Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk1 2002-2008 => Topic started by: Eemahn on September 16, 2018, 09:02:51 PM
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2006 1.4 DSI-SE Manual
There is a whine coming from 1st gear then it quietens in 2nd gear and almost disappears in 3rd. Does anyone know what it could be? Your advice would be most appreciated.
Thank you.
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Welcome. It sounds like you could have the start of the dreaded input shaft bearing syndrome, which effected Mk 1 models of that age. With the engine running and the car in neutral, can you hear the noise? If you depress the clutch, does it go away? A noisy clutch release bearing only makes a noise as you activate the clutch, so it isn't audible when the clutch is not actuated. The gearbox input bearing is.
The good news is it will not fail. The bad noise is it will get steadily worse.
I took my car to a reasonably local Gearbox specialist (http://www.topgear.uk.net/home.html (http://www.topgear.uk.net/home.html)) and they replaced all the bearings and seals, with the gearbox in situ, for £324, which included parts and VAT.
My local garage quoted well over £1,000.
The car is now like new. I have since done 6.000 trouble free miles.
Best of luck.
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2006 1.4 DSI-SE Manual
There is a whine coming from 1st gear then it quietens in 2nd gear and almost disappears in 3rd. Does anyone know what it could be? Your advice would be most appreciated.
Thank you.
Gearbox input shaft bearing - if left it will gradually get louder and work its way up the gears, but as Jocko says it won't fail. When the offending bearing is removed and inspected there will be a very slight roughness in the bearing caused by the race getting pitted, but it will never leave you stranded at side of the road. This is not a design problem but was caused by a bad batch of bearings from supplier and I believe other car makers were affected.
If your car did a lot of local miles with stopping and starting and acceleration in lower gears the problem would show up sooner than if your car did mostly main road miles. My wife's mk1 had gearbox done at about 70k, my identical year mk1 did 120k before I traded it I and still had no noise, the difference was she did local miles and I did longer main road driving.
Mind you, car makers have been using ball bearings instead of longer lasting roller bearings to try to reduce friction, cost and weight, this means rear wheel bearings tend to get noisy and fail MOT at about 40k.
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this means rear wheel bearings tend to get noisy and fail MOT at about 40k.
Mine are still the originals. At 107,000 miles!
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this means rear wheel bearings tend to get noisy and fail MOT at about 40k.
Mine are still the originals. At 107,000 miles!
All the ones on our earlier Jazzes had to be replaced ( by me) at or around 40k.
Maybe they changed something for the 2006 model due to number of failures. Can anyone with 2006 or later mk1 tell their rear wheel bearing experience.
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this means rear wheel bearings tend to get noisy and fail MOT at about 40k.
Mine are still the originals. At 107,000 miles!
All the ones on our earlier Jazzes had to be replaced ( by me) at or around 40k.
Maybe they changed something for the 2006 model due to number of failures. Can anyone with 2006 or later mk1 tell their rear wheel bearing experience.
I have a 07 model with 57k on the clock and all bearings seem ok so far
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Welcome. It sounds like you could have the start of the dreaded input shaft bearing syndrome, which effected Mk 1 models of that age. With the engine running and the car in neutral, can you hear the noise? If you depress the clutch, does it go away? A noisy clutch release bearing only makes a noise as you activate the clutch, so it isn't audible when the clutch is not actuated. The gearbox input bearing is.
The good news is it will not fail. The bad noise is it will get steadily worse.
I took my car to a reasonably local Gearbox specialist (http://www.topgear.uk.net/home.html (http://www.topgear.uk.net/home.html)) and they replaced all the bearings and seals, with the gearbox in situ, for £324, which included parts and VAT.
My local garage quoted well over £1,000.
The car is now like new. I have since done 6.000 trouble free miles.
Best of luck.
Thanks for the replys Jocko and culzean I have done the test and It looks like it is defiantly the gearbox. but mind you it has done nearly 73K miles so not too bad going. I checked out the link you added, its a bit far for me because I am based in Huddersfield West Yorkshire if there was any local I would defiantly be checking it out because I'm going to have to get this done. As Culzean has mentioned its better to get it done sooner than later to stop more damage happening to my gearbox. Thanks for the replys everyone.
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this means rear wheel bearings tend to get noisy and fail MOT at about 40k.
Mine are still the originals. At 107,000 miles!
All the ones on our earlier Jazzes had to be replaced ( by me) at or around 40k.
Maybe they changed something for the 2006 model due to number of failures. Can anyone with 2006 or later mk1 tell their rear wheel bearing experience.
I have a 07 model with 57k on the clock and all bearings seem ok so far
Mine is a 56 plate (2006) I can check the rear wheel bearing tomorrow and let you guys know what I find.
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Just to add the bearing issues were down to metal swarf not being removed from gearboxes and destroying the bearings
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I am based in Huddersfield West Yorkshire
Give these guys a shout.
http://www.knightsbridgetransmissions.co.uk/ (http://www.knightsbridgetransmissions.co.uk/)
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I am based in Huddersfield West Yorkshire
Give these guys a shout.
http://www.knightsbridgetransmissions.co.uk/ (http://www.knightsbridgetransmissions.co.uk/)
Thanks jocko I will give them a call tomorrow morning.
cheers mate
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this means rear wheel bearings tend to get noisy and fail MOT at about 40k.
Mine are still the originals. At 107,000 miles!
I recently had to change the NSR hub, looked like an original, complete with the factory yellow paint splodge.
Around 155,000 miles, so you can't really complain, can you? 8)
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Just to add the bearing issues were down to metal swarf not being removed from gearboxes and destroying the bearings
Is this an issue that can be prevented by changing the gear box oil?
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Just to add the bearing issues were down to metal swarf not being removed from gearboxes and destroying the bearings
Is this an issue that can be prevented by changing the gear box oil?
