Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk1 2002-2008 => Topic started by: DamFit on September 05, 2017, 12:17:46 PM
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Hi!
My first post on this forum. (I've already posted about this problem in the US forum fitfreak, but without any luck. Maybe someone in here can help..?
The problem I'm experience goes like this:
Sometimes when i turn the steering wheel it sticks and holds in place for half a second or so before it let's go. The car has been to the dealers workshop for two weeks but the only issue they could point out was that the alternator dropped in current rapidly after half an hour or so. They thought this could be the source to the problem and suggested to change it (for 1500$ here over in Norway!!) I bought an alternator (with very short milage) that had been tested thoroughly and changed it myself and the problem disappeared for some weeks, but now it's slowly coming back and it's getting worse and worse.
I told the Honda dealer and they said that nothing else was wrong with the car neither mechanical moving parts related to steering and suspension or electronically. They simply can't come up with any suggestions on how to fix this and it's really frustrating!
So, my last hope is that someone in here have had the same symptoms and might be able to guide me in the right direction to solve this problem. I've seen one post on this forum that had a similar issue (not exactly though) and it was caused by a bad connection/rust. To me it sounds like it could be a bad connector somewhere too, but the dealer mechanics said they did check all connectors that could affect the EPS. They also said the battery had "good health".
So, some facts about the problem:
1. It happens at low speeds (I think never over 30-40mph). It also happens when the car stands still and it also happens when backing in reverse.
2. It happens most often when i turn the wheel a lot and while the engine is running on low rpm ie. parking the car in in a tight space.
3. The EPS light does not flash when the problem occurs. (It comes on when i start the engine and goes away after three seconds or so)
4. When it happens it does not trigger any audible sound inside or outside the car.
5. When it happens the problem often re-occurs 2-4 times the next 10-20 seconds and then goes away again.
6. When i say "the steering wheel sticks" it feels like it locks or becomes significantly heavier to turn for a very short time.
7. I have a feeling that the problem occurs slightly more often when it rains or in high humidity, but it also happens in dry climates.
8. I did some more testing yesterday and noticed that when turning the steering wheel very quickly it sometimes locked and kind of bounced back again. I.e I turned to the left and when the problem occurred the steering wheel and my hand was pushed an inch or so to the right!
Well, i hope I've described the problem in a understandable way. Please let me know if something is un clear and I'll try to fill in.
Fingers crossed!
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Hi!
My first post on this forum. (I've already posted about this problem in the US forum fitfreak, but without any luck. Maybe someone in here can help..?
The problem I'm experience goes like this:
Sometimes when i turn the steering wheel it sticks and holds in place for half a second or so before it let's go. The car has been to the dealers workshop for two weeks but the only issue they could point out was that the alternator dropped in current rapidly after half an hour or so. They thought this could be the source to the problem and suggested to change it (for 1500$ here over in Norway!!) I bought an alternator (with very short milage) that had been tested thoroughly and changed it myself and the problem disappeared for some weeks, but now it's slowly coming back and it's getting worse and worse.
I told the Honda dealer and they said that nothing else was wrong with the car neither mechanical moving parts related to steering and suspension or electronically. They simply can't come up with any suggestions on how to fix this and it's really frustrating!
So, my last hope is that someone in here have had the same symptoms and might be able to guide me in the right direction to solve this problem. I've seen one post on this forum that had a similar issue (not exactly though) and it was caused by a bad connection/rust. To me it sounds like it could be a bad connector somewhere too, but the dealer mechanics said they did check all connectors that could affect the EPS. They also said the battery had "good health".
So, some facts about the problem:
1. It happens at low speeds (I think never over 30-40mph). It also happens when the car stands still and it also happens when backing in reverse.
2. It happens most often when i turn the wheel a lot and while the engine is running on low rpm ie. parking the car in in a tight space.
3. The EPS light does not flash when the problem occurs. (It comes on when i start the engine and goes away after three seconds or so)
4. When it happens it does not trigger any audible sound inside or outside the car.
5. When it happens the problem often re-occurs 2-4 times the next 10-20 seconds and then goes away again.
6. When i say "the steering wheel sticks" it feels like it locks or becomes significantly heavier to turn for a very short time.
