Author Topic: Indyref2  (Read 2147 times)

Jocko

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Indyref2
« on: April 26, 2019, 08:29:07 AM »
I think Nicola Sturgeon is kidding herself if she thinks there is any appetite for another Independence Referendum, here in Scotland. As an ex-SNP supporter, I think that boat has sailed. If we think sorting out Brexit is difficult, can you imagine the problems with an independent Scotland? Not to mention a second land border with the EU (after all, that is her reason for having another vote, so that Scotland can stay in the EU). UK government should squash thoughts of Indyref2 PDQ.

Barky

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2019, 01:18:24 PM »
There is massive appetite & it grows every day. 60%+ want it - yes, uncertainty remains over timing (1,2,3... years away) & that's where lower % figures quoted in media are spun from most of the time.
Brexit has accelerated things by a couple of years & whats coming is big change OR big change, status quo isn't an option!
You will hear panic stuff in media saying there's no appetite (sometimes based on surveys) but for most part that's words parroted from UK Tory/Labour/LibDem party representatives/MPs etc scared they're going to have to form new parties in Scotland or be out of work (other than as independents).
Should Boris become Tory leader independence for Scotland is guaranteed, unless there's a massive reversal Northern Ireland will cease to exist in a few years time too.
UK gov can't squash indyref2, just delay permissions temporarily & the more they pretend they can prevent it the desire grows up here ... BTW SNP conference starts tomorrow :D
« Last Edit: April 26, 2019, 01:24:16 PM by Barky »

culzean

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2019, 01:49:00 PM »
There is such an appetite for another indyref that the SNP lost quite a few seats ( a third of them ) in 2017 :)
« Last Edit: April 26, 2019, 03:21:52 PM by culzean »
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JimSh

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2019, 02:47:54 PM »
I think Nicola Sturgeon is kidding herself if she thinks there is any appetite for another Independence Referendum, here in Scotland. As an ex-SNP supporter, I think that boat has sailed. If we think sorting out Brexit is difficult, can you imagine the problems with an independent Scotland? Not to mention a second land border with the EU (after all, that is her reason for having another vote, so that Scotland can stay in the EU). UK government should squash thoughts of Indyref2 PDQ.
Nicola Sturgeon has adopted a consistent position throughout the last three years. She recognised right from the start the knots that Cameron and May had tied themselves in and she came straight out and declared her position unlike Corbyn.
Despite what is presented in the media (that everything she does is geared to obtaining independence) I believe that she genuinely wishes to prevent Britain, not just Scotland, going down the tubes. She has been consistently ignored by May.

https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/nicola-sturgeon-scotland-at-mercy-of-westminster-chaos-over-brexit-1-4857675

Last edit Insert Link

« Last Edit: April 26, 2019, 03:53:05 PM by JimSh »

culzean

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2019, 03:20:01 PM »
I think Nicola Sturgeon is kidding herself if she thinks there is any appetite for another Independence Referendum, here in Scotland. As an ex-SNP supporter, I think that boat has sailed. If we think sorting out Brexit is difficult, can you imagine the problems with an independent Scotland? Not to mention a second land border with the EU (after all, that is her reason for having another vote, so that Scotland can stay in the EU). UK government should squash thoughts of Indyref2 PDQ.
Nicola Sturgeon has adopted a consistent position throughout the last three years. She recognised right from the start the knots that Cameron and May had tied themselves in and she came straight out and declared her position unlike Corbyn.
Despite what is presented in the media (that everything she does is geared to obtaining independence) I believe that she genuinely wishes to prevent Britain, not just Scotland, going down the tubes. She has been consistently ignored by May.

