Author Topic: Steel wheels and winter tyres  (Read 5663 times)

Katby

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Steel wheels and winter tyres
« on: January 22, 2019, 06:13:18 PM »
Hi all,  just purchased a Jazz EX NAVI today for pick up Friday.

I'm very confused amd hope someone can advise. I would like steel wheels and winter tyres for this car. I have steel wheels plus tyres from my old jazz an 04 se. I doubt they will fit?

What is the best size and offset? To go for please?

Thanks in advance

Kat

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2019, 06:35:40 PM »
I think all jazz wheels will fit, with 4 fixing studs and the same overall diameter.

andruec

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2019, 06:53:17 PM »

culzean

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2019, 07:09:56 PM »
Go to my tyres.co.uk and put car details in,  if you have a problem search the forum for mytyres or winter tyres and there will be links ..

https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=6492.msg27797#msg27797

Links to mytyres    175/65R15 steel rims and  winter tyres to replace 16" 185/55R16 - narrower tyres are better in winter and give a better ride,  outside diameter is identical, I do not even have to recalibrate the TPMS on her indoors Jazz mk2 when changing winter summer tyres and the other way. 

Mytyres will deliver steel wheels fitted with tyres already balanced nd ready to fit, winter tyres are normally directional ( you have to fit wheels to correct side of car ) so look for the arrow on side wall which shows the direction of wheel rotation when car is going forwards, the tyres will be fitted opposite way on pairs of wheels, two for each side of car.  The normal Honda wheel nuts are good for alloys or steel rims.  Nokian WR D3 or D4 are excellent winter tyres.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2019, 07:43:03 PM by culzean »
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Katby

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2019, 07:34:15 PM »
Thanks very much everyone

Switz

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2019, 10:46:03 PM »
Am I right in thinking the tyre pressure sensors work on the rotation of the wheels and don’t have sensors fitted in the rim? 


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Kenneve

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2019, 08:09:50 AM »
I have to ask.
Unless you live out in the wilds of the countryside, or perhaps the Highlands of Scotland, do we really need winter tyres on any family  car in the U.K.
I probably agree the use of steel wheels in the winter, but in over 60 years of driving, I have never had to change the tyres on any vehicle that I have owned, for winter driving.
It's obviously important to ensure that your tyres are in good condition at all times and when the road conditions are poor, surely you accordingly?

John Ratsey

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2019, 08:17:41 AM »
Am I right in thinking the tyre pressure sensors work on the rotation of the wheels and don’t have sensors fitted in the rim? 
Yes - based on wheel rotation. See https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=8667.0.
2022 HR-V Elegance, previously 2020 Jazz Crosstar

Jocko

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2019, 08:37:22 AM »
I have never had, or needed, winter tyres. We get snow and ice so seldom it is not worth while. On the one day it is bad I just leave the car in the garage!
When I worked in Greenock I bought a set of snow chains. 10 years later I sold the car with them still in the boot, unused!

culzean

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2019, 10:02:31 AM »
I have to ask.
Unless you live out in the wilds of the countryside, or perhaps the Highlands of Scotland, do we really need winter tyres on any family  car in the U.K.
I probably agree the use of steel wheels in the winter, but in over 60 years of driving, I have never had to change the tyres on any vehicle that I have owned, for winter driving.
It's obviously important to ensure that your tyres are in good condition at all times and when the road conditions are poor, surely you accordingly?

Winter tyres are like chalk and cheese with summers in ice and snow ( or even just cold and wet roads)- I used to be out to get to work very early and before I got winters I used to have to go out even earlier and clear the hill out of our estate and salt it from the bins,  not what you really want to be doing at 4AM.   After winters fitted I used to sail up the road and left the untouched road for later users to get stuck on ( I doubt they ever realised I had cleaned the road for them before) a lot of cars on our estate used to park along the main road about half a mile from our estate and walk rather than try to get up or down the twisty hill.  Remember that winters are much, much better for steering and braking as well,  it is not all about traction,  more about grip.   IIRC roads in Scotland have a much grippier surface than English roads,  there are warnings on my motorbike forum about extra tyre wear when in Scotland......

I have been through some of the worst winters in living memory on cars ( some rear wheel drive with a bag of sand or a paving slab in the boot ) with summer tyres but it was a struggle and you were always liable to get pretty well stuck and need outside help with pushing,  but with winter tyres it is a breeze. My wifes Nokian WRD3 are on their 4th winter and the present Nokians on my Civic on their 3rd while the alloys are snug in the garage ready waxed for spring.  If you want to use steel wheels in winter what is the point in having summer tyres on them ?  Winter tyres are not as expensive as summers anyway,  and while your winters are wearing your summers are not.  It is also easy to wash down steel wheels and slap a coat of Hammerite on them if required,  something you would not do with alloys which can get very expensive to refurbish properly.   Alloys really take a hammering when roads are salted,  and steel wheels protect the brakes ( especially the stupid Jazz rear discs) from a lot of crap because they have far less open area than alloys.


I am happy when my wife goes out in dodgy weather that she can get where she want to go and her tyres will not be the cause of her getting stuck somehwere,  we have some pretty good hills in Shropshire that are deadly when snow on them.

