Author Topic: All Season Tyres for Crosstar  (Read 9339 times)

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #60 on: December 28, 2020, 12:40:24 PM »
Which All Season Tyres? I run Goodyear Vector 4Seasons and have found no difference with the summer tyres I had on previously.
Yes, those are Rating C, the same as the summer tyres I replaced. I fitted Yokohama Bluearth 4S which are Rating E.
Sadly you have the answer in that the Yokohama are much less efficient than Goodyear, Michelin or Continental. What size did you fit and was it the Honda recommended size for your Jazz? This actually highlights the problem I have been going on about  - the choice of tyres is very limited and excludes most of the premium best performing tyres in terms of grip in different conditions and economy.
Hopefully the premium makers will expand their range to include the Jazz size but I fear the volume is likely to be so small that it won’t be economically viable for them to do so. In which case you are stuck with what is available - and that’s not the best!

One reason I ditched the 16" wheels on wifes Jazz and fitted 15",  was much better choice of tyres and another plus is an improved ride ( and quieter ).  Another plus is that tyres are 40 to 50% cheaper.
I can understand your change to 15" to get a better choice of tyres but I assume you went with a higher profile tyre to maintain the circumference, the higher profile will have made a big difference to comfort and noise. It is a balance however and as the Crosstar already has 60 profile tyres a drop to 15" wheels would mean you would have to fit at least 65 profile tyres to maintain the circumference. 65 profile tyres are tall enough to affect handling so maybe not such a simple change.

culzean

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #61 on: December 28, 2020, 12:52:05 PM »
One reason I ditched the 16" wheels on wifes Jazz and fitted 15",  was much better choice of tyres and another plus is an improved ride ( and quieter ).  Another plus is that tyres are 40 to 50% cheaper.
I can understand your change to 15" to get a better choice of tyres but I assume you went with a higher profile tyre to maintain the circumference, the higher profile will have made a big difference to comfort and noise. It is a balance however and as the Crosstar already has 60 profile tyres a drop to 15" wheels would mean you would have to fit at least 65 profile tyres to maintain the circumference. 65 profile tyres are tall enough to affect handling so maybe not such a simple change.

No discernable affect on handling with 15", swapped 185/55R16  for 175/65R15.  More comfort and cheaper tyres, its a win win really.  The lower profile 185 tyres on a Jazz are more of a cosmetic thing than anything.  With the higher profile of the 175 tyres allowing more 'squash' in the tyres the amount of rubber on the road is probably same with both sizes.  Not so worried about potholes now as there is more space between rim and road to absorb any impact.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #62 on: December 28, 2020, 01:27:08 PM »
But if you replaced on a like for like basis I don't understand why the economy suffered?
Did anything else change at the same time?
I swapped from Bluearth summer tyres to Bluearth all-weather tyres.

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #63 on: December 28, 2020, 01:48:17 PM »
Sorry, you said that and I didn't pick it up. That explains the difference.

Downsizer

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #64 on: December 28, 2020, 01:48:39 PM »
With the higher profile of the 175 tyres allowing more 'squash' in the tyres the amount of rubber on the road is probably same with both sizes.
I think you’re right about the area of contact rubber being the same, but not because of increased squashiness.  The tyre pressure and the loading on each tyre must determine the amount of contact.  lbs loading divided by lbs/sq in = sq ins contact.  So a narrower tyre at the same pressure will have a longer bit in contact with the road. Or am I oversimplifying?

Jocko

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #65 on: December 28, 2020, 01:59:17 PM »
From what I have read the vehicle weight and the tyre pressure determine the contact patch with very little input from diameter, width or ratio. Maybe jazzaro can bring some of his expertise to the discussion.

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #66 on: December 28, 2020, 02:01:58 PM »
The change will reduce the tyre width by circa 5% while increasing the sidewall height by almost 12%. Because the overall tyre circumference is almost identical it means the rubber/road contact area could be less depending on pressure, wear etc, but whether
 5% would make any difference to roadholding I doubt - unless you drive on the edge of course!! Sidewall height is likely to make a bigger difference to roadholding and feel but again in normal driving probably not significant.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2020, 02:04:21 PM by Expatman »

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #67 on: December 28, 2020, 03:14:00 PM »
Culzean - quick thought, what did your insurance company say when you changed the wheel/tyres? Did they charge you a higher premium or just note the change?

