Author Topic: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?  (Read 7786 times)

Jocko

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2018, 12:40:58 PM »
You don't get "rusty" alloys. Alloys don't rust. Alloys suffer from being kerbed and otherwise mistreated, and as discussed elsewhere on this forum it appears that "Diamond cut" alloys suffer badly from oxidisation. Honda's and otherwise. Alloys can be restored. I had my Volvo wheels restored at a cost of £55 per wheel.


The company that restored my alloys told me that most of their work came from dealers, who knowing how smart wheels sell a car, were getting their wheels restored prior to resale. £220 spent on restoring alloys was easily recovered by resale value.

sparky Paul

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2018, 01:41:27 PM »
Alloys can be restored. I had my Volvo wheels restored at a cost of £55 per wheel.

You should be able to get rim completely bead blasted and painted or powdercoated for that, or perhaps a bit less, and that's the only thing worth having done.

Beware outfits that come and tidy up and spray alloys in the back of a van. Some come fully equipped with all the kit to bead blast and repaint, but some of them don't - and they are just tarting up what you can see. If the tyre isn't removed and the tyre bead area completely stripped and repainted, it's a waste of time - that's where any corrosion will give you grief. I have seen alloys that have been too far gone under the bead to be recovered.

£220 spent on restoring alloys was easily recovered by resale value.

You might do on a £5000 car, but not on a £500 banger. That end of the market is where the porous alloy wheel problems rear their head.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 01:49:06 PM by sparky Paul »

guest5079

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2018, 02:44:51 PM »
After a few close encounters with kerbs ( How do you stop them leaping out at you) I have decided to try and repair a couple of scuffs. Problem was matching the colour. I have just received a Scratch Dr  repair kit from Amazon and the first thing I did was see how close the colour was ( previous kits were dreadful matches) It isn't bad. So it's a job for the warmer weather.
The problem with alloys if the scuffs are left then water gets under the clearcoat and then it becomes expensive.
So if you find a car that has a few SMALL scuffs on the alloys and the rest ticks your boxes you feel capable have a go.

culzean

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2018, 05:21:01 PM »
You don't get "rusty" alloys. Alloys don't rust. Alloys suffer from being kerbed and otherwise mistreated, and as discussed elsewhere on this forum it appears that "Diamond cut" alloys suffer badly from oxidisation. Honda's and otherwise. Alloys can be restored. I had my Volvo wheels restored at a cost of £55 per wheel.

The company that restored my alloys told me that most of their work came from dealers, who knowing how smart wheels sell a car, were getting their wheels restored prior to resale. £220 spent on restoring alloys was easily recovered by resale value.

What is rust but oxidization,  and alloy wheels do oxidize once the coating gets damaged,  I had to have my Civic alloys refurbished because the original OEM wheel weights were knock-on steel type?? WTF  (wheel weights subsequently fitted by decent tyre depots were adhesive ones).  This original scratching cut through some of  the paint under the tyre beading and allowed water, salt and oxygen in,  which over a few years corroded quietly away under the powder coating and under the tyre beading and cause slow punctures in a couple of wheels (not to be confused with 'porous alloys') - the tyre fitter says they see it a lot.  This was in the part of the rim that you don't see when you look at the car as the weights fitted to part that is facing inside the car.  Kerbing and stone damage to paint can also allow corrosion in (it is maybe just more visible as 'white worm' on diamond cut wheel surfaces).   The paint looked a bit 'bubbled' along part of the beading,  where it had corroded under the paint and allowed air to leak under the beading.  The rest of the wheels looked good from the 'outside', kerbing was not a problem but there were some patches of corrosion under the paint of the rim in the more hidden parts caused by stone chips or other damage, again just very slight bubbling under the coating,  but once you dig through white powder falls out.   

Diamond cut 16" wheels on my wifes GE Si will be expensive to refurbish, 185/55R16 tyres are expensive and not common, and ride not good,  so will get 15" new alloys from mytyres for about £60 each and fit 175/65R15 tyres.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

sparky Paul

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2018, 07:14:16 PM »
corroded quietly away under the powder coating and under the tyre beading and cause slow punctures in a couple of wheels (not to be confused with 'porous alloys') - the tyre fitter says they see it a lot.

Lots of cast wheels are porous, it's not normally a problem until corrosion creeps under the tyre bead and removes the paint from the bead seat. I keep a tin of rimseal handy, but it's only a temporary remedy. The corrosion keeps creeping along, and you have to sand off the oxidised bits and reapply the sealer every time the tyres come off.

