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Off Topic (Non-Honda) / Re: Electric cars
« Last post by culzean on Today at 03:19:12 PM »
This morning in Gloucestershire thick fog. My Jazz dipped headlights, intermittent wipers and no I didn't use rear fog as a Nissan Leaf was close behind. I saw 3 Nissan Leafs in the 17 mile journey, none had lights on apart from the daytime running lights so no rear lights. The leaf following me had an invisible driver, he did one wipe in 10 miles (that I could see) and disappeared from view behind the buildup of moisture on his windscreen. I confess I was unnerved, the only saving grace was the front car in a series of about 10 (convoy) was only doing about 30mph. I understand battery saving but these EV drivers are acting in a very irresponsible manner not using lights in fog.

I have noticed a few Nissan Leaf driving around slowly (slowest was 35 in 60 limit main road, slower than the average tractor these days),  can't say I have noticed lack of lights though I have never seen one in fog (most people don't see things in fog, maybe I should look harder when it is foggy ).
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Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - / Re: My New MK3 Jazz
« Last post by andruec on Today at 12:20:30 PM »
I was not trying to be harsh to the manufacturers.  It is in their interest to put their product in the best light - look how far many have been prepared to go though.  Not running the engine when you have are stationary for an extended period makes sense but I doubt many would see a saving of 5-10% in the real world.  In a test like this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_European_Driving_Cycle it is not that surprising as more than 10% of the ECE-15 (urban) test is spent at idle (i.e. stopped).
That's true although I note this from the article:
"The cycle must be performed on a cold vehicle at 2030 C (typically run at 25 C)"
and
" Total duration is 780 s (13 minutes)" for Urban and "6 minutes" for Extra Urban.

So the I/S won't be working for probably the first half of the first test and likely not at all for the second test. Even yesterday with my car sat in the sun all day with 24 degrees when I drove home the I/S wasn't working for the first ~5m.
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You make some very good points I just think we have a slightly different opinion on this one  ;)
Oh aye, no offence meant :)
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Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - / Re: My New MK3 Jazz
« Last post by andruec on Today at 12:14:01 PM »
Some good responses. Grateful for the advice about coming to a stop - obvious really! I agree that, as you get used to the system, you can finesse your pressure on the brake pedal especially at roundabouts and, in time, get quite good at not triggering the idle stop in these situations.
Yeah, I quite like it for that reason. I enjoy driving and for me controlling I/S is another skill to develop. I'm also very much into efficient driving so it adds to the challenge. Stopping only when absolutely necessary and never for less than five seconds :)

But for someone just wanting to get from A to B I can imagine it being a nuisance. On those rare occasions when it has switched the engine off just when I want to accelerate it's very shocking and frustrating. In a more powerful car it could be dangerous as well if you are trying to leap into a gap. Luckily the Jazz CVT doesn't do jack rabbit starts anyway (presumably protecting the belt) so if the car refuses to move when you jab the accelerator it's unlikely to leave you stranded.
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As regards engine wear, I realise these systems are relatively new but is there any evidence of premature wear. The battery and the starter are uprated and not all the oil will have drained back down into the sump - there will still be a protective covering - it's not like starting from cold every time.
No idea. I will say that I can't see any difference in the battery after two years either.
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For me, the CO2 stuff is secondary (we need to reduce CO2 but these systems are not a game changer), the real impact is in emissions at pavement level so I think they have a role to play in improving air quality.
Agreed. A few %ge points less fuel consumption ain't going to change the world but if cars didn't run their engines while stationary in queues the air in towns would be a bit cleaner. Although I believe that even when I/S starts it still emits a little puff of extra pollution so it's not perfect.
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Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - / Re: My New MK3 Jazz
« Last post by t5nel on Today at 12:06:34 PM »
It's a bit of both. There have been several independent studies that suggest idle stop typically reduces overall fuel consumption between 5% and 10% depending on the vehicle and the type of driving. As far as the cost of recharging the battery is concerned that is minimal. Don't forget that the engine starts within a quarter of a second so the starter motor barely nudges the engine. The same studies typically suggest that the engine only has to be off for two to three seconds for stopping it to be worthwhile. Or put another way - three seconds of idling burns as much fuel as it takes to replace the battery charge lost by idle restart.

