Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - 2020 => Topic started by: VicW on February 04, 2020, 06:43:19 PM
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I am considering buying a Mk3 but see that they have a variety of 'driver aids' as standard such as, speed limiter, forward collision device, traffic sign recognition, intelligent speed assist, high beam assist, stop/start and lane departure.
Can any of these devices be switched off permanently ?
Vic.
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get an S model it cuts down on all those things and you get a proper volume knob on the radio too (not a touch screen slider)
the only thing the S has got that you mentioned is stop/start (i always push the button to turn it off, but if you forget it does start right up instantly with no delay at all) and speed limiter which you have to turn on youself so not problem there
i got my S for the same reasons you are saying, i had all those gizmos on my yaris so i thought i would go back to honda for my third honda car
as a bonus they dont have the special valves in the tyres like other manufacturers do for pressure but use abs instead which saves a lot of messing about
also its got the same engine and gear box as the SE and EX models
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Exactly the same reasons I went for the S model, no fancy bells or whistles, just the right amount of tech that suits me fine.
I can even live without the alloy wheels, if a wheel trim gets scuffed all four can be replaced for 30 quid.
I do like the cruise control and obviously air con is a must nowadays both of which the S has, along with 4 electric windows.
Who could ask or even want for more ?? :D
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Exactly the same reasons I went for the S model, no fancy bells or whistles, just the right amount of tech that suits me fine.
I can even live without the alloy wheels, if a wheel trim gets scuffed all four can be replaced for 30 quid.
I do like the cruise control and obviously air con is a must nowadays both of which the S has, along with 4 electric windows.
Who could ask or even want for more ?? :D
exactly lol :D
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Vic.
They can all be turned off/ not used/ ignored.....
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I'm not sure that you can turn off forward collision protection, but I think the sensitivity for the alarm can be changed. Why turn off emergency braking - it's there in case you have a black-out or fall asleep? The sign recognition is just information, and in my experience only recognises some speed limits, and doesn't control the car in any way.
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The sign recognition is just information, and in my experience only recognises some speed limits, and doesn't control the car in any way.
If you have the speed-limiter on, does it not control that?
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The sign recognition is just information, and in my experience only recognises some speed limits, and doesn't control the car in any way.
If you have the speed-limiter on, does it not control that?
There are two speed limiters, both of which are off by default (ie you have to specifically turn them on when you want them).
The “normal” limiter is one you set manually to a speed of your choosing. Very useful in motorway roadworks with average speed cameras.
The “intelligent” limiter takes its setting from the sign recognition system. Good idea in principle, but the sign recognition mis-reads the signs too often for comfort. Personally I find it has similar usefulness to a chocolate teapot.
Neither system actually controls the car, if by that you mean removing the need for driver input. Both prevent you accelerating past the set speed, although I believe you can override by flooring the accelerator (not tested this myself). Below the set speed, you just drive and control the car normally.
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The 'Normal' speed limiter, is tied in with Cruise control and will control the car, in that if you set a speed, lets say 5 mph above your current speed, the car will accelerate up to that speed and then maintain it, as long as required.
Touching the brake, or hitting the 'off' button will deactivate it instantly.
I use it for the vast majority of my motoring and as others have said, for maintaining speed limits, it's very useful.
Lane departure, is permanently switched off, also stop/start, when I remember!!
One of my pet hates is seeing rows of glaring brake lights when stopped in traffic, but don't get me started on lack of consideration for your fellow motorist generally, I guess it's the times we live in.
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Thanks for the replies. I considered the 'S' model but used ones with CVT are as rare as rocking horse manure locally.
Vic.
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The 'Normal' speed limiter, is tied in with Cruise control and will control the car, in that if you set a speed, lets say 5 mph above your current speed, the car will accelerate up to that speed and then maintain it, as long as required.
Bit puzzled by this comment, your car must behave differently to mine!
Cruise control (CC) and the Speed Limiters (SLs) are operated by the same set of buttons, but have quite different functions.
CC operates as you suggest by controlling the throttle so as to maintain a set speed, but you can exceed that speed using moderate gas pedal, eg if you need a higher speed temporarily in order to overtake.
