Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk2 2008-2015 => Topic started by: guest7224 on November 09, 2017, 09:00:22 PM
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Hello,
I am hoping that you can help. Just bought a honda jazz 58 reg, and whenever I run the climate control / air con / heater the main headlights dim. They dim every 20 ish seconds for about a second. The engine note increases slightly too when this happens.
Any suggestions to what is causing this, as I do not want to drive around with lights that keep flashing people.
Thanks
Aimee :)
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Welcome Aimee. I am sure someone will be able to help. Does the car start okay with the headlights on?
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Hello,
Thank you for the nice welcome. Yes it starts ok. Have had the battery and alternator checked, so not the normal culprits. Everything else seems to work ok.
Thanks
Aimee
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Why I asked was a poor battery connection can lead to the lights dimming when an additional load is placed on the battery, and the surest way to find a poor battery connection is trying to start the car with the lights on. However, in your case that doesn't seem to be the issue. That is not to say there is not a poor connection elsewhere, such as the main fuse box.
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Sounds like the lights are dimming when the aircon solenoid clutch is cutting in, it does draw a bit of power - that loads up the alternator and the aircon loads up the engine a bit so that accounts for the engine revs changing as well. If you run it without aircon / climate control on they should not dim. Bear in mind that a 10% drop in voltage to a filament bulb results in at least a 20% drop in brightness, especially the brighter ones like headlights.
As for garage checking the battery, it is difficult to do, as to do it properly they have to draw 100's of amps, which most machines don't do. If the battery is original it is well past its replace by date, can you see the brand of battery on the label ? If it is Halfords, Bosch or some other makes it is not original - there is a date code on batteries and information on this site about how to read it.
https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=9428.msg51223#msg51223
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I've had my 2014 Jazz EX for just over a month now and I've slowly become aware of a slight dimming of lights and a slight lowering of engine revs with climate control (CC) or just air con on. When the engine is ticking over, this happens for around 5 seconds every 30 seconds. I can hear a fan kicking in for the 5 seconds and I've proved that it's the CC because, when the fan starts, I switch off the CC and the fan stops immediately. With CC back on, the fan starts straight away. (I thought it was the rad cooler fan at first).
When driving, I experience this as periods of slightly lower power for the 5 second period followed by an increase during the 30 seconds. It's feels like the brakes are being gently applied for 5 seconds and then released, with the car giving a slight surge.
I'm occasionally going up a gentle hill on 3rd or 4th, just enough power, then the power drops for a while, then you get the little surge. It is a tiny bit annoying.
I've looked at the battery, according to the manual and there's a little green (blue?) light glowing that's supposed to show that all is OK.
When driving with CC and Air Con off, I do not experience any of these effects.
Is this normal and just one of the downsides of Climate Control/Air Con?
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With the aircon on the compressor does cut in and out at regular intervals as it manages the gas pressure.
However I am on my fifth Jazz, all with aircon, four CVT and one manual and have never noticed the slight surging you mention as the compressor cuts in and out.
I have noticed it on other cars I have owned or driven, some with larger engines than the Jazz and have always put the lack of surging on the Jazz down to a better engine management system.
Vic.
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A less than ideal connection, common to the air con clutch and the lights could cause a slight voltage drop which would cause the lights to dim, hence my enquiries regarding the battery connections. It would be worthwhile removing and cleaning up both battery connections, assuming you have the radio code!
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Hi
Our jazz si has always dimmed as described.
Now I have the led lights, they no longer dim but I think it is because they do not use as much power
I have not noticed any surges, and the A/C is on all the time
Many thanks
John
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Hi
Our jazz si has always dimmed as described.
Now I have the led lights, they no longer dim but I think it is because they do not use as much power
I have not noticed any surges, and the A/C is on all the time
Many thanks
John
The LED work on current not voltage and will tolerate from as low as 9 up to 30 volts DC supply
This dimming of filament bulbs will only happen at tickover and is nought to worry about.
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This dimming of filament bulbs will only happen at tickover and is nought to worry about.
From what I glean from the first post, Aimee's lights are not just dimming at tickover.
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Thanks ever so much.
I thought I had bought a rubbish car then! I will check the connections etc just to be sure. I like the idea of the LED's though, as I do not want to either cause accidents through flashing people (may have to rephrase that!) or the other option of having no heating and foggy windows for the next few months.
Are the LED's easy to get hold of, if so where etc...
The lights dim at tick over, and whilst driving too, otherwise I wouldn't bother fixing it
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Thanks ever so much.