7. I have a feeling that the problem occurs slightly more often when it rains or in high humidity, but it also happens in dry climates.
8. I did some more testing yesterday and noticed that when turning the steering wheel very quickly it sometimes locked and kind of bounced back again. I.e I turned to the left and when the problem occurred the steering wheel and my hand was pushed an inch or so to the right!
Well, i hope I've described the problem in a understandable way. Please let me know if something is un clear and I'll try to fill in.
Fingers crossed!
I have found steering does what you have said. Does not center it self it seems like it the actual steering rack it self they use I have changed power steering fluid and we greased it helped for while at higher speed should be OK because front end raises slightly so less pressure and weight on steering
Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk
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Not sure about Stevec's power steering fluid unless it's a very early Jazz perhaps, but as far as I know they had electric steering racks. I know someone with a Clio that the alternator light came on when steering hard one way or other just after an alternator change. The only thing I can think of is the battery as you say "They also said the battery had good health". remember the green indicator only indicates the condition of the one cell.
Trying to steer with no power steering the Jazz is the same as a truck, so heavy as to be virtually impossible so the electrics are really having to be working hard and I believe it is just the alternator that supplies the umph! As it's intermittent maybe it's something as simple as a slipping belt. Not enough to squeal but enough to drop the current from the alternator to the steering rack,
Sorry I'm raising more questions but everything else seems to have been covered to start with.
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Welcome to the forum.
The Jazz has no power steering fluid. The electrical power steering puts a very heavy load on the alternator. The fact that it went away after changing the alternator would tend to make me think the alternator is the problem. Perhaps the "pre-owned" replacement is also starting to give problems.
As regards when you feel the load, these are the times that the steering is ultra heavy without power steering and times that the alternator has to put out the heaviest load.
If your battery is well past its best (contrary to what Honda say) then after starting the alternator will be trying to boost it back up. Add to that the EPS and something has to give.
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Great input guys!
This car defiantly has an Electric Power Steering so no fluids (i guess?). I'm not experiencing any problem with self centering either.
When it comes to the alternator it really makes sense what you're saying. The alternator i bought was tested, and the bearings felt smooth and stabil. The one took out of my car felt like it had really worn out bearings. I could move the wheel that has contact to the belt a couple of millimeters back and forth and sideways too.
Could be that the one i replaced it with wasn't as good as the seller said. (I'm hoping i don't have to deal with that bottom bolt on the alternator again, but maybe i have..?!)
I feel like the suggestion about the belt slipping could make sense. This theory could also be supported by the fact that the problem occurs more frequently in humid/rainy weather right..?
So, I guess i have to do some more testing.
Any suggestion on how to proceed?
1. Do you think it would be possible to actually see the belt slipping if i'm in the car trying to force the problem to occur, while my friends films the belt..?
2. Is there any volt measurements that can be done to investigate further?
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If your battery is well past its best (contrary to what Honda say) then after starting the alternator will be trying to boost it back up. Add to that the EPS and something has to give.
+10
The battery is there to level out the load on the alternator in times of high power requirements (like power steering) I agree that battery is next port of call.
You can check the alternator by checking voltage on the battery at about 2000 rpm, should be around the 14.3 to 14.5 volt area (if it is below about 13.8 you have a problem), also let the battery stand for an hour after the engine has stopped and it should drop to about 12.4 to 12.6 volts.
If you don't know the age of the battery that is a problem, because batteries lose capacity over time and if it is over 5 years old it is normally due to retire gracefully and be replaced by a younger model (preferably a Yuasa, buy a Yuasa silver if you can get one, but even a standard Yuasa is better than most other batteries you can buy).
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Ok, again thanks for helping me!
The battery this one: https://www.mekonomen.no/Document/Image?fileName=20%5c20-S4018%5c12.jpg&size=product
and it's almost 1,5 years old. It has quite a lot of milage though!