By contrast, when using the SL you still need to control the throttle yourself, but it acts to prevent you exceeding the set speed by closing the throttle when you try (and sounds an alarm if you do so accidentally, eg when going downhill).
I don't believe you can have both CC & SL operating simultaneously.
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You can also set the speed limiter to use the speeds from the sign recognition system, but I found that to be a real pain, as you can't accelerate again until after you've passed the end of the speed limit - most frustrating and it infuriates following drivers! But for VicW, you have to opt in to these things - they are off by default.
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When I had the loaner I found that the speed limiter was on and reading the signs. I had no idea how to cancel it so just pushed the accelerator down. It beeped at me but sped up anyway. Just a bit more resistance to pedal.
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I tried the speed limiter but found it annoying and never use it. Lane departure warning very irritating as it can go off when you don't expect it so I turned that off. The forward collision thing is OK and, in my car, it will apply the brakes at low speed to avoid a collision. Not sure if you can turn it off.
I had the SE spec but find going back to climate control with the EX is an upgrade. It does work well on this car and I don't find the touchscreen controls as irritating as I thought I would.
But I think the advice to buy the S if you don't want the toys is very sound. I have a neighbor who always gets the top spec in any car he buys but doesn't use half the stuff. He managed to change the language on his touchscreen to something Eastern European and he got a sat nav included but never goes further than Tesco!
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I must confess, ColinB to being a little confused. Having thought about again, I find I never SLs, but use CC all the time where possible. I think like peteo48 I would find SLs really annoying.
Never use Lane departure, or High Beam Assist, but do use Collision Avoidance & Parking distance control.
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Having thought about again, I find I never SLs, but use CC all the time where possible.
I kind of thought that from your description, but didn't want to say so out loud :o
Not sure why the speed limiter would be annoying, it's really helpful in the right place, eg a camera-controlled average speed check zone: your attention can be outside the window instead of being fixated on the speedometer. The advantage over CC is that you can vary your speed easily using normal throttle control to match the other traffic. If the Jazz had adaptive CC then perhaps that would make the limiter less useful ... but it doesn't.
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When I had the loaner I found that the speed limiter was on and reading the signs. I had no idea how to cancel it so just pushed the accelerator down. It beeped at me but sped up anyway. Just a bit more resistance to pedal.
Don't understand this comment. The two speed limiters and the cruise control are off by default when you start the engine, you have to positively set them in order to get the benefits. However, the Mk3 also has the facility to set audible alarms when you exceed certain speeds (I have mine set to 30 & 70, but you can change these to suit your preference). I suspect that your loan car had one or both of these set, and that's what you were hearing: you would have heard the beeps a few times and then they would have stopped. If you were genuinely experiencing the speed limiter, the beeping would not stop until you'd dropped down below the limit speed. The alarms are not speed limiters, simply audible reminders that you've reached certain speeds, and do not act on the throttle in the way the limiter does.
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That could be the case. I just got in the car and drove it. Managed to switch the radio off but as far as everything else it could have been the Space Shuttle I was in. I do know the lights came on when I went through some trees and I found out it had 6-gears!
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However, the Mk3 also has the facility to set audible alarms when you exceed certain speeds (I have mine set to 30 & 70, but you can change these to suit your preference).
This also a feature on the Mk2.
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I am considering buying a Mk3 but see that they have a variety of 'driver aids' as standard such as, speed limiter, forward collision device, traffic sign recognition, intelligent speed assist, high beam assist, stop/start and lane departure.
Can any of these devices be switched off permanently ?
Vic.
Speed limiter: normally is off.
Foward collision device: always on, from 0 to 20mph, then only the alert goes on working.
Traffic sign recognition: always on, there is only a sign on the instrument panel.
Intelligent speed assist: as the speed limiter.
High beam assist: always on.
Start&Stop: always on, cannot be permanently disabled.
Lane departure: can be switched off pressing the button.
My question is why paying for this useful devices and then disabling them...
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Manual use of the high-beam control disables the automatic system for that trip unless reset by lifting the control towards you for 3 seconds. I prefer to leave it on automatic.
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My question is why paying for this useful devices and then disabling them...
Depending what model you buy these gizmos are not options. The more of these devices a car has the more the driver becomes used to them and the less the driver his/her self drives the car. His/her attention span lowers until they are not aware what is going on around them, they are driving like robots.