The only real extra expense is the steel rims,  as your summer tyres get no wear for six months of the year - but unlike alloys steel rims last for ever with little care.  I suppose it depends how long you keep a vehicle and if the rims will fit your next one as I doubt many garages or private buyers would want to pay for your steel rims / winter tyres when buying the car.

here is a great test and video for anyone who doubts how good winter tyres are.  Two videos, one at the snowdome and another showing tyres when road temp is below 7 deg C.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/66692/winter-tyres-4x4-grip-test-video
« Last Edit: January 23, 2019, 12:19:20 PM by culzean »
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John A

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2019, 10:17:05 AM »
Winter tyres are like chalk and cheese with summers in ice and snow - I used to be out to get to work very early and before I got winters I used to have to go out even earlier and clear the hill out of our estate and salt it from the bins,  not what you really want to be doing at 4AM.   After winters fitted I used to sail up the road and left the untouched road for later users to get stuck on ( I doubt they ever realised I had cleaned the road for them before) a lot of cars on our estate used to park along the main road about half a mile from our estate and walk rather than try to get up or down the twisty hill.  Remember that winters are much, much better for steering and braking as well,  it is not all about traction,  more about grip.   IIRC roads in Scotland have a much grippier surface than English roads,  there are warnings on my motorbike forum about extra tyre wear when in Scotland......

I have all season tyres on my card, usually Scotland's weather doesn't get to the temperatures in the south-east of England, so I reckon they're a good compromise for me. Had winter tyres on my Qashqai and it would go up hills in two wheel drive that were impassible if summer ones were fitted.
I'm sure that the tyres do wear much quicker up here, but don't ask me to prove it!

culzean

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2019, 11:10:23 AM »
https://www.wheel-size.com/size/honda/jazz/2004/

You need to be careful as the 2004 Jazz was fitted with 14" or 15" wheels where later ones probably had 15" or 16" rims.

The difference in tyre rolling radius between 185/55R16 ( on 16" rims) and 175/65R15 ( on 15" rims) is negligible - but I don't know what tyre you could fit to a 14" rim to get the same radius,  so you need to know what your original rims and tyres are ( will be on the sidewall of tyre).  Even then I doubt the 14" rims will clear the brake calipers even if you can fit them instead of 16" rims,  or what your speedometer will read..

https://tiresize.com/tyre-size-calculator/
« Last Edit: January 23, 2019, 11:14:01 AM by culzean »
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jazzaro

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2019, 10:13:38 PM »
Last weekend I was in  Oxfordshire, and I was surprised seeing that only few cars fit winter tires. In Italy winter equipment is compulsory from october to april (winter tires or snow chains), and many italians (living in northern regions, Tuscany and over) use winter tires, surely more than in Oxfordshire. Does it happen  only in that region?
Anyway, I own a Jazz Elegance Navi (same trim of your EX Navi but the steering wheel in another position), and I can  only fit 16' tires, summer or winter.

andruec

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2019, 08:39:43 AM »
Last weekend I was in  Oxfordshire, and I was surprised seeing that only few cars fit winter tires. In Italy winter equipment is compulsory from october to april (winter tires or snow chains), and many italians (living in northern regions, Tuscany and over) use winter tires, surely more than in Oxfordshire.
Very few UK car owners bother with winter tyres. The country as a whole doesn't do much preparation for winter weather because there's just not much need for it, least-wise not in the southern half where most of us live. Anywhere south of Birmingham or near the coast might see one or two snow falls every couple of years and most winters the only snow we see is on the tops of high hills (of which we don't have very many). And any snow that does fall on roads is typically wiped away by the early commuters. Occasionally we get a really bad winter like the last one where entire days (gosh!) can have snow on the road all day. But that's unusual. So for most of us there's probably only a couple of days every few years where winter tyres are needed. Add to that the hassle of changing them. The problems of storing them. The cost of two sets of tyres. And..meh.

Up north (where it's grim :) ) the risk of snow and ice is slightly higher, compounded by lower traffic density so roads are quieter and more prone to icing up but it still probably only amounts to half a dozen days and there are still years when they see no snow at all.

Yesterday was bad by our standards (although my particular area - South Northamptonshire/North Oxfordshire had no snow at all) but I bet this morning most of the roads are clear of snow and winter tyres are no longer needed. That could well be the one and only snowy day most people see, although we're not out of the woods really until Easter.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2019, 08:43:58 AM by andruec »

culzean

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Re: Steel wheels and winter tyres
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2019, 09:03:01 AM »
The 'cost' of winter tyres is really only the steel rims - and they last forever with little maintenance ( unlike alloys ).  It is really the salt that does the damage to alloys ( unless you skid into kerb, which is a lot more likely in winter)  and alloys are not cheap to get refurbished,  if you have diamond cut ( which are getting more common ) it can be around £100 per wheel.  You can get winter tyres on steel rims from somewhere like mytyres for about £80.  You also only wear one set of tyres at a time.  I agree storage may be a problem for some but instead of buying a full size spare or useless spavesaver you can use a winter as a summer spare and summer as winter spare, so only 3 wheels to store and you saved the cost of a dedicated spare.

It is well known that once road temperature drops below 7degC the rubber in summer tyres hardens up enough to significantly affect grip.  Don't think of them as snow tyres, they are 'winter tyres', designed for colder temperatures. They also work well in mud due to directional self-cleaning tread.

I was a sceptic for a long time about winter tyres,  but eventually got some because of a bad winter and I was commuting over 40 miles each way to work in hilly areas with a lot of 'B' roads, they proved their worth many times since.  Even getting off our estate is a problem as we have a twisty hill gets no sun and we are quite high up, so any snow does not melt of its own accord and you often find people have stolen the salt out of the council bins for their own driveways,  so no good looking in there.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

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