Author Topic: Traffic light timing  (Read 1638 times)

Jocko

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Traffic light timing
« on: October 22, 2018, 07:11:47 AM »
Kirkcaldy must have some of the worst timed traffic lights in the land. This morning I was going for fuel, which saw me hitting about half the traffic lights in the town. Despite a fair part of my journey being on the main A921 through the town I was stopped at almost every light. It is as if they are timed to play awkward bu@@ers. As I approached a green light it would change to red before sitting like that for a full minute or do. There is very little traffic about at 06:30 so I would sit and wait while nothing came through on the green light! Actually, there were three lights, which after sitting for my minute, changed in my favour just as a car approached them from the side road! So it is not just me they have a grudge against!!
There is one set of lights that has a three minute cycle, day and night, and you can regularly sit there with nothing crossing your path. They are even on a bus route. The drivers must get really pi$$ed with them.
There is another set of lights, that recently was put in in place of a roundabout. And they work as a four way set, with only one direction green at a time. It has decimated the amount of traffic using that junction, and, according to the checkout operators of the filling station beside them, the amount of trade they do.
It is little wonder I see many drivers jumping the lights at that time of the morning. One van driver regularly treats a red light, at the three minute junction, as a Give Way sign!

peteo48

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Re: Traffic light timing
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2018, 03:01:37 PM »
Didn't an MP - some time ago now - propose a system where they were turned off at off peak times?

richardfrost

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Re: Traffic light timing
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2018, 03:11:44 PM »
One van driver regularly treats a red light, at the three minute junction, as a Give Way sign!
I think the system of treating a red light as Give Way for Left turns makes eminent sense. Seems to work (for Right turns of course) in the USA.

culzean

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Re: Traffic light timing
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2018, 03:16:39 PM »
Didn't an MP - some time ago now - propose a system where they were turned off at off peak times?

Don't know about peak times, but plenty of calls for them to be turned off outside peak times when they are generally just a nuisance.   Some of the 'part time' traffic lights by us work 24/7 and used to stop me when on my way to work at 4-30am when i was often the only vehicle on the roads - madness.....   Lucy Allan our local MP has raised the topic of useless traffic lights,  she just does not see the need for many of them.     https://www.shropshirestar.com/news/politics/2017/10/25/telford-traffic-light-concerns-raised-at-westminster/

You could left turn on a red light in Australia,  but it was not a blanket thing, there had to be a sign saying it was permitted at that particular junction.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Traffic light timing
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2018, 03:47:35 PM »
When I was working in California, the right turn on red was permitted which was very handy. Where I was it was permitted at every light, unless it was signed otherwise. I also liked the fact that for left turns, you were not permitted to cross over the oncoming lane until they got a red and you had a green filter.
Some countries switch traffic lights to flashing amber at quiet times, and they then become 4 way Stops.
I also like the lights they have in China and Japan, where the green displays a timer, counting down the time you have till they change.

culzean

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Re: Traffic light timing
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2018, 10:17:28 AM »
While UK are going back to crossroads with traffic lights and putting traffic lights on islands other countries are welcoming islands as the best thing since sliced bread and building them apace. IMHO traffic / road engineers just like to mess with things,  and I am sure in most UK councils they get brown envelopes from traffic light companies.  At one local island the engineers put up a short section of black plastic slats like a vertical venetian blind on one of the approach roads - I queried it and they said it was to block the drivers view of the island and make them stop - one problem,  as you approached the island and got within 20 feet you could see the island through the slats anyway, even our local MP criticised it, as it cost over £140,000 ( about 8 years ago ) - it is now falling apart and makes a right eyesore,  and did it prevent accidents, no evidence that it did.

https://www.wsdot.wa.gov/Safety/roundabouts/BasicFacts.htm

Above USA article claims that studies have shown that islands can improve traffic flow 30 to 50%.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

John Ratsey

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Re: Traffic light timing
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2018, 10:23:22 PM »
There's one situation when roundabouts don't work well and that's when there's a dominant flow from one direction which blocks traffic on the next road or two from joining the flow. This dominant flow is often tidal (one way in the morning rush and the the other way in the evening rush). The traffic engineers use this as an excuse to put up traffic lights everywhere (I also suspect that they are provided with incentives by the manufacturers) and they also need to add more lanes to hold the traffic queuing on the rounabout due to the lights (and woe betide anyone who is in the wrong lane which are carefully marked on the tarmac under the vehicles). Often all that is needed is a part time light control for the dominant flow.

Another reason why traffic engineers like lights is that they are predictable and can therefore be modelled. Almost any road change is now subjected to mathematical modelling. Swindon's Magic Roundabout https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_Roundabout_(Swindon) was built nearly 50 years ago when designers used experience not models. Such a solution (which works very well) would not now be proposed as it would be too challenging to model.
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