgecentre.org.uk/help-forum/741.html   and the consensus seems to be that Rule 185 was written well before mini-roundabouts were introduced and need updating 'to give way to people already on the island - not simply approaching it and not onto it yet'..


Mini roundabout priority


The problem with the highway code is that the instructions for using roundabouts was written long before the introduction of mini roundabouts.

Alas the wording has not been updated.

In rule 185 this is the first paragraph:

'give priority to traffic approaching from your right, unless directed otherwise by signs, road markings or traffic lights'

The classic is the 'T' junction replaced with a mini roundabout.

A driver approaching the roundabout on the 'main' carriageway will perceive that they are on the right of the driver already at the roundabout, despite the fact that they are not yet on it.

Every carriageway comes to an end, at the end of the carriageway there is a line marking end of carriageway, this line is either a solid line meaning stop or a broken line meaning give way.

Until a driver has crossed that line they are still on their original carriageway and not yet on the roundabout.

Also note, at some roundabouts the give way line is a double broken line, this indicates that there is also a give way sign. Typically the carriageway nearest to the 'minor' carriageway will be marked like this.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 03:13:29 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

culzean

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2019, 04:38:43 PM »
If you look at the markings on the mini roundabout in the PDF attachment of the OP you will see one of the roads has a double dashed white line across it and the other two have single dashed white line,  this means the car approaching / waiting at the double dashed line has to give right of way to cars at the single dashed white line..

This is common on mini-roundabouts where sometimes with cars so close together it can get tricky - bet you will look out for the difference in the white lines from now on.....
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 04:40:53 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2019, 05:52:15 PM »
All the mini roundabouts round here have one line.

sparky Paul

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2019, 06:43:40 PM »
I hate mini roundabouts, half the drivers on the road haven't a clue what they are doing.

There was one on a regular journey I made that replaced a crossroads, all four entries were marked up with double-dashed lines and associated give way signs, not that it made a blind bit of difference. It's now been replaced again with traffic controlled traffic lights.

One double dashed give-way is the norm, as culzean says, and most (if not all) of them are marked thus around here.

d2d4j

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Re: Driving Test Requirements
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2019, 06:53:05 PM »
Hi

As jocko all mini roundabouts here have only single dash line - 1 mini roundabout is opposite police station and a supermarket on a busy road. But cars que on roundabout which blocks everything including police cars trying to leave police station. They even que on the yellow box outside fire station, which is at the side of police station. Worst still, almost opposite the police station is a doctors/pharmacy with double yellow lines and cars park half on pavement but still block traffic as well. All this by the police station...

Many thanks

John

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