Jocko

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #68 on: December 28, 2020, 03:26:41 PM »
Some cars, mine, for instance, can be purchased with more than one wheel size and tyre sizes. Provided the tyres/wheels fitted are specified for the car then there is no need to inform the insurers.

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #69 on: December 28, 2020, 04:24:55 PM »
Some cars, mine, for instance, can be purchased with more than one wheel size and tyre sizes. Provided the tyres/wheels fitted are specified for the car then there is no need to inform the insurers.
Absolutely true. I also run my car on a different size tyre than normally supplied as OEM but as it is a specified size by the manufacturer there are no insurance implications.
I guess if I was to change the tyre size on a Crosstar from 185/60 R16 to 195/55 R16 then I would have to inform insurance company because it is not a specified size for the Crosstar.

DAN@ADRIAN FLUX

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #70 on: January 06, 2021, 08:16:02 PM »
Hi.
If anyone does ever have any issues with insurance for the fitment of all season or winter tyres then please feel free to drop me a line.
Regards,
Dan.

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #71 on: January 06, 2021, 11:07:49 PM »
I have been in contact with both Honda(UK) and my local Honda dealer. The Honda dealer was most helpful and said he would check and get back to me. He did and confirmed my findings that there are very few tyres in the Crosstar size available on the UK market. In fact none of the premium tyre makers (Michelin, Goodyear, Continental, Vredestein etc) make any tyres in the Crosstar size.
Honda(UK) replied that they would investigate the situation and get back to me. They did, but just to confirm the tyre size and explain that the Crosstar size was to provide the correct comfort and technical requirements of the Crosstar. They would not address the tyre availability situation (or lack of availability).
So there you have it - buy a Crosstar and accept your choice of tyres is so severely limited there is no choice. Incidentally I also contacted a UK wide tyre supplier to see if they had a solution. They not only told me there were few to no tyres available but told me that if I ever had a serious puncture needing a new tyre I could be waiting some time before they could source one!
You have been warned. I am thinking I should write to every car magazine and ask them to warn their readers of this situation. perhaps Martin Lewis as well.

richardfrost

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #72 on: January 07, 2021, 03:11:30 AM »
How about you try contacting a local tyre specialist? This tyre size sounds like the same as was on my Jazz Mk2 EX and I never had any difficulty getting tyres, winter or regular, for it. Yes, the more well known brands didn’t do that size but other European brands were a available.

Expatman

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #73 on: January 07, 2021, 09:45:44 AM »
How about you try contacting a local tyre specialist? This tyre size sounds like the same as was on my Jazz Mk2 EX and I never had any difficulty getting tyres, winter or regular, for it. Yes, the more well known brands didn’t do that size but other European brands were a available.
I did contact a major tyre supplier who confirmed the scarcity of quality tyres in the 185/60 R16 size. Local Honda dealer was also dismayed when he checked the situation as well. My warning is that your choice of tyres is critically restricted for the Crosstar, it's up to potential customers whether they think it's important. Personally I do.

culzean

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Re: All Season Tyres for Crosstar
« Reply #74 on: January 07, 2021, 09:58:59 AM »
How about you try contacting a local tyre specialist? This tyre size sounds like the same as was on my Jazz Mk2 EX and I never had any difficulty getting tyres, winter or regular, for it. Yes, the more well known brands didn’t do that size but other European brands were a available.
I did contact a major tyre supplier who confirmed the scarcity of quality tyres in the 185/60 R16 size. Local Honda dealer was also dismayed when he checked the situation as well. My warning is that your choice of tyres is critically restricted for the Crosstar, it's up to potential customers whether they think it's important. Personally I do.

My mate bought a Nissan Qashqai about 10 years ago,  see the look on his face when he came to replace tyres,  they were a funny size as well and he was looking at nearly £800 for 4 tyres, ( about £180 a corner plus fitting ) - he did get tyres for about £120 plus fitting eventually but I don't know what make or quality they were...

I found it cost effective to fit 15" alloys to Wifes Jazz Mk2, with the money we saved not having the 16" diamond cut OEM alloys refurbished due to white worm ( about £90 each ) and cost of new 16" funny sized tyres (185/55R16) at about £85+ each..  I got new 15" Rial alloys for £65 each and new Avons for £55 each.  Next time it needs new shoes they will be 2/3 price and more choice - and the ride is smoother and quieter on 15"
« Last Edit: January 07, 2021, 10:05:20 AM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

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