Low battery voltage and spurious messages

[orcadian]

I posted about the apparent random action of the stop start and there is a newish post on the same topic, which has now been more or less 'done to death'. Something we have noticed during lockdown though with less trips out in the Jazz (Late 2015 SE) is that when the battery is low charge but starts fine then we get various transient orange messages - one time all parking sensors showing fault, then just the rear middle ones and secondly the car 'seeing a threat from an oncoming vehicle' when the road was perfectly clear and dead straight.  Charging the battery via the 'coulomb counter' and the next trip had no such messages on the same trip.
My Daimler Super V8 also displayed 'fruit machine' messages and non existent faults if the battery was low but always started fine.  If these spurious messages keep appearing on lots of cars (which according to many forums, they do) then the systems are in danger of 'crying wolf' too often and we will start to ignore them.  The software architecture designers need to get much smarter if autonomous vehicles are to be the norm.

Ian

[madasafish]

Modern electronics depend on the battery being charged and in good condition.

Yours is now 5 years old.. and may be failing   or you are driving vry little and the battery is never charged...

Lots of testers around.

[culzean]

Modern electronics depend on the battery being charged and in good condition.

Yours is now 5 years old.. and may be failing   or you are driving vry little and the battery is never charged...

Lots of testers around.

+1

So very true - keeping the battery in good shape on a modern car is more important than ever, so many sensors and gadgets that rely on stable voltage level, and consider that the electric power steering  can take up to 60 amps out of the battery when you turn steering wheel ( especially when car is stationary with the tyres trying to rip the tarmac up ).

[orcadian]

Yes, I know modern cars rely on lots of electronics but what bloody use is a car that needs its battery externally charging perhaps weekly just to prevent useless messages appearing - there was sufficient power to start the car.   We left Christine's R plate Civic at Kirkwall airport for 8 weeks when we went to the States about 12 years ago and it started on our return as if we'd just popped in to buy a paper.  It's the unnecessary messages i'm pigged off with.  I had a Berlingo van (55plate) bought less than 1 year old which I sold to friend here in Orkney - it sleeps outside and is still on the original battery 15 years down the line.  I'm not Honda bashing, almost all manufacturers are having similar  issues - progress eh?
Ian

[madasafish]

How many miles a year do your normally do?

And what is your average journey length?

Becuase few miles coupled with short journeys is a battery killer - expecially in winter. where you ned up with a half charged battery for six months due to lots of electric things used...

Been there know it: our 2003 Toyta Yaris does 2k miles a year and kills batteries every 3-4 years. When used frequently, it did not and its original battery lasted 10 years.

[culzean]

I have a fused SAE charging plug fitted to battery with the plug part accessible via front grille without opening bonnet to charge our cars ( SAE lead has waterproof cover and no need to even unlock the car to put battery on charge, but if battery ever does go flat I know I can get voltage into the system to unlock doors etc. ).  If you have the stop-start system on your car you will need to connect negative cable of plug to chassis ground not the negative battery terminal so that the charge - discharge sensor in negative battery lead can see what is going into the battery.

Together with reasonably priced AA 1.5 amp conditioner / charger and a 4.6 metre SAE lead - all set..

https://www.amazon.co.uk/OptiMate-SAE-Weatherproof-Eyelet-Lead/dp/B0022ZZULK?ref_=ast_sto_dp

https://www.amazon.co.uk/OptiMate-O13-Extension-Lead-Meter/dp/B0041PPV4K?ref_=ast_sto_dp

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00DW6RHN2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 

[orcadian]

Many thanks for that,
Seems like a workable solution.

Regards,
Ian

[ColinB]

Many thanks for that,
Seems like a workable solution.

Regards,
Ian

For anyone who can't plug in a mains charger because of lack of off-road parking, this is another solution:

Re the problem of low mileage during lockdown I was getting the same as you. I think the very slight battery drain from the alarm & immobiliser dropped the voltage just enough to fool the stop-start system, and the very short supermarket trips weren't enough to compensate. I've now invested in a solar battery maintainer ...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AA-Essentials-12V-Solar-Powered-Car-Battery-Charger-Solar-Panel-OBD-Version/233129991124?
Since then, no problems at all. The Stop-Start works as it should, even on short trips.

(From this thread https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=12096.msg82918#msg82918)

[orcadian]

Thanks again,
That seems like a really good solution to the problem and will probably go down that route.

Regards,
Ian

[culzean]

Will a solar charger get enough sun in Orkney in darker months ? That particular charger is 130 to 200mA ( about 2 watts ) in good sunlight. May need to get one with a larger area for far north ?

On the plus side the solar charger in link has a normal SAE two pin plug - and the OBD port adapter supplied with it has a SAE plug that will fit pretty much any newish charger lead as they all seem to have have standardized on the SAE plug to allow fitment of various adapter leads.

[Jocko]

You can get this one for Scotland in the winter.

[culzean]

You can get this one for Scotland in the winter.

That should do nicely.....

[John Ratsey]

You can get this one for Scotland in the winter.

How about a small wind turbine fixed to the car roof? I believe there's often some wind in those northern latitudes.

This https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kelsey65-Vertical-Generator-generator-White-10W/dp/B0897FPQ8N might do nicely but would need some electronics to increase the voltage to suit the vehicle.

The bottom line is that car manufacturers should be building a solar panel into their vehicles to automatially do some trickle charging. The cost would be minimal.

[ColinB]

Will a solar charger get enough sun in Orkney in darker months ? That particular charger is 130 to 200mA ( about 2 watts ) in good sunlight. May need to get one with a larger area for far north ?

These things are not intended as battery chargers, they are battery maintainers. They are only intended to compensate for the tiny current drain of the things that remain live when the ignition is off (alarm, immobiliser, clock, etc). So even a small one ought to be helpful, although obviously an external light is needed. Park under a street lamp?

[ColinB]

The bottom line is that car manufacturers should be building a solar panel into their vehicles to automatially do some trickle charging. The cost would be minimal.

To be fair to car manufacturers, they do build generators into their cars, and they probably expect that anyone who buys a car will actually drive it (why else would you buy one?). The pandemic lockdown is a bit of an unusual situation, so is it reasonable to expect specific design features to cater for that?