Author Topic: The complainers.  (Read 13619 times)

Skyrider

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2016, 08:56:35 PM »
TPMS became mandatory on new cars sold in Europe from 1 November 2014. Fortunately the Mk3 Jazz uses the ABS system to monitor wheel rotation rates, faster wheel = deflating tyre. Much better than expensive and fragile kit attached to the wheels or valves.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2016, 08:45:12 AM by Deeps »

culzean

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2016, 09:53:07 PM »
TPMS became mandatory on new cars sold in Europe from 1 November 2014. Fortunately the Mk3 Jazz uses the ABS system to monitor wheel rotation rates, faster wheel = deflating tyre. Much better than expensive kit attached to the wheels or valves.

The ABS based TPMS certainly works and is probably not as temperamental or high maintenance as the pressure based systems - no sensors or batteries to worry about,  no having to synchronise replacement sensors with the cars computer.  The only problem I can see with it is that it doesn't tell you which tyre the alarm is for,  just that one of the 4 tyres is showing a low pressure - but it is easy enough to check and normally pretty obvious,  except when I had two new tyres and the alarm showed up next day !!! - there was nothing wrong but why it waited a day to trigger after new tyres I don't know. 

The ABS system suits me because I have both summer and winter tyre wheels,  and don't fancy paying for sensors for every wheel I want to fit to car,  and having to get them synchronised every year  :-X  What happens if your spare doesn't have a sensor ??
« Last Edit: August 07, 2016, 09:56:56 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

ColinS

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2016, 10:18:02 PM »
I did try and start a thread a few months ago - "I like my MK3 Jazz because" but it soon became another complaining thread.

I noticed that and this thread is yet another example  :)

edam

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2016, 10:27:09 PM »
If the car does a full emergency stop for no reason I would like to know if this is a common problem or just unique to my car.
By posting about this on a forum I can obtain this information.

Skyrider

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #19 on: August 07, 2016, 10:29:46 PM »
Operator error?

mikebore

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2016, 11:01:45 PM »
Operator error?

How would that work then?....I need to know in case I do it.

edam

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #21 on: August 07, 2016, 11:18:50 PM »
Operator error?

Dirty windscreen ?

Skyrider

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2016, 07:45:17 AM »
The city brake and false start systems work within closely defined parameters. You may have strayed into them inadvertently. My city brake system has only triggered once (so far), I was passing a solitary car parked in my street. The alarm scared the bejesus out of me but the brakes did not apply themselves (going too fast). On my return I went past the same car close and slower and the system did not activate. I think I am on a steep learning curve with these systems, and if they activate you are either pushing your luck or have got it wrong in some way.

The false start system seems like a good idea, the classic I have seen a few times is someone rear ending of the car in front while entering a roundabout, thinking it has moved off.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 07:55:14 AM by Deeps »

Skyrider

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #23 on: August 08, 2016, 08:15:16 AM »
The Jazzes' automotive engineering is fine.

Maybe your Jazz has more recent software than mine and Honda have made some changes. I hope so but will only find out next month when my car has its annual service.

I hope you don't think that software is routinely updated at a service. In my experience it is updated if there is a specific problem and the manufacturer runs a "Campaign" to rectify the defect. This is usually not safety related (a fuel gauge error for example) and below the level of a formal recall, and not advertised to Joe public. If you buy a (say) 2015 car you buy 2015 software.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 08:29:10 AM by Deeps »

andruec

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #24 on: August 08, 2016, 08:49:27 AM »
I am new to this forum but it seems to be dominated by serial complainers. Headlights, CVT, boot size, boot floor, proximity alarms,  etc, etc. I accept that the infotainment is a bit glich prone.
...
Didn't people research their purchace before parting with their hard earned cash?
Of course. But:

* The infotainment issues weren't evident during my test drive.
* The boot floor I noticed immediately (I did a size test with my golf bag and I spotted it then).
* I noticed slightly odd behaviour of the CVT as well but hoped it would improve when run in.
* The headlights are no worse on the Mk3 than the Mk2.

Where you seem to be making a mistake is to assume that other people only buy cars that are perfect. Or else not understanding why someone can complain about a purchase without actually regretting it. Maybe you have a protective 'purchasers reflex' that means you always ignore problems with what you buy so as to reassure yourself about the decision.

I like my Jazz. I don't regret buying it. But that doesn't blind me to the shortcomings and by discussing them amongst other owners it's always possible that a solution might be forthcoming. There have been a couple of suggestions for resolving the boot issue. I posted a solution to a 'difficult starting' problem. I've reassured a few people that there is nothing wrong with their headlights but that it's just Honda's slightly iffy implementation. I've even let people know that my initially strong criticism of the CVT wasn't entirely justified.