I thought I had bought a rubbish car then! I will check the connections etc just to be sure. I like the idea of the LED's though, as I do not want to either cause accidents through flashing people (may have to rephrase that!) or the other option of having no heating and foggy windows for the next few months.
Are the LED's easy to get hold of, if so where etc...
The lights dim at tick over, and whilst driving too, otherwise I wouldn't bother fixing it
I the lights are visibly dimming when you are driving you have really got a problem...are the headlights really dimming that much that people would think you are flashing them ?
read this thread about LED bulbs, beware there are many cheapo LED H4 bulbs out there with proper illegal beams, the ones from classicarleds.com are really good - I have them in my motorbike, wifes Jazz and my Civic - beam pattern is great.
https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=8738.msg53034#msg53034
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Oh no, there was me thinking it was ok now.
May call the garage I bought it from then, as it is still in its one month warranty.
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With the aircon on the compressor does cut in and out at regular intervals as it manages the gas pressure.
However I am on my fifth Jazz, all with aircon, four CVT and one manual and have never noticed the slight surging you mention as the compressor cuts in and out.
I have noticed it on other cars I have owned or driven, some with larger engines than the Jazz and have always put the lack of surging on the Jazz down to a better engine management system.
Vic.
Thanks.
I hope I'm not hijacking Aimees thread. I see she's getting lots of replies so prhaps not.
So, if I've bought a second hand car just over a month ago that's exhibiting these 'problems' what would you suggest I do. Is there a fault?
What do other Jazz 2014 EX owners experience?
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Do not worry about Hijacking the post, the more the merrier!
Just contacted the garage I bought it from, only the gearbox and engine are covered on the warranty, so looks like I have to fix it. Other than the fuses and wires / connections to check, is there anything else I need to do?
Is it a fault with the regulator for the alternator for example? Or would this show up with the alternator and battery test that my local garage did?
Thanks
Aimee ;)
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https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/fit-engine-modifications-motor-swaps-ecu-tuning/72844-headlights-dim-significantly-when-fans-kick-2.html
Seems this is a common problem, people say installing a larger earth cable can cure it, also that installing LED bulbs can do it. Others (including myself) also thing a failing battery can cause it because when aircon clicks in both of the radiator fans and the clutch solenoid draw power at the same time, which is quite a few amps - the battery acts as the load leveling device for your electrical system.
I have fitted one of these earth braids between negative battery terminal and clutch slave cylinder bolt on every car I have ever had, I don't trust the puny corroded body to engine cables car makers fit. longest (60cm) one does it, better to be longer than shorter as extra length makes little difference to resistance or price, the main thing is it is a direct cable from battery to engine and cuts out all those corroded joints where copper cables bolt to steel bodywork. If you don't want to disturb the battery negative terminal clamp bolt you will need a 6mm nut and washer to add the lug to end of existing clamp bolt and just pop other end under clutch slave cylinder bolt head ( will post some piccies later when I get round to it).
Note-- have added a PDF with photos, I have an extra black lead bolted on the battery terminal, this is a 'battery tender' SAE plug fused lead as a quick plug-in to top up battery if needed, I have the same leads on my motorbikes so it made sense to use them on car. The Halfords braid can be bolted where the black lead now sits, at end of existing bolt and I only moved braid when I fitted the charging lead and plug. Other end is bolted to clutch cylinder by the blue pipe, just make sure you cable clip the braid out of the way of radiator fan - it does not need insulating as it is at same potential as car body and engine (battery negative).
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchRouter?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&action=search&srch=earth+braid
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The garage you bought it from can't just wash their hands of it by saying "it isn't covered by the warranty"
Any fault that develops in a used car within six months of purchase is deemed to have been present when you bought it.
I would suggest doing some research into the law before you go back to the selling dealer
https://www.theaa.com/car-buying/legal-rights
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Wow, thankyou to you both, I will call the garage and quote the sales of goods to them and see what happens, and if no good then will get out my spanners and do the fix that was suggested.
That is a great help
Aimee ;D
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On another note, I am puzzled by the black piece of plastic stuck on my front window, behind the rear view mirror, what the heck is it?
And can anyone recommend a child car seat (group 2/3) for a honda jazz 58 reg?
thanks Aimee
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I haven't got my jazz now, but as far as I remember the black plastic moulding is the housing for the automatic wipers rain sensor.
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The Mk 3 I had on loan had all the sensors for lights and wipers there.
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It is a strange thing that in my garage days when cars had a choke cable, one immediate pointer to the sort of problems caused by a poor earth, or battery connection was the choke cable used to get hot.
Now with manufacturers cutting pennies off the parts that make up a modern car it is no wonder that unless you keep on top of maintenance problems arise. Not major but minor problems that can cause may hem.