Will do some measurements and post back soon:)
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Did some testing and the results looks ok to me.
Battery measured 12.6V (Car not been used for 6 hours)
During idle it measured 14.4 and when turning AC and turning the wheels it measured +/- 0.1V
Serpentine belt also feels tight and looks ok.
Any other thoughts?
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Hi,
The symptom itself (steering wheel stuck for a second) is most probably caused by the EPS ecu, which temporarily goes to a fail-safe state and restarts itself. Normally, upon a power shortage, you would more likely feel the steering support goes lower and lower before it cuts out completely - but i am talking about EPS systems in general, i am not familiar with this particular model. Maybe it ts too old and simple for that.
Like the others said, it can be some power supply related problem, but it must be some kind that it shuts down the system immediately. The fact the EPS light does not lit up also assumes that the ecu does not have time to show error indication, but it restarts itself immediately and then it thinks that everything is recovered.
Normally the symptom could be also caused by the overheating of the steering system, but since you said it is gone after 2-4 times, it makes it less probable.
So, first of all, I recommend to check and clean the electrical connection of the ecu, as it really needs tons of power ( > 100A ) when you are steering a standing vehicle. It is sealed well and it is unlikely to corrode, but you never know...
And, i would really try another battery, even if it looks fine otherwise. Maybe a borrowed one.
If it not helps, and you want to start debugging it, it would be great if you could measure the voltage and/or the power consumption during the occurrence of the fault. Unfortunately, you will need some fast measurement solution, like an oscilloscope. You can use special insulation-piercing probes for simplicity. Then, you can see then how much does the battery voltage drop at the ecu (during steering), and see if it drops lower when the fault occurs. If the voltage considerably drops, it indicates some external problem: cables, connectors, or battery (to rule out the problem with the battery, you can paralelly check the voltage on the battery and near the ecu). If the voltage looks fine, it is unfortunately some internal ecu error. You can try to disassemble it and re-solder what you can, but it is more likely you will need to replace it.
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The battery on a Jazz, is what I refer to as my torch battery. I know many suggestions have been raised and they all of course have merit, however my own experience with a Honda battery would suggest unless it is new beware.
Mine was tested by a main dealer as part of a service. Given a clean bill of health. Working on the car with a door open nothing else for an hour, flat battery. The interior light had drained it.
I bought a new battery for safety sake. The little bubble told me the battery was OK so given the dealer giving it the thumbs up and the little green bubble as well and yet an interior light flattened the battery.
As has been suggested, if you can, try another battery, but given you live in Norway unless you are very sure of the battery, replace it. Your Winter will soon show up a weak battery and it might clear up your problem BUT nothing is ever definite. Good luck. Here in the UK I notice steering parts are relatively cheap so if the worse comes to the worse a new ( S/H ) ECU might be a good investment.
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Hi again!
A short update from me:
I dismounted the battery and managed to access the ESP engine and it's connectors. It turned out that they where full of dust (even inside the connectors). The ground connector was very loos and rusty as well. I cleaned the cables and tightened the ground connector and mounted the battery back on. And guess what? Problem gone!
For 1,5 weeks it has been working perfectly smooth without any dropouts, BUT:
Last weekend when I started the engine the EPS light came on and there was no power steering at all. Close to impossible to turn the wheels when standing still and very heavy at low speeds. The problem has been like this since then.
Any suggestions what might have happened? I havn't had time to check the connectors again. Will do so later today. I used a OBD scanner, but no error codes that I could find. Any suggestions are highly appreciated!
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Have you checked the fuse? On my GD5, f2 is for the power steering.
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Yes, I checked the 40A fuse on the right side of the engine. Looks good. According to my manual there are no other fuses directly related to the power steering. However I'm planning to take out every fuse and inspect it later today just to be sure:)
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Any suggestions what might have happened? I haven't had time to check the connectors again. Will do so later today. I used a OBD scanner, but no error codes that I could find. Any suggestions are highly appreciated!