Had Honda known about it at the time probably, but as it was only picked up after gearboxes had been used it was to late.
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What I mean is that for those of us who haven't had this problem (yet), would it be a very good preventative idea to change the gearbox oil regularly, or would that not make much difference?
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Yes anyone with a GD1 jazz should change the oil at the very least. The damage i.e. the amount is anybodies guess.
Like I said by the time owners started complaining of the noise it was too late. The oil and swarf had done its damage.
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Regular oil changes are a great idea, but unless you are on a forum like this the average Jazz owner has no idea there is a problem with early model gearboxes and will feel safe going by the book. Until I joined Clubjazz I had no idea there was a problem, and after 90K miles any damage was done. In fact, by the first normal gearbox oil change at 72K/six years the damage was probably already catastrophic.
Personally I don't believe swarf was the problem, as it is always input shaft bearing that fails. I would have thought swarf would affect the entire gearbox. The rest of my bearings came out like new. I suspect a change of spec for that bearing was probably behind the issue, as manufacturers try to go cheaper and cheaper with components.
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Regular oil changes are a great idea, but unless you are on a forum like this the average Jazz owner has no idea there is a problem with early model gearboxes and will feel safe going by the book. Until I joined Clubjazz I had no idea there was a problem, and after 90K miles any damage was done. In fact, by the first normal gearbox oil change at 72K/six years the damage was probably already catastrophic.
Personally I don't believe swarf was the problem, as it is always input shaft bearing that fails. I would have thought swarf would affect the entire gearbox. The rest of my bearings came out like new. I suspect a change of spec for that bearing was probably behind the issue, as manufacturers try to go cheaper and cheaper with components.
You are right it is not swarf. The best information I saw was that is was a bad batch of bearings supplied, and it affected more than Honda vehicles, as far as I know from my mechanic mate they replaced bearing with same design ( he said it was just slight pitting of the race and to be honest he showed me the bearing from my wifes 80,000 mile Jazz and we spun it and just the faintest whirring noise and it spun very freely) . Not sure that extra oil changes would do any good as gearbox oil does not get contaminated like engine oil does, the only thing in my Jazz that did 120,000 miles without problem - only thing was that I did mainly main road miles and the gearbox has molyslip added, my wife did local miles mainly, using lower gears more.
It is like the NASA astronaut said when someone asked him what it was like to be launched into space, he replied "how would you feel sitting on top of a complicated, explosive rocket containing thousands of components knowing that each one had been sourced from the lowest bidder ?"
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You are right it is not swarf. The best information I saw was that is was a bad batch of bearings supplied, and it affected more than Honda vehicles.
As this is a known manufacturing fault because of a defective part shouldn't Honda be doing a product recall and paying for it to be fixed, instead of me having to take it to a gearbox specialist next week and paying a lot of money to fix their mistake?
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I believe they did an extended warranty to cover the fault, but that is long gone. The cars involved are now 10 years old so we are on our own.
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I believe they did an extended warranty to cover the fault, but that is long gone. The cars involved are now 10 years old so we are on our own.
Thanks Jocko but I thought if someone makes a mistake they should man up and take it no matter how long the warranty is. oh well, it doesn't matter I have got it booked in next week for repair.
Thanks anyway
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Can I ask what you are being charged? If you'd rather not say, I'll understand.
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I believe they did an extended warranty to cover the fault, but that is long gone. The cars involved are now 10 years old so we are on our own.
Thanks Jocko but I thought if someone makes a mistake they should man up and take it no matter how long the warranty is. oh well, it doesn't matter I have got it booked in next week for repair.
Thanks anyway
No car company ( or any company who want to stay in business ) would give a 10 year guarantee on a vehicle covering every little part, IIRC this was a slightly below spec part from a supplier (Honda do not make ball bearings ). Honda issued an extended warranty ( I think cars up 7 year old with FSH ) as soon as the problem made itself manifest - a car is made up of thousands of parts - many of which are highly stressed and critical to its reliability - Honda have a really good track record of making reliable products, but some things are outside their control.
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Can I ask what you are being charged? If you'd rather not say, I'll understand.
I will be taking it in on Wednesday so they can check it how bad the damage is to the gearbox and then give me a price.
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Can I ask what you are being charged? If you'd rather not say, I'll understand.
I will be taking it in on Wednesday so they can check it how bad the damage is to the gearbox and then give me a price.
Should be pretty much a fixed price as the suspect bearing is well known ( only one bearing involved although they may replace others - but even a set of bearings does not cost much ) main cost is Labour..
But some places will take box out before giving you a price so you are a hostage to them. Did your place do the bearing without taking box out Jocko ?
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Did your place do the bearing without taking box out Jocko ?
Yes. I sent them an email and they quoted me two prices. One for me taking the gearbox out and taking it to them, the other for doing the repair in car. The did not take the gearbox out, but split it in situ. They do about one a month and replaced all the bearings and seals.
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some places will take box out before giving you a price so you are a hostage to them.
This ^^^ is absolutely bang on, take care going down that road.
Exactly as you say, this is a well known issue and you should be able to get a price before the car is touched. If it sounds too dear, shop around.
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I have just noticed now that the gearbox noise doesn't happen when the car's cold but it happens when it is warmed up. could anyone please explain this?
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What part of the gearbox is going when it's hard to get into certain gears? When i go into reverse it's 50/50 whether it works or just sits out of gear even though it seems to be in reverse position, going into 5th needs a good shove as well compared to the rest.
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Hi does anyone know where I could place my 'engine support bar' to support my engine safely without causing damage to the body because I am planning to take my gearbox out.
I am new to this because I have never taken a gearbox out before so any advice will be appreciated.
Thank you.
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