What I would add to what I said earlier, steel wheels are less maintenance, but alloys do look nicer, and replacing or refurbishing bad rims is not the end of the world after years of driving. The problem with the Jazz is that they do seem prone to damage at the edge - look out for tyres with a good rim protection, it does work.

culzean

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2018, 07:57:30 PM »
corroded quietly away under the powder coating and under the tyre beading and cause slow punctures in a couple of wheels (not to be confused with 'porous alloys') - the tyre fitter says they see it a lot.

Lots of cast wheels are porous, it's not normally a problem until corrosion creeps under the tyre bead and removes the paint from the bead seat. I keep a tin of rimseal handy, but it's only a temporary remedy. The corrosion keeps creeping along, and you have to sand off the oxidised bits and reapply the sealer every time the tyres come off.

What I would add to what I said earlier, steel wheels are less maintenance, but alloys do look nicer, and replacing or refurbishing bad rims is not the end of the world after years of driving. The problem with the Jazz is that they do seem prone to damage at the edge - look out for tyres with a good rim protection, it does work.

That is partly why i went for Avon ZV7 on Civic, they have a wheel protector rib,  and will also get Avons on Wifes GE when I get 15" rim.  I will also get 15" alloys with concave or flat face rather than a wheel where hub sticks out  much further than rim.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 08:13:21 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2018, 09:15:16 PM »
You don't get "rusty" alloys. Alloys don't rust.
What is rust but oxidization
Rust: A reddish- or yellowish-brown flaking coating of iron oxide that is formed on iron or steel by oxidation, especially in the presence of moisture. Source Oxford English Dictionary.
I'll grant that rust is oxidisation but oxidisation on alloys is not rust. Just being pedantic.

Quote
You should be able to get rim completely bead blasted and painted or powdercoated for that
That is exactly what We Restore Alloys, who did mine, do. They remove the wheels from the car, remove the tyres from wheels, strip wheels right back, true the wheels up if necessary, repair any damage, chemically clean the wheels, powder coat them to a colour of your choice (some finishes are a bit more expensive), replace the tyres (using new valves) using a rubberised machine that prevents damage, inflate using Nitrogen, balance the wheels using adhesive weights on the inside faces only, then refit the wheels to the car so that tyres are in exactly the same position and orientation. Whole job had the car with them for two days. Did a lovely job and I was thrilled with the results. From having to top up the tyre pressures every fortnight I never had to add anything for the next two years I owned the car.
http://www.werestorealloys.co.uk/

culzean

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Re: Will I regret buying the 1.2 vs 1.4?
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2018, 09:36:05 PM »
You don't get "rusty" alloys. Alloys don't rust.
What is rust but oxidization
Rust: A reddish- or yellowish-brown flaking coating of iron oxide that is formed on iron or steel by oxidation, especially in the presence of moisture. Source Oxford English Dictionary.
I'll grant that rust is oxidisation but oxidisation on alloys is not rust. Just being pedantic.

Quote
You should be able to get rim completely bead blasted and painted or powdercoated for that
That is exactly what We Restore Alloys, who did mine, do. They remove the wheels from the car, remove the tyres from wheels, strip wheels right back, true the wheels up if necessary, repair any damage, chemically clean the wheels, powder coat them to a colour of your choice (some finishes are a bit more expensive), replace the tyres (using new valves) using a rubberised machine that prevents damage, inflate using Nitrogen, balance the wheels using adhesive weights on the inside faces only, then refit the wheels to the car so that tyres are in exactly the same position and orientation. Whole job had the car with them for two days. Did a lovely job and I was thrilled with the results. From having to top up the tyre pressures every fortnight I never had to add anything for the next two years I owned the car.
http://www.werestorealloys.co.uk/

I think original question about 'rust' on alloys may have referred to 'corrosion' which is the catch-all term for affect of oxygen and / or chemicals on metals. Many people think you are safe from corrosion if you have alloy wheels,  but salt hates the alloys wheels are made from.

Without oxygen (active gas) no rust or oxidation,  but whether you call it rust or oxidation the result is the same,  it weakens and degrades the structure of the material.  The only thing is pure aluminium is much more resistant to oxidation than aluminium alloys - oxidation film on pure aluminium is same volume as the metal and stays in place forming a protective layer (end very hard, and is an electrical insulator) ,  when iron rusts the resulting oxide occupies a greater volume than parent metal so it flakes off.  Alloys rims do oxidise into a white flaky powder,  so by no means immune to effect of oxygen, water and salt.

If the powder coat is properly applied it should seal up any pores in the metal and stop air leaking out,  before the bead corrosion on Civic I used to check but rarely needed to top up. We used to pressurise hollow copper water cooled castings with resin in a pressure chamber to seal up the pores in the same way to prevent water leaks. 
« Last Edit: March 17, 2018, 12:11:06 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

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