Yes, simple OBD scanners only shows faults that lit the check engine lamp. To read out eps, abs, etc fault codes you need some equipment that communicates with those ecus. Either a honda factory stuff, or some handmade one, if you are familiar with its comm protocol.
Without that, I'm afraid, you can only do the electrical connection checks, or the ecu replacement... or maybe the blind re-soldering.
If you check the voltage of the connector (while disconnected) you can also see if the fuse is ok or not.
ps. thinking about it, even if you had the eps fault code, you cannot really do anything more....
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OK, I'll try to do some voltage measurements now. I'm not very familiar with 12V, but I'll search and see if i can find some guides.
BTW: Anyone knows if this works on a Jazz? http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/mechanical-problems-technical-chat/229514-eps-reset.html
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Connectors on the EPS (on the steering column) unplugged and inspected. Everything looks OK.
Connectors on the ECU connectors looks like new and no signs of corrosion.
Some heavy rain came so I couldn't didn't have time to do any measurements.
I'm thinking about two options:
1. Replacing the ECU if a manage to get my hands on a used one.
2. Go to a Honda dealer and have them do a diagnostic to hopefully point out what has to be done.
What do you think?
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Depend on what you have to pay for the ECU.
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New update:
Took the car to a garage today and they did a diagnostic. It says (translated from Norwegian): Torque sensor "amplifier" without reach. Permanent.
It looks like the whole EPS on the steering column has to be replaced since the sensor is part of it. Pricey stuff!
Anyone tried to do this operation by them self?
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Looking at the Mk2 manual the job is not for the faint hearted. As to the Mk1 if you can get a manual and I think I saw an online version have a look. If you have the ability, the time and can get the parts in Norway go for it because if it is a pig, for a garage to do it, you are talking about mega cost.
I have seen many steering racks etc on Ebay, how much comes with the column and rack I know not but have a look. If necessary it surely can be shipped from UK.
If you go to Honda parts Uk put in your model and you get a breakdown of parts and part numbers. Only difficulty is where your Jazz was made. One can only assume if it was Japan, as I believe the Mk1 UK model was made, then the L/H drive and R/H drive might share the same parts, except of course the actual rack.
Good luck
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http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual.html (http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual.html)
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Seems like the 2005 Hatchback is not to be found on that site. It may look like the EPS circuits are slightly different from the other models. I thought all the Jazz's where Hatchbacks?
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What site? If you are referring to http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual.html (http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual.html) then EPS is on page 16 of the Wiring Diagram. Some of the later Mk 1 Jazz models have slightly updated wiring diagrams but there is usually enough there to get you by. The Haynes manual has even less accurate info.
All Jazz/Fit are hatchbacks.
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Ok, thanks.
I'm referring to http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual.html and noticed that they write "Except HATC Model" a lot of places, but the EPS diagram doesn't mention that so i guess it's ok.
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Seems like the 2005 Hatchback is not to be found on that site. It may look like the EPS circuits are slightly different from the other models. I thought all the Jazz's where Hatchbacks?
The English language manual is mostly about the 2002 pre-facelift model and there is one section missing, but the German / Dutch / Spanish / French language versions at http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual2/index.html may relate to the 2005 model more closely.
I would check the 6 pin torque sensor plug again, maybe one poor contact or a broken wire.
Pin > Colour > Function > Value
1 Red Sub
2 Not used / Keyway
3 Brown Signal Earth 0V
4 Blue Main
5 Yellow Vref 3.3V
6 White Vcc (5V or 12V ~not sure~)
- Grey/Blue Shield ground 0V
If it was something else like the EPS motor relay (under dashboard with EPS control unit) then a different diagnostic message would be given.
One other caution, the whole EPS steering rack has several part codes and it's shape has changed slightly between versions, if you are swapping it you may need an exact match to make it fit, although you may find you can just exchange the faulty part (i.e. torque sensor)
No need to change the main ECU, too many complications and does not control the EPS. The separate EPS control unit has talked to the diagnostic device so we can also assume that it is OK.
Where the manual says 'except HATC model' it does not mean HATChback but 'Honda Automotive Thailand Co'.
