Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums

Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk1 2002-2008 => Topic started by: u587162 on February 12, 2019, 12:38:07 AM

Title: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 12, 2019, 12:38:07 AM
I'm getting a bad a rattling sound which only appers when I go over a non smooth road or when going over humps.
My back street old guy mechanic could not figure out what it was even though he drove it over the bumps etc

Its a 56 plate Honda Jazz 1.4 with 105k miles on the clock.  Heat shield has been removed.  Undermount plastic something has been wire taped shut.  Any suggestions what else it can be?  Few things form last MOT inspection which passed:

- grease near nearside outer cv gaitor
- corrosion developing on front metal brake pipes under wheel arches
- Nearside Front Suspension arm rubber mounting deteriorated resulting in excessive movement (2.4.G.2)
- Offside Front Suspension arm rubber mounting deteriorated resulting in excessive movement (2.4.G.2)

Mechanic could not replicate the fault by raising the car on the lift and tugging at stuff.

Any suggestions as its really getting annoying and dont want my wife to break down in it.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 12, 2019, 08:11:20 AM
Anti roll bar drop link/s. Be aware there are two different types fitted to the Mk 1.

(https://i.imgur.com/n5Ue7uZ.jpg)

I also had to replace a wishbone for Nearside Front Suspension arm rubber mounting which had failed completely. Then at it's next MOT I got "Nearside Front Suspension arm rubber mounting deteriorated resulting in excessive movement" ?

Another possible rattle is the exhaust against the inner sill, but that is usually evident on corners.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 12, 2019, 08:26:54 AM
Hi

Thanks for the reply and feedback.  I forgot to mention that the exhaust is fine, that was the first thing I checked and mechanic said it was all secure. 

Which is the anti roll bar drop links in that image you posted?

How expensive and big a job can this be?  I’m based in NW London. 

Thx
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 12, 2019, 08:57:45 AM
The short, dark blue, vertical bar is the drop link. Two cost me £24. Fitting depends on your garage, but it is not a big job. I fitted one when the wishbone was changed (Y shaped piece in image, which cost me £32), and my local tyre fitters fitted the second one, free, when they fitted two tyres and checked the alignment for me.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 12, 2019, 09:06:05 AM
Thx you.  Will get another mechanic to look at this and suggest your comments. 

Is it possible to replicate this knocking / rattling sound somehow when on the lift?
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 12, 2019, 09:34:52 AM
If the drop link is well shot you can, but if there is just a little slack the lift raises the body and the weight of the wheel and suspension takes up the slack. It is difficult to rattle wheel and suspension up and down enough to get a rattle.
I have experienced the same problem with my last three cars. A Vauxhall Cavalier, a Volvo S40, and now the Jazz. I put it down to the preponderance of 20 mph zones, and their dreaded "speed bumps", around here.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: jonathan on February 13, 2019, 12:30:50 PM
As Jocko said.

Same thing happened to my Jazz a few years ago. Both drop links were replaced and noise disapeared.

If they are hard to get of (nuts to corroded) then its best to take to a garage, or angle grind the bolts of if your a competent mechanic.....



Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: jonathan on February 13, 2019, 12:34:36 PM
I got my from Euro parts and spent about £20 to get a garage to fit them.....

It will sound like a limo afterwards  :) :)
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: sparky Paul on February 13, 2019, 05:18:47 PM
Is it possible to replicate this knocking / rattling sound somehow when on the lift?

With the car on a flat level surface, rock the car from side to side and you will hear them clicking if they are bad. Grasp each joint in turn from underneath as the car is rocked to identify which one is worn. The clicking will stop, and you should be able to feel any play.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 16, 2019, 09:10:16 AM
Hi

I’m getting them changed this morning - £90 for both inc labour by a small garage. 

He drove it for 30 sec and suggested the same to me without me suggesting.  Then also rocked the car.

Hopefully that’s a fair price for NW London?

I’ve got lots of 20mph speed bumps on my road.  Some are higher/ harder to drive over then the others for some strange reason.  Is it worth trying to put the claim to the council?

Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 16, 2019, 09:13:45 AM
Just saw the above again. Presume
That’s £20 for each to fit?
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Njazz on February 17, 2019, 12:52:25 PM
www.energizedcustoms.co.uk

Just seen that this website does the front drop link arms for £7.95 each or £13.95 for the pair.

With free UK delivery.

Might pick up a pair as I have heard this knocking sound once I rock the car side to side.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 17, 2019, 03:16:15 PM
Had them replaced, knocking sound seems to have stopped so thx for that. 

Feel a bit annoyed inlaid £90 but there you go.  Checked with Lloyd’s motor spares and they quoted £48+vat for the pair.  Not sure if they are better quality than the £13.95 pair ones.  Suppose I would be tempted too.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Njazz on February 17, 2019, 05:24:40 PM
There’s a video on YouTube about replacing them as well and it seems really easy.

Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 17, 2019, 06:56:38 PM
They are a dawdle to replace as long as you can stop them turning while you undo them. My mechanic just ground through the fixing.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 17, 2019, 08:09:45 PM
 How would I know that he definitely replaced both of them?

 On a separate subject, anyone know how I can improve the reception on my radio I’m getting a lot of  scratchy sound? I have a metal stub aerial. 
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 17, 2019, 08:33:10 PM
How would I know that he definitely replaced both of them?
A quick look behind the wheels will soon tell. New ones are clean metal, old ones are rusty. Just turn the wheels, in turn, to full lock, and have a look.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Njazz on February 18, 2019, 09:42:51 AM
I checked my drop arms yesterday as again I heard the knocking noise while sat in the car rocking it from side to side, now if these needed replacing how would I know? Would they be loose with a bit of free play in them?

Only reason I ask is that there is no movement in them at all so to me they seem fine.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 18, 2019, 10:09:09 AM
I could feel no movement in mine, but I changed them anyway, and the rattle went away.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: olduser1 on February 18, 2019, 02:57:43 PM
You need to use a pry bar to detect movement , if originals replacements  should improve the feel of your jazz anyhow.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 23, 2019, 02:44:13 PM
These are the pics after it was changed.

Remind me what exactly these do again?  What happens if it they are not fitted - is it just a stabilisation thing?
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: culzean on February 23, 2019, 04:26:39 PM
These are the pics after it was changed.

Remind me what exactly these do again?  What happens if it they are not fitted - is it just a stabilisation thing?

https://www.howacarworks.com/basics/how-car-suspension-works

They are important to handling of the car, 'anti-roll bars' describes their purpose !   I have a theory that bumping one front wheel up and down kerbs does more damage than the speed bumps where both wheels go up and down together.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 23, 2019, 04:52:58 PM
My last two cars went through drop links like they were toffee. And I never ever bump over kerbs (Volvo had beautifully restored alloys). Speed bumps here are not full width, so inevitably one side gets it more than the other as it is not always possible to straddle them.
(https://i2-prod.bristolpost.co.uk/news/article46779.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/Humps-2.jpg)
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: culzean on February 23, 2019, 06:48:20 PM
Only car I have had a drop link fail on was a Vauxhall,  I just added it to the long list of other things that failed on it - only Vauxhall I ever had ( guess why ).
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 23, 2019, 08:25:46 PM
One of mine was a Vauxhall as well. I have owned three Vauxhalls and loved every one.

(https://i.imgur.com/z5Lbzyh.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/lCcrYDB.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/aFDBQzz.jpg)
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: u587162 on February 23, 2019, 08:52:09 PM
What do you mean by anti roll exactly?

Last week I had an incident which I never experience before.  I was going around the roundabout at not huge speed but not slow either and suddenly the car continued moving in the same direction as I straightened out the wheel.  I panicked for a split second and had to turn the wheel in the opposite direction to correct the manoeuvre  as the front of the car was in a slightly different direction to the back of the car and had to get the car to go straight at that point  by taking corrective action.

After the event, I wasn’t sure if that was just my bad driving or if it had anything to do with the recent links that I changed. I tried to do the same thing again at a different roundabout but much slower speed but could not replicate it.   I’m worried that this  might happen to my wife when she is driving when collecting our children.