Nicola Sturgeon only wants one thing, for Nicola Sturgeon to the the first woman President of an independent Scotland,  JimSh you are crediting politicians with having something else but their own advancement as a goal, but as Billy Connolly rightly said, 'if someone has ambitions to be a politician it should bar them from office',  and John F Kennedy mom, when asked if she minded him becoming president said 'John - being president is OK, just make sure your don't turn into a politician'.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

peteo48

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2019, 04:40:07 PM »
There is massive appetite & it grows every day. 60%+ want it - yes, uncertainty remains over timing (1,2,3... years away) & that's where lower % figures quoted in media are spun from most of the time.
Brexit has accelerated things by a couple of years & whats coming is big change OR big change, status quo isn't an option!
You will hear panic stuff in media saying there's no appetite (sometimes based on surveys) but for most part that's words parroted from UK Tory/Labour/LibDem party representatives/MPs etc scared they're going to have to form new parties in Scotland or be out of work (other than as independents).
Should Boris become Tory leader independence for Scotland is guaranteed, unless there's a massive reversal Northern Ireland will cease to exist in a few years time too.
UK gov can't squash indyref2, just delay permissions temporarily & the more they pretend they can prevent it the desire grows up here ... BTW SNP conference starts tomorrow :D

I think a lot of Scots might have reservations after Brexit - more disruption and so on.

But you might have a point about what might happen in the event of Johnson becoming PM and a No Deal Brexit induced recession. Things could change very quickly. Out of the EU and a right wing Tory PM selling the NHS off to the Yanks and slashing public expenditure to the bone and she could easily win Indy Ref2.

guest4871

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2019, 04:52:01 PM »
There is massive appetite & it grows every day. 60%+ want it - yes, uncertainty remains over timing (1,2,3... years away) & that's where lower % figures quoted in media are spun from most of the time.
Brexit has accelerated things by a couple of years & whats coming is big change OR big change, status quo isn't an option!
You will hear panic stuff in media saying there's no appetite (sometimes based on surveys) but for most part that's words parroted from UK Tory/Labour/LibDem party representatives/MPs etc scared they're going to have to form new parties in Scotland or be out of work (other than as independents).
Should Boris become Tory leader independence for Scotland is guaranteed, unless there's a massive reversal Northern Ireland will cease to exist in a few years time too.
UK gov can't squash indyref2, just delay permissions temporarily & the more they pretend they can prevent it the desire grows up here ... BTW SNP conference starts tomorrow :D

Is this where you get your 60% from?

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/poll-1-in-3-scots-say-there-should-never-be-a-second-independence-referendum-1-4887786

"A third of Scottish voters think that there should never be another referendum on independence, and 60 per cent think it should be delayed until at least 2024, a new poll shows."

Without the SNP, Brexit would have been a (very bad) "done deal" by now. Thank heaven for small mercies.

Jocko

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2019, 05:10:57 PM »
The Survation poll found that 60% of Scots want another independence referendum.
"Survation research asked Scots for their view on the timing of a second referendum on independence.
Only around one-third of those polled (32%) said "there should never be another Scottish independence referendum".
However the poll did not ask how they would vote. I would welcome an Indyref2, and unlike last time, this time I would vote No.

Barky

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2019, 07:41:03 PM »
There is such an appetite for another indyref that the SNP lost quite a few seats ( a third of them ) in 2017 :)
was always going to happen a few years after that 2015 landslide in reaction to indyref1 result, false peak, still got more MPs now than at any time other then 2015-17!
SNP MPs have zero influence in westminster votes whether all Scottish MPs are SNP or 1 is SNP!
I know quite a few die-hard tory/labour voters of ALL ages who'll never vote tory/labour again & now support SNP - even ones who used to shout & rant about how awful SNP supposedly are!

Jocko

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2019, 08:15:45 PM »
I have voted SNP for many years and will probably vote SNP in the next Scottish elections, as my MP is a friend and a great guy, with principles and ideals. My next vote in a General election won't be SNP though, unless it is only SNP, Tory, Labour and Libs to choose from. If there is anyone else on the ballot my vote will go to them.

JimSh

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2019, 10:43:45 PM »
« Last Edit: April 29, 2019, 07:36:00 AM by JimSh »

Jocko

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2019, 08:43:19 AM »
"Every home in Scotland is to receive a “household guide” to Scottish independence as the SNP urged supporters to “get your jackets on” and hit the campaign trail to win the case for independence."

Sounds a bit like Cameron's leaflet on Brexit. May well have as much success.

culzean

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Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Barky

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #13 on: April 29, 2019, 08:48:45 PM »

Jocko

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Re: Indyref2
« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2019, 08:54:54 PM »
Fake news is it? Now where have I heard that before?

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