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TG
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Thanks!
Will definitely look into that 6-pin connector again. Think I'll measure continuity if I unplug the connectors in the other end from the EPS Module and check that the cables and connectors are OK.
I also just spoke to a Honda dealer who said that clearing the Error Code would likely solve the problem. Sounds a bit strange to me but I'll give it a try. According to this link I'll be able to reset the codes by jumping pin 4 and 9 on the 16pin OBD connector: http://www.hondafitjazz.com/manual/A00/HTML/21/SAA2E21K72200000000BBAT00.HTML
Anyone tried that before?
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I also just spoke to a Honda dealer who said that clearing the Error Code would likely solve the problem. Sounds a bit strange to me but I'll give it a try.
It's a standard way to diagnose whether a sensor issue is permanent or intermittant. Occasionally, a fault will reset and not come back, possibly when it's the result of some electrical glitch or some other external issue.
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I had an engine management warning light come on back in February. It went out after a minute and has never come back.
With my Volvo, I had a light that had to be reset, but several years later it had never returned either.
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Soooo a quick update:
I got hold of a used, low milage, steering rack and took my Jazz back to the garage where they had done the diagnostics earlier.
They changed the steering rack, but nothing happened.
They did some further diagnostics and realized that the EPS did not get any electric power from the Control Unit so they suggested to change this too. I got hold of a used one and they changed it today, but without any luck.
They said the EPS light kept blinking when they turned the car on, but now it's just lit constantly.
They said I should take the car to a Honda dealer and have a mechanic reset the Control Unit.
Any input before I take it to Honda? Starting to get seriously fed up with this EPS problem.. ::)
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It may be a broken wire that had been intermittent but due to movement is now a permanent break. The 2004/5 car has a known issue with a broken throttle wire, but I have not heard of this in relation to the power steering. If you've changed out these parts for known good ones then it sounds like the connections to them may be at fault. If you/they can't fix it then it sounds like their advice is the only realistic option.
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TG
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Last update: Problem finally solved now!
It turned out that the control unit was all good and working - the problem was the battery. After changing the battery the EPS light went off and everything worked perfectly fine.
Well, that was a long journey to get the EPS working, but thanks again for all your help and support.
Cheers,
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Last update: Problem finally solved now!
It turned out that the control unit was all good and working - the problem was the battery. After changing the battery the EPS light went off and everything worked perfectly fine.
Well, that was a long journey to get the EPS working, but thanks again for all your help and support.
Cheers,
The battery is a much underrated part of the car, and not a part to buy cheap - whenever I fit a new one (will definitely be a Yuasa) I write the date on it, it reminds me but also may be useful to anyone else who buys the car.
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I to have this problem and cant fix it. Car starts 1st time every time, and all electrics work perfect including the headlights lights. But ,this EPS saga persists. Its indeed like driving a tank.
What made you change the battery was it going slightly flat ?
I am now wondering if i should take a gamble and try this as looking around the web some have spent up to 2k trying to fix this issue and even Honda have been no help.
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As a previous post says, the battery can be quite a critical item in how some vehicle electrical systems work in practice. Generally speaking cars have tended to become less sensitive more recently (due to the extra complication and therefore the need to be more robust to variation), but 15 or 20yrs ago quite a lot of systems could be a bit fussy, if they didn't see quite the voltage (value, range, stability, recovery after start etc) they were expecting it could upset how they worked.
Have a look at your battery, there will probably be a date code on it somewhere, very often a week/year 4 digit code etched into the casing, like 2612 or something (week 26 year 2012).
If it's more than a few years old it might well be worth getting something like https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/yuasa/ybx5054/ , (double check it's the right one for your car!!) even if it doesn't fix your problem you won't have "wasted" much in the big scheme of things. If it solves it, it'll be a cheap simple fix. Based on the earlier report of a fix it sounds promising.
A lot of folk on this forum have had very good service from Tayna, including me. Generally next day delivery.