Vic.
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Twenty years ago many people were against ABS because they believed that this system would have brought drivers do forget how to brake fine in panic stops. The story shows us that in panic stops drivers used to deeply press the brake pedal and to keep it pressed, both with or without ABS... So abs was a big improvement in safety. As ABS, these are supplementary driving aids and safety devices and they won't work if you do not make a mistake; lane departure system will never warn you if you keep driving in your lane, automatic brake will never stop the car if you keep safety distances, airbags will never deploy if you hit another car, and so on.
The only real aid is the high beam assist: I find it useful, because now my high beams works alone, without pushing and pulling the lever; I usually drive also other cars, driving them as I used to drive my previous car and no, I don't drive them worst since I have a Jazz with an automatic high beam device... I drive these old cars as I used to drove my old renault, keeping low beams also when I could push high beams, so I have to admit that with the Jazz I see better than before, since Jazz switchs to high beams also for some seconds...
No, I definetly prefer the Jazz with aids.
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I just hear a story this afternoon, about a woman whose car was in for accident damage repair (not her fault, struck while parked). She had parked the courtesy car and was walking away when she noticed it moving. She hadn't put on the handbrake (her car has an automatic electric handbrake). The next thing was she was getting flashed at because she didn't have any lights on. Her car has automatic lights.
It is amazing how quickly we forget. Back in the '80s, I spent three weeks driving an automatic (my first time with auto transmission). On my final day one of the guys brought in his 71 Corvette Stingray, a pre federal spec muscle car, and the first time I tried to come to a halt I forgot to depress the clutch. A 7 litre V8 takes some stalling! But I managed it.
(https://i.imgur.com/jleXj4O.jpg)
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High beam assist is excellent in my experience. I do as little night time driving as I can get away with these days but this is just one less thing to think about when you are trying to concentrate on the road in poor light.
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The only thing that I have disabled is the lane departure warning. I don't indicate when pulling back into the left hand lane on a dual carriageway and I got fed up with it telling me.
Like someone else said, why get a car with all these aids on and not use them? The one thing that you have to be aware of is that they are just aids and should not be relied on, as the Magistrate will no doubt tell you.
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The only thing that I have disabled is the lane departure warning. I don't indicate when pulling back into the left hand lane on a dual carriageway and I got fed up with it telling me.
Like someone else said, why get a car with all these aids on and not use them? The one thing that you have to be aware of is that they are just aids and should not be relied on, as the Magistrate will no doubt tell you.
Even the lane departure warning is helpful if you were to doze off. There is a steady flow of accidents where the absence of tyre marks shows that the driver had briefly lost consciousness. This is why I think the collision avoidance system is invaluable.
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Does auto braking work above 20mph ?
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Does auto braking work above 20mph ?
No
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I think that all these 'aids' are giving drivers a false sense of security as quite a few Tesla owners have found out - autopilot is not much more than cruise control, and will not stop you hitting a parked fire truck, or even accelerating as you approach it, and lane deviation only works when there are actually lines in the road that are visible. Anything that gives people the impression that they no longer have to pay as much attention to driving has got to be a bad thing, For Jazzaro to compare ABS brakes to main beam assist and speed limit recognition is disingenuous - ABS is a great safety aid** that comes into play at a critical moment to help the driver brake safely - it gives them the braking ability of a well trained professional ( I have it on my motorbike, where IMHO it is more crucial than having it on a four wheel vehicle ), the rest should not be required if the driver is paying attention. I wonder how many drivers with brake assist actually realise it only works at low speed and career around under the impression it will save their life if something happens while they are messing with their phone at 60mph ?
** Even so, ABS can actually increase stopping distance on loose surfaces and snow, and traction control often better turned off in snow and mud.
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"The rest should not be required if the driver is paying attention". OK, but my concern is the driver who briefly dozes, and it happens all too frequently. An alarm to jolt the driver alert is important in my view.
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ABS can actually increase stopping distance on loose surfaces and snow, and traction control often better turned off in snow and mud.
They reckon that the quickest way you can stop in the snow is when the wheels lock and the snow builds up ahead of the wheels. ABS prevents that happening.
