Author Topic: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue  (Read 13050 times)

csp

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When I set off on my journey on Tuesday this week the Speed Limit Sign Recognition system was working and the Smart Speed Limiter was functioning correctly. During the journey I activated and used Cruise Control but when I cancelled Cruise Control the speed limit recognition system was no longer showing speed limits after I passed quite a few signs for the rest of my journey, I did turn the Cruise / Limit Main switch off and reactivate the system but this had no effect. The next time I started the car the speed limit recognition system and speed limiter were working again.

I have also noticed that the speed limit recognition system sometimes fails to recognise or see speed limit signs or sees signs on side roads. I suspect there is a bug in the system and I will continue to monitor the system, it seemed to work ok before the software update carried out at the 12 month service. I have not really used the cruise control much since I have had the car though.

The driver of a car still needs to remain alert and not rely on technology which is just an aid. This sort of problem could become an issue if autonomous cars start using our roads when they enter temporary speed limit areas that have not been programmed into their SAT/NAV systems.


culzean

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2016, 08:07:06 PM »
I guess for driverless cars the signs will have a radio freq transponder built in to enable signs to be read / detected in all weather (imagine if snow / or tree was covering the sign - or as is happening more and more on our roads the signs get covered with green moss because they simply don't get cleaned any more). 

There are many things the human brain does automatically that computers find hard to do, if we see two speed limit signs next to each other and one is for a side road,  we realise straight away which one we should be taking notice of.

Even my up to date satnav maps don't always get speed limit right, and with temporary limits for roadworks etc. they don't last long enough to  make it onto a database,  some are only there for a few days and may only be in force for a few hours.  How about temporary traffic lights as well - the list is endless.

I'm with VicW - driverless vehicles are gonna cause more trouble than they are worth - it will be  brave designer who will take out the 'human' controls from a car,  they still haven't managed it with aircraft and they have been at it for a long, long time.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2016, 08:24:40 PM by culzean »
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Paulwhitt20

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2016, 08:22:49 PM »
Talking of road signs covered in snow.
Did you know the Give Way warning sign is the only one with the triangle upside down, so you can recognise a give way if it is covered in snow.


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Downsizer

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2016, 10:40:22 PM »
When I set off on my journey on Tuesday this week the Speed Limit Sign Recognition system was working and the Smart Speed Limiter was functioning correctly. During the journey I activated and used Cruise Control but when I cancelled Cruise Control the speed limit recognition system was no longer showing speed limits after I passed quite a few signs for the rest of my journey, I did turn the Cruise / Limit Main switch off and reactivate the system but this had no effect. The next time I started the car the speed limit recognition system and speed limiter were working again.
In addition to selecting the limit option in the cruise control menu, you then have to press the set button to activate the system.  If you later press cancel, I don't think it will display the limits until you press set again ( or rest perhaps?).

ColinB

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2016, 10:44:56 PM »
I find the "Intelligent" Speed Limiter a waste of space, verging on the dangerous. The sign recognition just isn't reliable enough. Not only does it read signs on side roads as if they apply to the main road, it is also fooled by countdown signs (e.g. "30 limit 300 m ahead"). In my very brief experimentation with it I had an event when driving happily along a road with a 40 limit; the system read a 20 sign on a side road, causing totally unnecessary excitement in the cockpit as the car sounded the alarm and started to slow down. Also, once you've driven long enough within one limit that the car's got bored with showing the sign and starts showing "---", the system will no longer keep you within the speed limit.

andruec

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2016, 08:02:57 AM »
I've never used the speed limiter option but the sign recognition seems to be mostly okay. It doesn't always catch signs on bends however.

ColinS

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2016, 08:04:08 AM »
I find this amazing piece of complex software to be an excellent aid to my driving.  In no way is it infallible and therefore should never be used over your own driving skills, as I am sure a magistrate would agree, but it may just save one speeding through lack of concentration, as I am sure we all suffer from time to time.  I have used it for the last 9,000 miles.

It does have a few quirks:

I drive on one stretch of road where tracked military are limited to 20 in an otherwise 40 zone.  It thinks I am driving a tank.

Another stretch of 30 zone road runs parallel with a railway line and it is happy that I try to keep up with the train by reading the 60 sign at the side of the railway.

I also find that low sunshine and sometimes rain effect the ability to read the signs.

Also, once you've driven long enough within one limit that the car's got bored with showing the sign and starts showing "---", the system will no longer keep you within the speed limit.
I've never seen this issue but if I know that I am going to be within a 30 for a while, then I will switch to the manual limiter mainly for the following reason:

There are two annoying features that I have found.  Firstly when you indicate to turn (down a side road at 90 degrees for example), the system will cancel.  This only happens if you indicate and turn so is obviously intentional.  I cant see the logic in this.

And secondly, when you stop the engine and restart it (maybe at the end of a journey), it does not remember the limit that you were last in.  Therefore if you start your journey in a 30, which I suspect is in the majority of cases, then it will not be functional until you pass a speed limit sign.

