Engine noise when accelerating heavily low speed in high gear

[Jocko]

I must be very lucky. I have never had a modern ECM controlled engine pink on me. Back in the old days, it was easy to make an engine pink, but whatever I am doing now seems to avoid it.

[culzean]

I must be very lucky. I have never had a modern ECM controlled engine pink on me. Back in the old days, it was easy to make an engine pink, but whatever I am doing now seems to avoid it.

My GD 1.4 used to do it if I chose way too high a gear and put my foot down on a hill,  but only a tinkle.   Honda engines run about 11:1 CR so they must be doing something magic to avoid knocking.   I could make it stop tinkling by using 97 or better,  and better mpg.

[guest7027]

Culzean - what cat do you drive now?

[Jocko]

As a service to mankind I carried out an experiment this morning. While travelling at 20 mph in 4th gear, with the engine ticking over (my new approach to 20 mph zones), I floored the accelerator, with not a sound of pinking or any other engine noise. I later repeated the experiment in 5th at 25 mph with the same result. All I have ever used, with all of my cars, is supermarket 95 RON. I do at the moment have Redex Petrol Treatment added to the fuel but I haven't noticed any difference in fuel economy or performance since adding it.

[guest7027]

Thanks for this - I will need to test my other Jazz as this is the same as mine.

I wonder if the 1.2 behaves differently under these circumstances compared to the 1.4... I guess I will find out over the weekend!

Should my other Jazz not pink what could be causing this and is it a major problem?

[Jocko]

Modern engines have a knock sensor which should detect the onset of knocking and retard the ignition to compensate. Perhaps the sensor is faulty. I believe that a dirty Mass Air Flow Sensor can also cause pinking.
Something I sometimes get, if I have to change down from 4th into 3rd and stick it in 5th instead (I know, but I'm old and had a good time in the 60's), is my exhaust rattles where the middle box runs close to the offside sill. This has only started to happen since I replaced the exhaust.

[guest7027]

Can the MAF sensor be easily cleaned on the Jazz?

I've watched some videos of cars pinking and knocking on you tube and the sound seems a lot more pronounced to what I'm hearing on mine. I'm just wondering if the sound I'm getting is a rattle from another part of loose fitting somewhere...

I think I need to test my other Jazz to see if this does the same.

For info I did check there is an air filter element present last night

[culzean]

A little tinkling sound from engine when you are doing what you are doing is to be expected,  I will try my wifes 1.4 GE and my Civic today.  As I said if it starts 'properly knocking' which is a louder, heavier sound you will now about it and that will need looking at (not to be confused with piston slap which can happen to modern engines until they warm up, but will happen on tick-over with no load).  Turn the radio up.  There is a reason it is called a 'knock sensor' and not a 'tinkle sensor' - if it only tinkles the knock sensor is doing its job.

I suggest you rev the engine properly and use the gears (which is no chore with the wonderful Jazz box),  the Jazz engine is as far from a diesel as you can get in rev terms,  I used to rev the nuts off my original Civic (the rev limiter was a good friend) and it did 190,000 miles while I had it, didn't use a drop of oil, never had valve clearance checked - original clutch, starter, alternator and never a spanner on engine, gearbox etc. only replaced 1 exhaust, brake pads and discs and cam belts - trust your Honda !

[guest7027]

Thanks to you both for your advice and help so far, greatly appreciated.

I would love to trust my Honda but in the 3 months of ownership i've had the following:

Clutch judder until car has warmed up (dealer can't find fault but has acknowledged the judder)
Air con failed twice (dealer still can't find a fault and just keeps recharging)
Several trim parts fell off or come apart and have had to be fixed (inside and outside)
Washer jets stopped working
Smell of petrol at startup but disappears when car has warmed up
Battery doesn't seem capable/weak
And now this pinking thing

Just to name a few things... this is from a car that's only had 1 previous owner, full Honda service history and has only done 40k miles.

I want to give the Honda a fair trial though so I will see the car out for a couple of years but it's my first Honda and I'm not overly impressed with it at the moment - maybe I was expecting a lot more as most people talk of Honda as being bulletproof but i've never had any of the above kind of problems with any other brand of cars, even Renault or Citroen which often get generalised stick for being unreliable.

I'm hoping the Honda comes good and I'm a believer in the saying 'only time can tell' so fingers crossed

[richardfrost]

the Jazz engine is as far from a diesel as you can get in rev terms

I keep forgetting this. I drive my son's 1.4SE GD Jazz (2005) from time to time to keep it moving rather than just leave it standing on the drive. I keep forgetting it loves to rev highly, compared to my diesel H-RV, which is just the opposite really.

[guest5079]

Given 'ChrisJazz89' admission that he does not normally drive at more than a moderate pace, is it possible his pinking is as the  result of the plugs needing a good clean and some gunge burnt off the valves etc.
The old Redex tune up might very well help, if a plug change is not on the cards. I have quoted this before and this situation is applicable.
Schoolteacher not old, Triumph Spitfire. Just would not pull, pinked like stink etc. Other garages had looked at with no difference. Established the teacher rarely exceeded 35mph. Gave it a good 'thrashing' with a dollop of Redex. Said teacher could not believe the difference. Never changed her driving habits but used to bring the car in for a tune up.
I am not advocating ChrisJazz89 gives his Jazz a thrashing but a good run at higher than his normal speeds might help. If he doesn't want to do high speeds just remain in a lower gear and use more revs.

[Jocko]

I tip I got MANY years ago was a glass of water through the carburettor. You took the air filter off, opened the throttle a bit, then spooned the water into the open carb mouth (easier on a down draught carb). Basically you steam clean the valves and such.
Don't know if I would try it these days though!

[culzean]

Battery doesn't seem capable/weak

Just to name a few things... this is from a car that's only had 1 previous owner, full Honda service history and has only done 40k miles.

If battery is original it is over 7 years old - OEM battery may give good service for 5 years if you are lucky, but after that living on borrowed time - get a Yuasa one in there.

Dealer service history is not worth the paper it is stamped on, it is only used to blackmail people into giving dealer money for often doing little more than cleaning the car 'to keep your warranty' ,  I have bought cars at about 3 years old with full dealer service history and (because I do my own servicing and get down and dirty with cars) have seen oil filters with major rust on them (original, never been changed) air filters that were so black and clogged it is a wonder the engine ran at all,  and cabin filters so clogged its a wonder the people in the car could breathe.

[Jocko]

My car came with a full service. When I checked it, the air filter was black and there was no pollen filter fitted!

[guest7027]

Culzean did you manage test yours out today with the pinking thing?

I checked my air filter and in fairness it looks new as does the pollen filter. Oil looks golden too and is at the right level so at least it looks fairly well maintained...