Yes the black bit on the screen is the sensor for the lights and wipers.
Lastly, go back to the dealer and if necessary put the sale of goods act where he might not like it but as you area Lady you won't be as coarse as us blokes
I have had problems with BT but when I threatened Ofcom, even I was surprised at the different attitude. You paid good money make them stand by the vehicle they sold you, good luck
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Well I do not often get called a lady! I am not afraid of a car salesman, I have taken on bigger than him before and won, he will be getting a call tomorrow. Hopefully quoted the act to him will make him behave.
Thanks everyone, and at least I know what the black thing is, as it was driving me mad wondering.
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https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/fit-engine-modifications-motor-swaps-ecu-tuning/72844-headlights-dim-significantly-when-fans-kick-2.html
Note-- have added a PDF with photos, I have an extra black lead bolted on the battery terminal, this is a 'battery tender' SAE plug fused lead as a quick plug-in to top up battery if needed, I have the same leads on my motorbikes so it made sense to use them on car. The Halfords braid can be bolted where the black lead now sits, at end of existing bolt and I only moved braid when I fitted the charging lead and plug. Other end is bolted to clutch cylinder by the blue pipe, just make sure you cable clip the braid out of the way of radiator fan - it does not need insulating as it is at same potential as car body and engine (battery negative).
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchRouter?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&action=search&srch=earth+braid
Hiya, my first post on here - recently got my 2013 Jazz Si and I've noticed the dimming of the dipped beam as mentioned by others on this post - I thought I was going mad, my girlfriend didn't notice it but I was adamant they were dimming now and again, so it's massively reassuring I'm not mental!
I currently have Osram Nightbreaker Unlimited on the car and I was wondering whether the braided cable solved the issue of the bulbs dimming? Otherwise I'm currently looking into LED bulbs, but after seeing some friends using LED bulbs I'm not convinced about the light output and I'm not prepared to spend silly money on bulbs (for reference I think up to about £30 is fair - just my opinion).
Also I'm presuming the Jazz isn't Canbus equipped if others are running LEDS without any issues?
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https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/fit-engine-modifications-motor-swaps-ecu-tuning/72844-headlights-dim-significantly-when-fans-kick-2.html
Note-- have added a PDF with photos, I have an extra black lead bolted on the battery terminal, this is a 'battery tender' SAE plug fused lead as a quick plug-in to top up battery if needed, I have the same leads on my motorbikes so it made sense to use them on car. The Halfords braid can be bolted where the black lead now sits, at end of existing bolt and I only moved braid when I fitted the charging lead and plug. Other end is bolted to clutch cylinder by the blue pipe, just make sure you cable clip the braid out of the way of radiator fan - it does not need insulating as it is at same potential as car body and engine (battery negative).
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchRouter?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&action=search&srch=earth+braid
Hiya, my first post on here - recently got my 2013 Jazz Si and I've noticed the dimming of the dipped beam as mentioned by others on this post - I thought I was going mad, my girlfriend didn't notice it but I was adamant they were dimming now and again, so it's massively reassuring I'm not mental!
I currently have Osram Nightbreaker Unlimited on the car and I was wondering whether the braided cable solved the issue of the bulbs dimming? Otherwise I'm currently looking into LED bulbs, but after seeing some friends using LED bulbs I'm not convinced about the light output and I'm not prepared to spend silly money on bulbs (for reference I think up to about £30 is fair - just my opinion).
Also I'm presuming the Jazz isn't Canbus equipped if others are running LEDS without any issues?
cannot comment if braided cable has stopped beam dimming as I never noticed it, the main reason I fitted braided earth cable was that I did not like the look of the small and rusty earth points that Honda fitted as OEM, and to give better current path straight from battery negative to the engine (starter motor).
Jazz is not canbus, although canbus compatible power supplies are available, trouble is most 'canbus compatible' bulbs have to draw the same power as the equivalent filament bulb to 'fool' the system that a bulb is not failed (which is 5 amps per bulb for H4 bulbs) so you lose a big part of benefit of LED which is much lower current (about 1 amp for LED).
https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=8738.msg53034#msg53034
Have a good look at this thread, there are some youtube videos on different styles of LED headlight bulbs, beam patterns etc. etc. as well as some photographs I posted of the beam pattern and light output of the classicarleds bulbs fitted to my wifes GE Jazz, I also have H1 and H7 bulbs in my Civic and H4 in my motorbike.