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"The rest should not be required if the driver is paying attention". OK, but my concern is the driver who briefly dozes, and it happens all too frequently. An alarm to jolt the driver alert is important in my view.
I am actually in favour of ditching drivers seatbelts and airbags ( not passenger ones ) and putting a big spike in the centre of the steering wheel - the message being 'if you don't pay attention and have a crash this will impale you and you will die' - that should get driver to pay attention. You can tell by the way a lot of people drive their tin box that they think they are invulnerable and their sorry 455 is well protected - let them feel vulnerable like cyclists, pedestrians and motorbike riders and it may help change their perspective a bit.
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I've always thought that riding a motorbike makes you a much better car driver.
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Hi Vic,
We’ve lived with our Mk3 Jazz for a little over a year now and put around 6000 miles on top of the 16000 it had when we got it. It’s a manual SE and one of the early Mk3’s (Sept 2015). Living here in Orkney we both tend to use most of the functions available but the lane assist is permanently switched off - might turn it on when we venture down to Englandshire next time but just for the long motorway parts. I quite like the headlamp dip system and only makes small errors in heavy rain. Parking sensors occasionally useful but the warning of collision can be a bit disconcerting when approaching left handers if there is traffic coming the other way, which it sees as a threat! The flashed message is so transient that it’s useless. The ice warning operates at 3 degrees but if the temp rises to something above that, then drops to 3 or below again there is no further warning beep on that trip. Can’t agree with others about the volume ‘slider’ on the touch screen - there are still + and - buttons on the wheel which work well. Like everyone else, really hacked off with the idiot message at every start up - not possible to remove. Fuel consumption display lies like a politician!
Otherwise it’s a great little car,
Ian
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"The rest should not be required if the driver is paying attention". OK, but my concern is the driver who briefly dozes, and it happens all too frequently. An alarm to jolt the driver alert is important in my view.
I am actually in favour of ditching drivers seatbelts and airbags ( not passenger ones ) and putting a big spike in the centre of the steering wheel - the message being 'if you don't pay attention and have a crash this will impale you and you will die' - that should get driver to pay attention. You can tell by the way a lot of people drive their tin box that they think they are invulnerable and their sorry 455 is well protected - let them feel vulnerable like cyclists, pedestrians and motorbike riders and it may help change their perspective a bit.
I seem to remember, in the mists of time, a colleague telling me that the insurance on his Lada Riva was the lowest he'd had on any previous car. The car was massively outdated (based on the Fiat 124 if memory serves) with crap brakes, a noisy engine and diabolical handling. That car took some driving (I know from being a passenger) and the insurance industry isn't daft, actuarially it must have had relatively few accidents. I had a lift in my brother's 4 series Beemer just before Christmas - liking being in my lounge but with better seats!
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...the insurance industry isn't daft, actuarially it must have had relatively few accidents.
The insurance industry is usually interested in how much a repair would cost after a car is damaged. A car like the Lada, which was cheap to buy in the first place, had cheap parts and was easy to repair, would have low premiums. A simple low speed shunt would just involve unbolting and replacing a few panels. A more modern car would be more expensive to insure not only because it costs more in the first place, but a relatively minor shunt could write it off because distortion of the crumple zones would make it expensive, if not impossible, to repair. The modern car would however be streets ahead of the Lada in terms of occupant safety.
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Fair comment. You certainly wouldn't want to be in a crash in a Lada. I still think there is something in the "cushioned isolation" of the driver from the road thing and the ability to fiddle about on the internet from an infotainment screen is undesirable from my point of view. My cousin's late husband, an engineer involved in the motor industry for all his working life, simply couldn't believe that manufacturers were able to get away with these screens. We see adverts for Apple Play and the android equivelant - you absolutely should not be engaging in editing your play list or reading emails while you are driving.
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I'm currently abroad driving a hired Astra which has a lane departure system which tries to take over the steering, but it does not give an audible warning. It is intermittent in operation because in order to function it has to see two white lines, one on each side. I think the C-RV has something similar, and it may well be fitted in the new hybrid Jazz. I think I prefer the current Jazz system with the audible warning for crossing a single line on either side without signalling, as per the training mantra "Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre".