I own my car, the forum moderators have not criticised my posts so I see no reason to try and pretend that the vehicle is perfect.
If the car was written off, would you buy another? The answer for me is most defiantly no. If it was my car not the wife's it would have gone back by now.
For me it's 'maybe'. I'd have a look around first but I'm not currently aware of a better vehicle for my needs.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 08:51:29 AM by andruec »

andruec

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #25 on: August 08, 2016, 08:56:30 AM »
I hope you don't think that software is routinely updated at a service. In my experience it is updated if there is a specific problem and the manufacturer runs a "Campaign" to rectify the defect.
And in my experience it might not be updated even if you ask them to. To be fair I did forget to mention here that I got a call a week later from the service manager apologising for the error but it still wasted over an hour of my time. But there's another Honda dealer not much further away and possibly easier to get to. It's not the first time I've had issues with the Oxford one so I'll just switch to Northampton.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 11:46:49 AM by andruec »

ColinB

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #26 on: August 08, 2016, 09:08:24 AM »
... forums like this exist, to allow prospective owners to find out information, warts and all, before taking the plunge.
Internet forums nearly always have a lot of "complainers" but in my opinion these Jazz forums are amongst the best for constructive criticism and useful discussion.
Those posts sum up the value of this forum. I don't think it's dominated by "complainers", in fact labelling someone as a "complainer" when they're only trying to help others, or seeking help themselves, by offering genuine feedback isn't helpful. I actually want to know what people think about their cars, and I hope this thread doesn't put people off from providing that feedback. The value of the forum would be diminished if it only published comments of the sort "I like my Jazz because ..." variety (although that is of course valuable and relevant feedback).

BTW, I do like my Jazz. It does all the basic "car things" - performance, economy, comfort, practicality, etc - exceedingly well. The things I have provided negative feedback about are all secondary issues that do not work as per my extensive  pre-purchase research (which included test drives and discussions with the dealer).

But if we're going to discuss how the forum is used, could I put in a plea to keep on-subject in every thread ? Too many threads seem to go off on a tangent, eg my thread about the infotainment system error contains comments about rear-seat legroom and Windows 10 updates. Even this present thread has veered into comments about car features rather than staying with the point the OP made. Start a new thread if you want to go off-topic. Oh dear, perhaps I should have started a new thread for that ...

ColinS

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #27 on: August 08, 2016, 10:03:06 AM »
... forums like this exist, to allow prospective owners to find out information, warts and all, before taking the plunge.
Internet forums nearly always have a lot of "complainers" but in my opinion these Jazz forums are amongst the best for constructive criticism and useful discussion.
Those posts sum up the value of this forum. I don't think it's dominated by "complainers", in fact labelling someone as a "complainer" when they're only trying to help others, or seeking help themselves, by offering genuine feedback isn't helpful. I actually want to know what people think about their cars, and I hope this thread doesn't put people off from providing that feedback. The value of the forum would be diminished if it only published comments of the sort "I like my Jazz because ..." variety (although that is of course valuable and relevant feedback).

BTW, I do like my Jazz. It does all the basic "car things" - performance, economy, comfort, practicality, etc - exceedingly well. The things I have provided negative feedback about are all secondary issues that do not work as per my extensive  pre-purchase research (which included test drives and discussions with the dealer).

But if we're going to discuss how the forum is used, could I put in a plea to keep on-subject in every thread ? Too many threads seem to go off on a tangent, eg my thread about the infotainment system error contains comments about rear-seat legroom and Windows 10 updates. Even this present thread has veered into comments about car features rather than staying with the point the OP made. Start a new thread if you want to go off-topic. Oh dear, perhaps I should have started a new thread for that ...
I agree with everything you say and could not have put it better.

Skyrider

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #28 on: August 09, 2016, 08:23:09 AM »
I am sorry, I missed complaining to Trading Standards from my OP.

At least no one has suggested writing a letter of complaint to their MP.............yet. :-)

One thing I find odd is some folk comparing the Mk3 with previous Jazz models. Honda spent a huge chunk of its marketing budget to promote and made no secret of the fact that the Mk3 is a totally new car with a Jazz badge on the back. Maybe they should have used the "Fit" name in Europe to resolve this problem.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2016, 08:37:30 AM by Deeps »

andruec

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Re: The complainers.
« Reply #29 on: August 09, 2016, 08:36:56 AM »
One thing I find odd is some folk comparing the Mk3 with previous Jazz models. Honda spent a huge chunk of its marketing budget to promote and made no secret of the fact that the Mk3 is a totally new car with a Jazz badge on the back.
That's a new one on me. They said it was redesigned and built off a new platform but at no point have they suggested that it has no connection with previous models. They might not refer to it as the 'Mk3' but I have seen nothing to suggest that they don't think it's the latest incarnation.

People like me who bought the Mk1 and the Mk2 would be expected to buy the Mk3. The strange thing would be to not compare them.

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