2009 Jazz EX manual - no power <2300rpm

[guest7917]

We have replaced our 2002 Honda Stream 2.0SE Sport (K20A1, automatic) with a 2009 Jazz EX (L13Z1, manual) so that my daughter can learn to drive in it.

However, there is almost no power below 2300 rpm.

When you go above 2300 rpm the power suddenly kicks in much the same way that a twin-cam K20 VTEC kicks in at 4500, so I don't think there is a mechanical fault or air/fuel blockage with the engine, it seems more like a sensor or some kind of engine-map issue.

It's quite disturbing at times because when it's your turn to join a roundabout after normal rolling-along queuing in 2nd gear, there is just NO POWER and all sorts of cars come speeding up behind you if you don't smash it into 1st gear and thrash it up to 5000rpm before even thinking of changing to 2nd.

And my new-learner-driver daughter doesn't want to drive it (the main reason we bought it) because she isn't experienced enough to force it to do hill-starts by dominating it into doing what she wants.

Does anyone have any solutions, please, before I take it to a Honda dealer?

I read that Honda introduced the Atkinson-cycle for later Jazz's to improve fuel economy. If that's the cause then I suppose there is no cure?

[Jocko]

Ronnie. The L13Z1 engine does not have Atkinson cycle. Unfortunately, I am unable to add any real advice, though I would have thought that a faulty sensor would show up as a Malfunction Indicator lamp and an OBD II code.
Perhaps a previous owner has had the engine remapped. Let us know how you get on please.

[guest7917]

Thanks! There are no warning lights on the dash.

I have tried using my hand-held entry-level Autel MaxiScan MS300 OBD2 scan tool on the Jazz, and I can only get "Data Error" every time I use it. As far as I know it isn't broken, and it worked first time on my old Stream just before I sold it.

One thing I read was that there are 2 spark plugs per cylinder with one set hidden on the side of the engine that is under the dash and many mechanics don't know of them or don't have the tools or inclination to change them easily. However, I also read that this only applies to the DSi models and mine is an i-VTEC.

[Jocko]

That only applies to the DSi (Dual Spark ignition).

[culzean]

It seems that the I-Vtec Jazz engine from 2008 up to 2015 does not have much power below 2300 anyway - as many posters on this forum have noticed ( as have I when driving her indoors Jazz, I normally drive 1.8 Civic).  Jazz has plenty above about 3000 .  If you are used to a 2 litre engine welcome to Jazz world, the fact is your car may not a actually have a fault at all ........

[richardfrost]

Certainly sounds like my 2013 1.4(!) EX. It loved low down revs and I had to get used to that, coming from a 2 litre diesel CRV with lots of torque. I would suggest you contact your dealer and ask for a mechanic to ride-a-long and tell you if there is anything abnormal. Once I got used to that behaviour, I could have quite a lot of fun in that Jazz. I used to have to take the steep hill up to my village in 1st and 2nd most of the way until the gradient eased off and the revs climbed up enough.

[Bristolroversfc]

Ronnie.
I have a 2013 1.4 vtec and have the same driving characteristics as your car.
Very sluggish in the low revs but then picks up above about 2800rpm.
I didnt like it at first but have got used to it over time(hopefully your daughter can eventually overcome this)
Gone are the days for me that I try to beat someone away from the lights(long gone..ha ha)
I just find it very comfortable,easy to drive,economical and of course the magic seats in the back.
Hope daughter gets on with it ok.

[Stickshifter]

I had similar problems with my previous Jazz, a 2009 1.2VTEC. It was only when, for a week, I drove my dad's supposedly identical but newer 2014 1.2VTEC Jazz that it became apparent just how gutless my older one was. Between 1500 and 2000 rpm it just would not pull with any torque and it seemed to be making a sound almost like faint pre-ignition up to 2k rpm.

I tried various things to fix it; new plugs (no difference and the old plugs looked normal, no fouling or odd colours) and valve clearances (no difference - they were barely out of spec at 55000 miles).

Then, after reading some advice on here I tried the 'Italian tune-up' with Tesco 99 RON fuel. That was the only thing that made any difference - taking it on some fast roads and keeping the gear low and the revs up. The engine seemed to breathe a lot better after this treatment and seemed eager to accelerate but I could never solve the gutless behaviour below 2k rpm. My previous driving style prior to that had been pretty sedate always changing up a gear as soon as possible. In retrospect, I think that may have caused some carbon build up in the engine as the VTEC will only open the second inlet valve on each cylinder above about 3500rpm. I don't think I was ever taking it over that normally so it was probably never opening up those 2nd valves to give the cylinder head a good clean out.

Before asking Honda to have a look it may be worth filling the tank with Shell V Power (which was like rocket fuel when I tried it in my old Jazz) and giving it a long run at high revs on the motorway or a fast A road. The V Power supposedly has good cleaning additives but it is not cheap. I think it was around 20p extra per litre when I filled up but £8 extra on a tank of fuel is a lot cheaper than Honda's diagnostic charges!

[John Ratsey]

Before asking Honda to have a look it may be worth filling the tank with Shell V Power (which was like rocket fuel when I tried it in my old Jazz) and giving it a long run at high revs on the motorway or a fast A road. The V Power supposedly has good cleaning additives but it is not cheap. I think it was around 20p extra per litre when I filled up but £8 extra on a tank of fuel is a lot cheaper than Honda's diagnostic charges!

Alternatively, it could be less expensive to add some Redex to normal petrol.

[Jocko]

Asda. Redex Petrol Treatment, enough for two tankfuls, £4.

[coffeecup]

Redex ? you might as well piss into the tank for what good that would do.

[Jocko]

you might as well piss into the tank

You could do that if you wanted to.

[madasafish]

I have a 1.4Vtec CVT. I have no power problems.. If i want to go faster I kick down on the accelerator, it changes down and loads of revs. If I want to accelerate fast from a start I put it in S mode and ditto as above.

It's not rocket science.. it needs lots of revs.. IT is nOT a diesel with lots of low down torque.. it is a petrol engine which thrives on revs. I use supermarket 95RON .  Occasional burst over 5,000 rpm are good for petrol engines. Drive like old  white haired grandmothers and you will see the results you describe.. I believe in Italian tuneups  they are proven to work..

[Jocko]

I have a 1.4Vtec CVT. I have no power problems.. If i want to go faster I kick down on the accelerator, it changes down and loads of revs. If I want to accelerate fast from a start I put it in S mode and ditto as above.

Ronnie has a 1.3 manual.

[madasafish]

1.3 is same engine as 1.4. Just use lower gears.