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I think I prefer the current Jazz system with the audible warning for crossing a single line on either side without signalling, as per the training mantra "Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre".
I would be much happier if that system had the intelligence to only enable itself on motorways and dual carriageway roads. Mine got turned off after getting over-excited by me deliberately crossing the white line down the middle of relatively narrow rural roads in order to smooth out some of the bends when visibility permitted.
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Lane departure does only work above 40mph
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Do you not get Adaptive Cruise Control? Set your maximum and set your desired following distance and the system will follow the car in front up to that speed. If it slows down then your car will brake automatically to maintain the set distance. If you decide to overtake the system will latch on to the next vehicle and do the same.
I find it helps relive the strain of motorway driving quite a lot. I did a 6 hour round trip last week and was far less tired than I was doing the same with my GD1.
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Do you not get Adaptive Cruise Control?
Not in my 2016 Mk 3, but then I'm up in Scotland so have more chance to easily use the simpler version. Had the adaptive cruise control in an automatic hire car recently, very easy to use in town, just point the car in the right direction and make sure that you're aware of what the cars are doing around you as them changing positions might give unexpected braking / acceleration.
ACC and self dipping rear mirrors would be nice on my next car. I tend to not use the lane assist as I try to straighten out bends when safe to do so, parking sensors stay on as does the stop / start and auto headlights, all of which seem to be logical most of the time in how they operate and I don't feel as if I'm fighting them / they're intruding into my driving as has been the case with other makes of cars. YMMV.
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Do you not get Adaptive Cruise Control?
The Mk3 Jazz sold in the UK does not have adaptive cruise control in any trim level.
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I see, I haven't found it useful in town here. It works above 40km/hr and I tried it a bit but decided I was a lot better at predicting the many delays and adjusting speed gradually and smoothly than it was. Most city driving here is slow and the words stop/start don't begin to do it justice. The same is true to some extent on the motorway - I can adjust more smoothly and earlier than it can but for those long boring stretches when everything is just running along smoothly I do find it very helpful to turn it and Lane Keeping Assist System on. It is less tiring for sure.
I assume you get the Road Departure Mitigation system. At first I turned it off because I thought I might want to cross the centre line to avoid something - possibly if a deer or something runs in front of the car. However, the other driver of the car's steering is really poor so I decided that was the greater risk and turned it back on Sure enough, the other driver commented the the other day that the system often alerts her to the fact she is drifting too far either to the left or right. It is supposed to warn you/brake if you are in danger of hitting a pedestrian which could also be useful around here as the roads are often narrow and there are no pavements, so no separation.
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I think you're in Japan ? Car manufacturers fit different system to cars depending on the market they are being sold in. So what you have on your Japanese-spec Jazz reflects local regulations and expectations. UK-spec cars do not necessarily mirror that, but it is interesting to hear what the Japanese market requires. At least Japanese cars have the steering wheel on the correct side of the car !
So we don't get adaptive cruise control, and we have something called Lane Departure Warning, which just alerts the driver should the car perceive you are veering out of a marked lane. Your Lane Keeping Assist and Road Departure Mitigation sound similar but from your description may actively steer the car. Personally I find the idea of needing systems to prevent you driving off the road, or to avoid a pedestrian, pretty worrying: others have commented previously about such systems encouraging the driver to "switch off" rather than concentrate on what he/she is doing.
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Yes. Spot on. I was/am a bit doubtful but as I age I wonder if some extra help is not a bad idea. One should never ever rely on these systems though.
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Yes. Spot on. I was/am a bit doubtful but as I age I wonder if some extra help is not a bad idea. One should never ever rely on these systems though.
If they're helpful in preventing one less injury / scare / damage then they're of use. As long as you remember who's in control! Which is why I often curse the lane departure when it gives me a "warning" that I don't need.
A "fun" game is to mess with the switchable options that a driver has set up, and see their confusion / irritation / conviction something is wrong with the car. My garage played that on me when they switched on the lane departure and I was convinced that the collision / parking sensors were faulty, till I noticed the warning only seemed to happen when I was near to a white line ::)
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I find high beam assist one of the best features of the tech, lightning reaction on dark roads and dips at first sight of approaching lights.
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I agree Gordon - a very useful feature that works well.