Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk1 2002-2008 => Topic started by: guest7946 on September 25, 2018, 09:18:36 AM
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hi all after putting a new motor in my 02 1.5 ltr jazz every thing is connected as it should be it starts and runs for about 10 seconds then stops
once it starts even with the throttle done it still cuts out
any help would be appreciated
cheers
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I take it there are no codes showing up? Sounds like a classic case of fuel starvation, though I don't know how likely that is in these days of fuel injection and high pressure pumps!
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i haven't got a code reader at the moment but it does look like fuel issues but how does the air get out of the line there doent seem to be a return line on the fuel rail
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Can't add much more, getting any fault codes read would probably be a good start. Any cheap basic EOBD/OBDII code reader will help diagnose any engine problems, but they will only connect to the engine ECU, and not to any other systems on the car.
If you get air in the system, it should bleed itself through the injectors.
Is it a cough-splutter type stop, or a dead cut out?
Possible fuel starvation, as Jocko says. Could be fuel pump, fuel pump relay, fuse, blocked fuel filter, etc.. Could also be something unrelated, crank sensor maybe, this should show up as a trouble code.
Also consider immobiliser - I'm not sure if the Jazz immobiliser cuts ignition, or fuel pump - some cars which cut the latter exhibit similar symptoms when the immobiliser is not disarmed.
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its a dead stop fuel pump seems to be ok you can hear it start then stop when you turn key on
the other motor ran fine untill the cam chain snapped and that was only a week ago so hasnt been sitting i was told the motor would just bolt in without any issues
when it does start it sounds and runs great then stops and some times it can take a couple of goes to get it going
how long would it take to get air out of the system im used to fuel rails with retune lines
and thanks for your help so far
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Any volumes of air which would stop it running at all should be expelled quickly through the injectors, because it's gas it passes through quickly. You may then get some spluttering for a minute or so, but not normally enough to stop the engine.
Does it run for the same length of time each time it does start? Would you say exactly, more or less, or not at all?
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The immobiliser disables the fuel pump. Perhaps it allows the pump to charge the fuel rail then turns the pump off. Once the pressure of the fuel in the fuel rail drops the engine will stop. Did you swap the ECU with the engine? If so it may be worth trying your original ECU. I certainly sounds like something you changed when you swapped the engine. Or have you just left something disconnected? Maybe a sensor somewhere.
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The immobiliser disables the fuel pump. Perhaps it allows the pump to charge the fuel rail then turns the pump off. Once the pressure of the fuel in the fuel rail drops the engine will stop.
If it is that type, then that's pretty much how many of them work. The fuel rail is initially charged and the engine will start, if the BECM doesn't then receive the correct response from the immobiliser within a fixed time, it tells the engine ECU to shut down.
When swapping out engines, it's best to swap only the bare engine, if you start mixing and matching with engine electrics you can run into problems with coded parts. Swap nothing, or swap everything - including the ECUs and immobiliser ring, etc., etc.... well, everything. As Jocko says, it may just be something you have forget to reconnect.
Getting a code reader on it is the answer, or you could be going round in circles for days. If it's a sensor or something, an OBDII reader will probably sort you out. If it's a BECM related issue, you may get enough clues from OBDII to figure out what's happening, but you may need Honda HDS.
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thanks more things to check
the motor cam with every thing on it so i just changed it over leaving all censers on the new motor as it came with them so if it is a censor issue with the ecu which one would be more of an issue
i didnt change the ecu and didnt get one with the motor as didnt want to have immobiliser issues
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The first pic is of the original part with 1 electrical plug
The 2nd pic is what cam with the motor with 2 plugs
The original wiring loom with the car only has 1 plug so will change part over and see if this works
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Anything that isn't a simple inductive sensor I would swap, and in particular anything that is in any way different.
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Ok so i have replaced crank cender put on origanal fuel rail and injectors and all plug in parts with air flow still doing same thing
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Aaargh.
I would think your next step is a cheap OBDII reader. Hopefully, it should throw some fault code/s up, but if it is immobiliser related, you may need Honda HDS or clone.