Is this an issue? Can the links be installed in such a way which might agree to this incident or would I just generally have been driving too fast and would’ve expected that anyway regardless of the links been changed ?
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 23, 2019, 08:58:40 PM
The incident you mention was probably a diesel spill on the roundabout. Nothing to do with the anti roll bar.
The anti roll bar does just that. As you corner and the outside suspension dips it transfers some of that motion to the inside wheel to limit the roll. The stiffer the anti roll bar the less roll a car has on corners. A sports car has stiffer roll bars than a saloon.
You cannot misfit a drop link. The village idiot could fit them. In the dark with boxing gloves on.
Your car is fine. Enjoy it and move on.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on February 23, 2019, 09:03:41 PM
No roll bar:
(https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/prod.mm.com/uploads/2018/03/05/klubhfp_mmthumb.jpg)

Stiff roll bar:
(https://www.autocar.co.uk/sites/autocar.co.uk/files/styles/body-image/public/megane-rs-trophy-2018-2728a.jpg?itok=WuEAgymK)
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: MartinJG on February 23, 2019, 10:27:48 PM
I know someone who loved and owned several 2CV's. He recalled an occasion on his way home from the local waterhole late one evening after a skinful or two (in the days when skinfuls were shall we say, not uncommon) when he took a bend rather too sharply and found himself momentarily in the passenger seat before the suspension corrected and he was catapulted back into the driving position again. All in the blink or two of an eye. I believe he was a little stirred but not shaken.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: gtd2000 on March 02, 2019, 07:14:50 PM
I checked my drop arms yesterday as again I heard the knocking noise while sat in the car rocking it from side to side, now if these needed replacing how would I know? Would they be loose with a bit of free play in them?

Only reason I ask is that there is no movement in them at all so to me they seem fine.

Replaced the driver side ARB drop link on our Jazz last year.

When the car was rocked side to side you could feel the movement or clicking when holding the ARB drop link.

Up here in Scotland, the chances are that the nuts are totally rusted solid and the only way you'll get them off easily is with a grinder.

If you need to buy new drop links double check the type as there may well be three different styles....all of which are listed as compatible for 2002~2008..they're not compatible unfortunately. We still have a spare drop link that was for our old 02 plate Jazz but it was of no use on the 56 plate.

This is the one that was fitted:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Anti-Roll-Bar-Link-Front-Right-FDL6993-First-Line-Stabiliser-Drop-Link-Quality/332235777325?hash=item4d5acba52d:m:mZg8ck6ToaDjl4_Cmlq4LDQ:rk:1:pf:1&frcectupt=true

The change over seems to occur around 2004/05
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: Jocko on March 02, 2019, 07:35:36 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/n5Ue7uZ.jpg)

The Moog parts I fitted were HO-LS-8967 and HO-LS-8968, as shown in the above diagram.
They were angled.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FRONT-LEFT-LINK-ANTI-ROLL-BAR-STABILISER-MOOG-HO-LS-8967-/282789466034 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FRONT-LEFT-LINK-ANTI-ROLL-BAR-STABILISER-MOOG-HO-LS-8967-/282789466034)
I got mine for £11 + VAT - each! That was about 2 years ago.
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: gtd2000 on March 04, 2019, 04:03:30 PM
This was the thread I put up last year when I found the problem with the differing drop links.

https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=10597.msg65236#msg65236
Title: Re: Rattling sound from under
Post by: gtd2000 on March 04, 2019, 04:04:17 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/n5Ue7uZ.jpg)

The Moog parts I fitted were HO-LS-8967 and HO-LS-8968, as shown in the above diagram.
They were angled.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FRONT-LEFT-LINK-ANTI-ROLL-BAR-STABILISER-MOOG-HO-LS-8967-/282789466034 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FRONT-LEFT-LINK-ANTI-ROLL-BAR-STABILISER-MOOG-HO-LS-8967-/282789466034)
I got mine for £11 + VAT - each! That was about 2 years ago.

£40 is ridiculous really!