Author Topic: Aircon not working  (Read 3128 times)

u587162

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Aircon not working
« on: August 09, 2020, 11:26:05 AM »
My wife's 56 plate Honda Jazz stopped blowing out cold air maybe 4-6 weeks ago.

Have read other posts here and online /  youtube videos about DIY EZ chill regassing etc.  I just wanted to check, but when I press the A/C button which goes green, but I dont hear the normal noise that comes on when the AC usually does (is that the engine cooling fan perhaps?), am I wasting my money buying a can of this cooling gas if it could be something more problematic like a compressor failure etc?

Also whereabouts would I find the lower pressure valve to fill this up?  I have never done this before, should I be worried about doing it correctly or injuring myself?

culzean

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2020, 11:46:52 AM »
Go to Halfords, quikfit or almost any of the auto places and get them to evacuate and regass the system,  costs £50 to £70 and it will check if you have leaks etc - they will put the correct quantity of gas into your system and then if it still doen't want to work then start looking for other things.  The eze-chill bottle is OK as long as you use it for routine top ups to allow for natural leakage ( about 10% a year - a bottle lasts us 3 or 4 years ).

One thing to note,  the less you use the aircon the faster the gas will leak out...
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

equaliser

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2020, 11:47:04 AM »
Years ago I had a Fiesta with the same aircon problem as yourself, the light would light up but not no click as usual. After asking different sources I was told it was probably the condenser or compressor and replacement very expensive. I took it into Kwikfit (who I'd normally avoid like the plague) as they had a free recharge if it didn't lower your aircon temperature. It turned it out it was only slightly low on pressure and a result of low pressure the system disabled itself. After the recharge and £50 it was working like new and was still working a few years later when I sold it.

culzean

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2020, 12:01:09 PM »
Years ago I had a Fiesta with the same aircon problem as yourself, the light would light up but not no click as usual. After asking different sources I was told it was probably the condenser or compressor and replacement very expensive. I took it into Kwikfit (who I'd normally avoid like the plague) as they had a free recharge if it didn't lower your aircon temperature. It turned it out it was only slightly low on pressure and a result of low pressure the system disabled itself. After the recharge and £50 it was working like new and was still working a few years later when I sold it.

Yes there is a pressure sensor on the system that stops it running if gas is low,  as this can damage the compressor....   It probably is just low gas,  but with a 2006 car its probably about time it had the gas replaced and new gas with new lubricant put in...
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

MicktheMonster

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2020, 01:43:41 PM »
Cost me £66 inc VAT at a local independent garage for a air con service a couple of months ago on my 2009 Civic, they connect it up to a machine that removes any old gas & oil, pressure tests the system and refills the system with new gas & oil.
It's the only way you can be sure your system isn't leaking and that you have enough oil in it to lubricate the compressor correctly.
Unfortunately the symptoms your experiencing could be many things, leaks, electrical faults or knackered compressor, but it is more likely to just need a regas.

madasafish

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2020, 03:24:01 PM »
Kwikfit often have cheap regassing offers in winter (yes I am a mean Scot)

u587162

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2020, 03:39:24 PM »
Im hoping its just low on gas, but what worries me is that it was cooling exceptionally well about a month ago.  We bought the car used with 90k miles on the clock in 2018, now has 110k miles on there.  Could be that it has never had a regas.

But if it was coming out very cold before, I would have expected a gradual decline in cooling not a sudden stop?

I'm tempted to try this myself (only to learn), where would I find the low pressure valve on this car?  I will get it checked probably but just want to see under the bonnet.

Thanks.

culzean

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2020, 04:32:38 PM »
Im hoping its just low on gas, but what worries me is that it was cooling exceptionally well about a month ago.  We bought the car used with 90k miles on the clock in 2018, now has 110k miles on there.  Could be that it has never had a regas.

But if it was coming out very cold before, I would have expected a gradual decline in cooling not a sudden stop?

I'm tempted to try this myself (only to learn), where would I find the low pressure valve on this car?  I will get it checked probably but just want to see under the bonnet.

Thanks.

The car can actually cool better when gas is getting low ( until the point where pressure switch 'says no'),  low gas causes some systems to get too cold and ice up - for the aircon to work properly and not freeze up the air blowing into cabin needs to be about 7deg C - there is a balance in the system about how fast the gas can expand ( that is the cooling bit ) and the correct compression and expansion 'cycle' physics depends on the correct weight / volume of gass in the system.  Just like your bicycle pump used to get hot when you blew tyres up and the valve got colder when you let air back out is the basis of aircon, but using much more efficient gas instead of air.

below is a quote from an airconditioner fault finding article

4) Low refrigerant
What Causes Aircon Coils To Freeze Up?