I'm not sure about it being fair to be harsh with manufacturers. I've now found a few articles that suggest that idling and stopping aren't that big a part of the testing so an I/S system doesn't sound like it would have much effect. But either way I wouldn't call it gaming the system since it's a pretty obvious feature. Overall is I/S worth it to us as drivers? I dunno. Given the extra cost of R&D and manufacturing costs I bet there's not a lot in it. But having bought a car with I/S it seems silly not to utilise it. Even if the end result is a greater cost to us at least using it will reduce that cost.


I was not trying to be harsh to the manufacturers.  It is in their interest to put their product in the best light - look how far many have been prepared to go though.  Not running the engine when you have are stationary for an extended period makes sense but I doubt many would see a saving of 5-10% in the real world.  In a test like this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_European_Driving_Cycle it is not that surprising as more than 10% of the ECE-15 (urban) test is spent at idle (i.e. stopped).

You make some very good points I just think we have a slightly different opinion on this one  ;)
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Honda Jazz Mk2 2008-2015 / Re: Rear pads
« Last post by Danno on Today at 12:00:31 PM »
Forgot to say, a schematic is within the workshop manual on forum.
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Honda Jazz Mk2 2008-2015 / Re: Rear pads
« Last post by Danno on Today at 11:59:04 AM »
Not had an issue with our 09 handbrake which is on 100k miles. I'm about to change discs and pads through wear. From experience on previous cars with the same setup, it is critical to reset the calipers correctly following work if you want the handbrake to be efficient, so you may benefit from cleaning and resetting them so you know they're done correctly. Also, a cable only needs to have slight corrosion internally for it to affect operation so I've learned to be pay close attention when checking them.
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Honda Jazz Mk2 2008-2015 / Re: Rear pads
« Last post by Jocko on Today at 11:23:41 AM »
When I bought my Jazz I was warned by the trader (a time-served Honda mechanic), that the handbrake on the Jazz was "not the best". His advice to me was, "Always apply the footbrake firmly, before applying the handbrake". I have followed that advice, religiously, and never had the least bit of bother.
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Honda Jazz Mk2 2008-2015 / Rear pads
« Last post by coffeecup on Today at 11:18:43 AM »
Hi

Anyone got a schematic of the rear brake/handbrake set up, going to try and improve handbrake, change pads and clean up discs.

mike

2010 1.4 i-shift
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The only downside is that they try to get you in early so in essence the plan is shorter. I'm currently 3 months early because it's progressively been brought forward. And you do also get a discounted mot by taking out the plan

Interesting because my car had it's first service in January last year but it wasn't actually due until March. I aim to edge the annual service back to the March anniversary over the next 2 services always ensuring I stick with any deadlines. The mileage won't be an issue (3,000 ish pa) so it will only be the time. 3 weeks next year and another 3 weeks the year after.
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Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - / Re: My New MK3 Jazz
« Last post by peteo48 on Today at 10:19:55 AM »
Some good responses. Grateful for the advice about coming to a stop - obvious really! I agree that, as you get used to the system, you can finesse your pressure on the brake pedal especially at roundabouts and, in time, get quite good at not triggering the idle stop in these situations.

As regards engine wear, I realise these systems are relatively new but is there any evidence of premature wear. The battery and the starter are uprated and not all the oil will have drained back down into the sump - there will still be a protective covering - it's not like starting from cold every time.

For me, the CO2 stuff is secondary (we need to reduce CO2 but these systems are not a game changer), the real impact is in emissions at pavement level so I think they have a role to play in improving air quality.
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