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Battery's 2.5 years old with 5 year guarantee and never let me down, but I note your points. Once all other routes have been tried, and not much left to try, apart from new column which is a road i wont be going down then; will take a gamble on battery. Its a shame as i will be forced to scrap the car and spent quite a bit on it just to keep it road worthy not least, a new exhaust and cat due to scum bag thieves. Full service brakes and alarm :(.
Embee, found an old bill and turns out my battery is 47 months old has a 5 year guarantee.
Just to add the car has only done very few miles the last 12 months 5k tops, could that have a baring on things. But has always started 1st time even when standing for 2 weeks in cold weather ?
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Tried new battery still same problem ?
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Hi all. I've just bought an '08 Sport and have a stiff and non centering steering issue. I picked up on it on the test drive, even mentioned it to the dealer (a jazz and yaris specialist), he didn't seemed concerned. Other than it not centering as I expected it tracked fine and didn't pull to either side, so I chalked it down to a jazz quirk and bought it. Now reading this is see it is known and common. The drive home was 70 miles of predominantly fast A road, I got used to it pretty quickly, but if I can improve what is not a great situation (too little castor, not adjustsble) I'll give it a try. My Aerodeck is the absolute opposite as it has very strong centering and it is preferable.
I've initially checked alternator and battery, both fine. Jacking up the car and trying to move the steering by holding the road wheels revealed the rack to be monstrously still (Yes the steering lock was off!). Might the top strut bearings need replacing? Do people here have experience in this offering an improvement?
Thanks.
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Other than it not centering as I expected
My Aerodeck is the absolute opposite as it has very strong centering and it is preferable.
Can you elaborate?
I've owned my 57 Jazz from new and steering is a bit heavy and does NOT self centre like other cars I've driven. You do have to give it a helping hand when for example coming off roundabouts. At motorway speeds, steering needs a bit more effort to nudge it to stay in lane.
A friend who owned an 06 Jazz (GD) from new used to complain about the lack of self centering.
I seem to recall my previous 1998 Civic 1.8VTI Aerodeck had lighter steering but don't quote me. I had a 1994 Rover 214SLi and the steering was incredibly light - could almost turn it with finger and thumb when stationary. Self centering on both and other cars were not an issue.
How old is the battery? Fwiw, if it is more than 3 years old, consider changing it. Varta A14 (Bosch S4018) is around £45 from Tayna off ebay.
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The Jazz steering is something I have adapted to over time. I find holding the wheel lower down helps greatly. So instead of 'quarter to 3', a bit more 'twenty to 4'. Give it a try.
I had very stiff steering in a Talbot Horizon years ago. Lower ball joint was the culprit. Not sure how you would test for it though.
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Other than it not centering as I expected
My Aerodeck is the absolute opposite as it has very strong centering and it is preferable.
Can you elaborate?
I've owned my 57 Jazz from new and steering is a bit heavy and does NOT self centre like other cars I've driven. You do have to give it a helping hand when for example coming off roundabouts. At motorway speeds, steering needs a bit more effort to nudge it to stay in lane.
A friend who owned an 06 Jazz (GD) from new used to complain about the lack of self centering.
I seem to recall my previous 1998 Civic 1.8VTI Aerodeck had lighter steering but don't quote me. I had a 1994 Rover 214SLi and the steering was incredibly light - could almost turn it with finger and thumb when stationary. Self centering on both and other cars were not an issue.
How old is the battery? Fwiw, if it is more than 3 years old, consider changing it. Varta A14 (Bosch S4018) is around £45 from Tayna off ebay.
Thanks for the reply. The steering has no notchiness to it, but it just stays where you leave it. It seems like if you turn and let go, the wheel stays at that steering angle and the car keeps turning. It is light to manually return to centre. It just leant do it by itself. The Accord on the other hand (with good old hydraulic PAS) centres quickly, I often just let the wheel unwind through my hand coming off roundabouts etc.