If your air conditioning unit has a low refrigerant then it can also freeze up. This is because when the refrigerant level drops, there will be less pressure which will make the flashing happen early than expected.

This early flashing process can create enough cold air which will condense into moisture on the coils and then immediately freeze up. If the flashing continues, more ice will continue to build up such that it will even creep up to the copper pipes.
What Causes Aircon Coils To Freeze Up? – Conclusion

Having a low refrigerant is a sign that your aircon is experiencing some leakages. Therefore it is good that you sought it out in time to prevent further damages.

If there are small issues with your aircon system and you leave them unattended for a long period they can make the coils to freeze. Therefore, you must conduct routine maintenance to solve the issues early enough before they worsen.

Some issues can damage your aircon completely such that you may be required to buy a new one. However, if you check the issues highlighted above in time, you will minimize the chances of having frozen aircon coils.






The car must have had gas added at some point, even a car that uses aircon regularly will lose about 10% a year,  that means your will have lost 140% of the original gas...... during lockdown with a lot of cars hardly getting used the gas would have been lost at much more than the rate when system is used often, as the seals get less supple.   The best advice is still to get a £50 regass and then look for problems if it still does not work,  I have never seen on here that a pressure switch has failed - and only a very, very few compressor fails ( the Jazz compressor is a scroll type, and very robust ). The pressure switch is most probably buried deep in the system and it may cost as much or more to get it checked as a regass.  Other suspects are the aircon relay and the clutch solenoid - but 99% of the time when system does not kick in it is just low gas......
« Last Edit: August 09, 2020, 04:44:20 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Jocko

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2020, 04:56:45 PM »
The car must have had gas added at some point, even a car that uses aircon regularly will lose about 10% a year,  that means your will have lost 140% of the original gas.
My Volvo S40 was 16 years old when I parted with it and it had never had a regas in all that time and the aircon still worked great. it was never turned off, summer or winter.

Part of my job, in the 80s and 90s, was servicing and repairing serious industrial-strength refrigeration systems (Temperatures to below -100°C possible) and adding gas would never have been condoned.

equaliser

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2020, 05:21:01 PM »
The car must have had gas added at some point, even a car that uses aircon regularly will lose about 10% a year,  that means your will have lost 140% of the original gas.
My Volvo S40 was 16 years old when I parted with it and it had never had a regas in all that time and the aircon still worked great. it was never turned off, summer or winter.

Part of my job, in the 80s and 90s, was servicing and repairing serious industrial-strength refrigeration systems (Temperatures to below -100°C possible) and adding gas would never have been condoned.

Hi Jocko, because yours was running all the time the seals would kept in optimal condition and reduced gas loss. My mate has 21 year old Passat that he's owned since new and he has never re-gassed the air con either, it still works perfectly.

The newer gasses seem to more prone to leakage since they got rid of the CFCs in the old R22 type gas.

u587162

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2020, 06:27:45 PM »
Thanks for the feedback. Could I please get an answer to my question regarding where the low pressure valve is for me to try and do this myself (more out of curiosity Than trying to save money)?

Thx. 

VicW

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2020, 06:46:33 PM »
They are under the bonnet to the left of the engine as you face it. They are black pipes and each has a valve sticking out of it with, usually, a pale blue valve cap on each pipe one marked 'H' and one marked 'L'.
My advice is not to try a regas yourself, it is under high pressure. The kits you can buy do not tell how you much gas is in the system and you will not know how much to add and importantly whether the kit includes lubricant which is essential for the system.

Vic.

culzean

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2020, 07:16:42 PM »
Thanks for the feedback. Could I please get an answer to my question regarding where the low pressure valve is for me to try and do this myself (more out of curiosity Than trying to save money)?

Thx. 
Pressure switch is a sealed unit,  with preset pressure and either works or it does not, no history of it being a part that is laible to fail - 99.9% of the time when aircon won't get out of bed it is low gas... the rest of the equipment is very reliable but will not work without gas....
« Last Edit: August 09, 2020, 07:18:39 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

u587162

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2020, 10:22:42 AM »
Hi Vic,

I was planning to buy a can and also a pressure gauge and follow some of the  youtube videos i.e. start the engine, set ac to max and cold setting, open the low pressure valve, shake the can connect it, watch it needle move from green to blue whilst also shaking the can etc. 

Still dont recommend?

Jocko

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Re: Aircon not working
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2020, 10:32:25 AM »
If the compressor won't start there is no point in connecting up to feed the gas in. It depends on the compressor sucking the gas into the system. Without the compressor running the High and Low are at the same pressure, probably higher than the pressure in the can. By the time you buy a can and a pressure manifold (not just a gauge required), you could have Kwik Fit charge it for you and be done with it.

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