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Hi all i managed to get a code reader from one of our mechanics and he cleared all codes for me and then rescaned
codes that came up was po118 wont clear and ect sencor1 high so where do i go from here
cheers all your help has been great
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po118 is engine coolant temperature, so swap over the temperature sensor from the old block.
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planing on doing that tomorrow thought it was strange but makes sense reads to hot and adjusts timing and fuel to suit and adjust to much and not running we did notice when codes where cleared and we tried to re start it was backfiring
so is this the one in the block at the front behind the starter
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Hi all i managed to get a code reader from one of our mechanics and he cleared all codes for me and then rescaned
codes that came up was po118 wont clear and ect sencor1 high so where do i go from here
cheers all your help has been great
https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/p0118-obd-ii-trouble-code-engine-coolant-temperature-ect-sensor-circuit-high-open-problem-by-jay-safford
open circuit could be a broken wire or connection, or maybe something not plugged in when engine was swapped - best to eyeball the sensor and plugs first to see if anything obvious as it may not be the sensor that is faulty.
article says po118 will cause engine to go into rich fuel mode and maybe run rough, so it should start and run at coldest temperatures but will be getting too much fuel - so the opposite of fuel starvation
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Sounds like the cootant temp. sender is disconnected or faulty.
The backfiring could be due to excess fuel, the engine may be flooded. Some ECUs discontinue ignition to save the engine under certain fault conditions, which would flood the engine.
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good hopefully were going the right way
so which of the sender is it there about 4 coming from the block and head i could change them all but would like to just change what ti need just to get it started
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The coolant sensor is at the transmission end of engine at the back of block - warning in haynes manual not to confuse it with camshaft position sensor just below it - need to take off airbox.
PDF photo of Haynes manual page attached..
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The coolant sensor is at the transmission end of engine at the back of block - warning in haynes manual not to confuse it with camshaft position sensor just below it - need to take off airbox.
PDF photo of Haynes manual page attached..
The op's car has the 1.5 VTEC engine, I'm not sure how similar it is to the i-DSI engine?
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The coolant sensor is at the transmission end of engine at the back of block - warning in haynes manual not to confuse it with camshaft position sensor just below it - need to take off airbox.
PDF photo of Haynes manual page attached..
The op's car has the 1.5 VTEC engine, I'm not sure how similar it is to the i-DSI engine?
Honda also produced a 1.5 litre I-Dsi 8 valve twin spark which I would suppose was a bored out 1.3.
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Honda also produced a 1.5 litre I-Dsi 8 valve twin spark which I would suppose was a bored out 1.3.
Not 100% on this, but I think all of the early Jazz/Fit 1.5 built for the Aus market were VTEC.
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Honda also produced a 1.5 litre I-Dsi 8 valve twin spark which I would suppose was a bored out 1.3.
I believe that was only available in cars for the Japanese market. It was a longer stroke version of the i-DSi engines available here.
Sensor for the 1.5 engine appears to be fitted to the water pump mounting, the same as on the other L series engines.
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;D ;D Woo Hoo its running after all that mucking around pulled it apart ready to change the sender and found out i put the plug on but the little clip that holds the connection on was broken and the plug had came off just enough to not send signal it looked as it was connected but alas no
so used the spare plug and all good starts and runs like a dream
so thanks to everyone's help its been a struggle for me not to good with all this efi vti stuff
50 yrs old give me a carby and points any day lol
I cant express how great full I am to you all and your help-fullness
Cheers Wayne
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give me a carby and points any day
Me too, Wayne. At 70 years old all this electronics just spoils working on cars for me. I like to be able to look at a thing and tell if it is broke or not!
So well done, and don't go leaving us now your car is going. We welcome the perspective from "down under".
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No chance of leaving i havent found a Assie forum yet lol no love this forum helpfull freindly
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;D ;D Woo Hoo its running
Great stuff! 8)
Always nice to hear a success story :)
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It is good to having it running thanks to all your help