Its funny, 3 days ago if someone had described the fault, then said the battery may be to blame, I would have laughed at them. Having done some digging now I'm learning something new with EPS, and it makes sense. The current battery is halfords branded, but I have no indication of how old it is from service history etc. It measures ok with a DVM connected, but that is obviously a limited test as it has no real load connected. My gut says bearings, but I might try battery next. I would just like to get it to as good as it should be. I now see that it'll never be like the accord, which is ok tbh.
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Other than it not centering as I expected
My Aerodeck is the absolute opposite as it has very strong centering and it is preferable.
Can you elaborate?
I've owned my 57 Jazz from new and steering is a bit heavy and does NOT self centre like other cars I've driven. You do have to give it a helping hand when for example coming off roundabouts. At motorway speeds, steering needs a bit more effort to nudge it to stay in lane.
A friend who owned an 06 Jazz (GD) from new used to complain about the lack of self centering.
I seem to recall my previous 1998 Civic 1.8VTI Aerodeck had lighter steering but don't quote me. I had a 1994 Rover 214SLi and the steering was incredibly light - could almost turn it with finger and thumb when stationary. Self centering on both and other cars were not an issue.
How old is the battery? Fwiw, if it is more than 3 years old, consider changing it. Varta A14 (Bosch S4018) is around £45 from Tayna off ebay.
Thanks for the reply. The steering has no notchiness to it, but it just stays where you leave it. It seems like if you turn and let go, the wheel stays at that steering angle and the car keeps turning. It is light to manually return to centre. It just leant do it by itself. The Accord on the other hand (with good old hydraulic PAS) centres quickly, I often just let the wheel unwind through my hand coming off roundabouts etc.
Its funny, 3 days ago if someone had described the fault, then said the battery may be to blame, I would have laughed at them. Having done some digging now I'm learning something new with EPS, and it makes sense. The current battery is halfords branded, but I have no indication of how old it is from service history etc. It measures ok with a DVM connected, but that is obviously a limited test as it has no real load connected. My gut says bearings, but I might try battery next. I would just like to get it to as good as it should be. I now see that it'll never be like the accord, which is ok tbh.
Honda were the first company to introduce EPS, and IIRC the 2002-2008 Jazz had the earliest version of electric power steering fitted to a mass production car, and they had tried to balance amount of assistance against power drawn from battery, IIRC the Mk1 draws about 40 amps, the MK2 had different steering geometry and current went up to 60 amps. Also bear in mind the Jazz has a turning circle that puts a London taxi to shame, very easy to park, and needs assistance to get back from full lock, I never found the steering a problem on our Mk1's
https://www.autoserviceprofessional.com/articles/6024-honda-electric-power-steering
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The steering has no notchiness to it, but it just stays where you leave it. It seems like if you turn and let go, the wheel stays at that steering angle and the car keeps turning. It is light to manually return to centre.
What you describe is normal (to me).
fwiw, I have always witnessed PAS issues (no assistance) when the battery reaches 3.5 years or more shortly after starting the engine and trying to use the steering. Having said that, no PAS issues with the 3rd (Bosch) battery which was fine up to 4.5 years before I decided to replace it last autumn with a Varta A14 (same as Bosch S4018 but cheaper!) from Tayna ebay store as a preventative maintenance measure. (Starter motor now spins quicker)
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Tried new battery still same problem ?
Replaced EPS control unit.
EPS light is now intermittent on some days and not others as is the EPS functionality ?
No loose connections on wiring.
Alternator ok.
Ideas anyone as this appears to be a very rare fault.90% have just replaced EPS control box and all good...not here though :(
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Ideas anyone as this appears to be a very rare fault.90% have just replaced EPS control box and all good...not here though :(
Did you reset the torque sensor zero after swapping the EPS module?
I would find out what error codes the EPS is throwing up, otherwise you are just stabbing in the dark.
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I recall when I had the Mk2 Jazzes, they did require some assistance to straighten up, having turned a corner, also some correction required to keep in the lane on a motorway.
However, my Mk3 Jazz is totally different, no assistance required having turned a corner and far less tiring on a motorway. Very satisfied with the steering on this car, hopefully if I ever get round to a Mk4, it will be the same.