I am more than happy with beam pattern and light output from my LED bulbs, they have made night driving much easier and I am more than happy to drive on dipped lights during the daytime knowing that it is not 'wearing out' the LED bulb. They have Phillips Z-ES chips which are the same size and shape as filament in an OEM bulb, they do not boast silly output like some bulbs which have horrible glaring or wasteful (and totally illegal) beam patterns. I used to fit the best filament bulbs I could buy, Osram nightbreaker, Phillips Xtreme brite, but the LED bulbs are a revelation.
https://www.classiccarleds.co.uk/collections/headlight-led-bulbs/products/latest-led-headlights-h4-philips-z-es-hi-lo-beam-conversion-9-32v
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Otherwise I'm currently looking into LED bulbs,
Be aware, it is illegal to fit LED bulbs in light clusters not certified to use them. This pertains to all exterior lights. Basically, if your vehicle didn't come with LED lights then it is technically against the law to fit them!
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Otherwise I'm currently looking into LED bulbs,
Be aware, it is illegal to fit LED bulbs in light clusters not certified to use them. This pertains to all exterior lights. Basically, if your vehicle didn't come with LED lights then it is technically against the law to fit them!
The beam pattern on my wifes Jazz and my Civic is less dazzling than with original filament lamps because the beam control / cutoff is much better, I have suffered greatly in the past from other drivers with cheap / overpowered HID and LED 'conversions' and would not inflict the same on others. I will be leaving them in for MOT - the whole point of the latest generation Phillips chipped lamps is that the chips are exactly same size as the filaments in the normal H4 bulbs, and in exactly the same position in reflector. The reason HID is illegal is that the light source is entirely different shape and in wrong position in reflector, also most LED bulbs had wrong size LED chips and are not at focal point of reflector. It is technically against the law, but when the LED bulb is better than filament and developed by the largest headlight maker in the world as a replacement for filament bulb in a filament reflector - well what can you say.
A lot of bulbs are marked ' not for road use' or 'for off-road use only' because the beam pattern is totally illegal and dazzling.
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Thanks for the info, have looked into the suggested threads and done a bit of research.
I spoke to my dad who is a mechanic and it's not an uncommon thing apparently. He seems to think that when we have selected the front windshield and feet position on blowers that it's that which causes the belt to run and therefore draws power and dims the lights - I will look into it further on Thursday when I take the Jazz down to the workshop for a once over.
I'm considering LED bulbs and have watched numerous videos on them now, appreciate that you're meant to have special lamps for them, but I have no issues with that providing they give the correct cut off and don't dazzle other road users. On previous cars I always ran HID's but I don't fancy running them in reflector lamps on the Jazz.
To be continued...
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Thanks for the info, have looked into the suggested threads and done a bit of research.
I spoke to my dad who is a mechanic and it's not an uncommon thing apparently. He seems to think that when we have selected the front windshield and feet position on blowers that it's that which causes the belt to run and therefore draws power and dims the lights - I will look into it further on Thursday when I take the Jazz down to the workshop for a once over.
I'm considering LED bulbs and have watched numerous videos on them now, appreciate that you're meant to have special lamps for them, but I have no issues with that providing they give the correct cut off and don't dazzle other road users. On previous cars I always ran HID's but I don't fancy running them in reflector lamps on the Jazz.
To be continued...
There are many LED headlight bulbs available but Phillips developed the Z-ES chips to be same size as filaments in the standard bulbs, this is the only way to get correct beam in reflector designed for filament bulbs. There are some videos in link I posted (repeated below)
Testing LED bulbs
different styles of LED chips and heatsinks, including latest Philips chips
both pretty long videos but well worth a look as they can save you making costly mistake.
The H4 bulbs from classicarleds use phillips Z-ES chips and are cheapest I have seen, been running them almost 6 months now and I am very happy with them - as are a few other on this forum who bit the bullet and bought them.
There are some fake Phillips Z-ES chips on the market - I first bought a single bulb for my motorbike to check quality out - looked at chips with magnifying glass to check same as it should be.
http://www.ledoauto.com/blog/index.php/2017/02/21/beware-of-fake-luxeon-zes-led-headlight-big-potential-danger-to-your-car/ (http://www.ledoauto.com/blog/index.php/2017/02/21/beware-of-fake-luxeon-zes-led-headlight-big-potential-danger-to-your-car/)
http://www.ledoauto.com/blog/index.php/2016/09/05/dear-our-esteem-clients/ (http://www.ledoauto.com/blog/index.php/2016/09/05/dear-our-esteem-clients/)
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Hi
Plus 1 from a very happy user of culzeans led from classic cars
In fact, I replaced all lights at front, side, head and fog lights with correct led advised by culzean and classic cars and also fitted DRL.
I even posted pictures
This also resolved the issue over dimming lights issue
Many thanks
John