The only other sign mine has ever identified is a "no overtaking" sign.  I would be interested to know what other peoples cars have recognised.

To sum up, I think it is quite amazing that it works at all, given the complex task it is expected to do and it is one of those features that you will love or hate and must make an individual choice on whether to use it or not.  But as with other gadgets that have been discussed on these forums.  You are the driver and it is up to you to stay within the law.

Skyrider

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2016, 08:29:30 AM »
I've never used the speed limiter option but the sign recognition seems to be mostly okay. It doesn't always catch signs on bends however.

I have never used my limiter either, I prefer cruise control which I use a lot. I agree that the sign recognition works most of the time but mine does not "see" limits on overhead motorway gantries and the ones near me have limit linked cameras.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2016, 08:33:42 AM by Deeps »

culzean

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2016, 09:03:01 AM »
There are things on modern cars that seem clever and even amusing, and people are amazed at the 'level of technology' - which IMHO is far, far from perfect - are we really going to trust deeply flawed technology like this to drive us around with no human control or intervention possible ?   As I said earlier many things have to change in the 'driving environment' to make even the simplest autonomy possible - cars are not fixed to tracks like a train or 'straight lines in the air' like aircraft but are free roaming devices (able to go anywhere there is a surface suitable for the wheels) up close and personal with other vehicles under less than perfect conditions.  Maybe autonomous cars will  have to be limited to certain special routes that limit their interaction with other traffic - which will limit their sales potential a bit.

Autonomous vehicles are the latest 'must have' technology for cars (but don't ask me why) it is keeping many people in jobs and multinationals can see unlimited dollar signs appearing every time this is mentioned, it reminds me a bit of 'Tomorrows World' a popular TV program when I was growing up where every week we would be astounded by all the magical things technology had in store for us - and guess what ?  I doubt even 1% of them ever came to fruition - brave new world indeed - I am watching with amusement.

Character recognition has been around in industry for many years and it is still not perfect,  but if a 'mis-read' happens on an automated conveyor belt the offending article will probably be shunted off the conveyor for a human to sort out the problem,  on a road that is not possible (or is it,  would the car be directed to the nearest lay-by till the AA can come to sort the problem).
« Last Edit: October 14, 2016, 09:13:52 AM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

ColinB

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2016, 09:24:14 AM »
Clearly a Marmite system (you either love it or hate it) !

Interesting that even those who like it can quote examples where it doesn't pick up the signs correctly, so I assume you have to keep constantly checking that it's doing its job ... for me it seems less stressful to switch it off and concentrate on driving.

Completely agree with the tenet that the driver is responsible, but that extends to all aspects of driving not just staying within the speed limit. The driver should try to avoid doing unexpected manoeuvres that confuse other drivers. So when the system reads the wrong sign and decides without warning to decelerate (engine braking and hence not showing brake lights) to 20 on a road where the limit is 40, you are creating an unnecessary hazard. My first thought was that the car had suffered some catastrophic mechanical failure, it took a few seconds to realise it was the speed limiter ... luckily the the driver behind had good reactions but clearly wasn't best pleased whilst I sorted it out. So, on balance, if it's a choice between maybe picking up a speeding ticket or being rear-ended at speed, I'll risk the ticket. And continue looking out the window to make sure I know the speed limit at the time.

ColinS

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2016, 09:30:28 AM »
Clearly a Marmite system (you either love it or hate it) !
Totally agree
being rear-ended at speed.
Really?  We're talking about engine braking on a 1.3 Jazz here :).

ColinB

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2016, 10:37:17 AM »
being rear-ended at speed.
Really?  We're talking about engine braking on a 1.3 Jazz here :).
"At speed" wasn't supposed to imply "high speed". Actually we're talking about a rear-end collision where the impact speed is the difference between the two vehicle speeds; in my example that'd be somewhere between zero and 20 mph depending on factors such as the gradient of the road which will affect how quickly the Jazz slows down. The point about engine braking is that the ISL on the Jazz simply cuts the gas to try to get back within what it thinks is the speed limit, so the following driver doesn't get the benefit of your brake lights to cue him that you're slowing down unexpectedly. I'd just prefer to avoid it by not enabling a system that might contribute to it happening. My preference, others clearly have different views but hey, the world'd be boring if we all agreed !

Skyrider

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2016, 10:44:54 AM »
I agree with ColinB.

Downsizer

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2016, 11:28:55 AM »
For me, the speed-limiter feature is most useful on long suburban roads, but setting the limit myself at, say, 32 or 43 rather than using the sign recognition feature.  Without it, my speed inevitably seems to creep up until the human speed- limiter sitting beside me reminds me of the limit!

John Ratsey

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Re: Speed limit sign recognition system & Smart Speed Limiter issue
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2016, 12:21:59 PM »
I find the sign recognition to be a useful aid although I still consider that spotting the speed signs among all the other clutter is one of my responsibilities. I haven't tried to use the speed limiter but I have my car set to give a "ping" each time I accelerate through 30 mph which often reminds me indirectly that I am still in a 30 mph zone and should ease off on the right foot.
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