RDMS and winter

[Kremmen]

I downloaded and went through the manual multiple times to get a handle on what was possible.

I think this under dash button press initially came from here though.

I've tried all the options for myself as we all have different experiences and views due to driving style and roads used and the ones I don't like are RDMS, ACC and LKAS.

CMBS has never kicked in AFAIK so that's good to have on standby.

[peteo48]

Just had an email exchange with my brother - he's even older than me. He got a new 3 series BMW early last month. He says the tech on that "is insane" and he uses almost none of it (he is a bit of a luddite and has never used cruise control). He also keeps getting calls from the dealer reminding him to pair up his phone with the BMW App. He keeps telling the dealer that this is not going to happen.

I know my daughter uses Apple Car Play on her Quashqai so doesn't use the Nissan infotainment system at all and a lot of people do that now. Doesn't get round switching certain things off though.

I wonder if this is a not so subtle way of getting older drivers off the road?

[ColinB]

I've tried all the options for myself as we all have different experiences and views due to driving style and roads used and the ones I don't like are RDMS, ACC and LKAS.

One thing that continues to puzzle me (as a mildly interested spectator) is the difference between Road Departure Mitigation (RDMS) and Lane Keeping Assistance (LKAS). They sound very similar in detecting lane or road edge markings and actively steering the car to stay within them ... are they effectively the same thing?

[sportse]

I've tried all the options for myself as we all have different experiences and views due to driving style and roads used and the ones I don't like are RDMS, ACC and LKAS.

One thing that continues to puzzle me (as a mildly interested spectator) is the difference between Road Departure Mitigation (RDMS) and Lane Keeping Assistance (LKAS). They sound very similar in detecting lane or road edge markings and actively steering the car to stay within them ... are they effectively the same thing?

LKAS only operates above 45mph after being activated and also only when it can see clear lane markings on either side.

RDMS works all the time, and is supposed to recognise verges/etc. However on country roads that are a bit narrow it goes off even if you are well clear of any edges.

[Jazzik]

RDMS works all the time, and is supposed to recognise verges/etc. However on country roads that are a bit narrow it goes off even if you are well clear of any edges.

RDMS gives temporarely up when you ignore it some 3 times and even warns that it does! So it doesn't work all the time. 
Moreover, it can be experienced as annoying (it is!), but dangerous seems to me an exaggeration when you keep your hands on the wheel. For those of you who still think so: Kremmen has already neatly explained how to turn it off, with pictures in his post at 12:23:09 PM.

PS You will have to repeat this "switch off" every time you (re)start the car.

[ColinB]

I've tried all the options for myself as we all have different experiences and views due to driving style and roads used and the ones I don't like are RDMS, ACC and LKAS.

One thing that continues to puzzle me (as a mildly interested spectator) is the difference between Road Departure Mitigation (RDMS) and Lane Keeping Assistance (LKAS). They sound very similar in detecting lane or road edge markings and actively steering the car to stay within them ... are they effectively the same thing?

LKAS only operates above 45mph after being activated and also only when it can see clear lane markings on either side.

RDMS works all the time, and is supposed to recognise verges/etc. However on country roads that are a bit narrow it goes off even if you are well clear of any edges.

So, in terms of functionality, they are both doing the same thing which is trying to keep the car within a lane. The differences are only of detail, ie car speed (not sure why that is relevant, surely lane keeping at <45mph is as important as >45mph?) and how well defined the lane edges are. It'd be less confusing if they just lumped both together under a single system name. Maybe there's some arcane bit of NCAP rules that requires different systems.

[peteo48]

I've wondered about this Colin. I'm pretty sure Lane Keep Assist is not a requirement of NCAP whereas RDMS is (to get 5 stars). Also, you have to switch Lane Keep Assist on so there isn't that problem with RDMS where you have to turn it off at every new start.

Seems a bit weird to me that LKA is, effectively, optional even though it operates at high speeds and, arguably, more likely to prevent a serious mishap (nodding off at the wheel on the motorway?).

RDMS kicks in at very low speeds. Indeed I'm talking 10 mph in some circs with me. Get too close (in its opinion) and it fires off tugging the steering wheel, applying the brakes and generally being a bloody nuisance. I haven't driven on this sort of road yet but people who drive on narrow country lanes find it actually dangerous. You could be facing on coming traffic and the damn thing will try to prevent you pulling over.

It's a deeply flawed system but Honda are not alone in using this technology. Designed by Health and Safety Bureaucrats I would suggest rather than people who actually know how to design a useful safety feature.

[Jazzik]

So, in terms of functionality, they are both doing the same thing which is trying to keep the car within a lane.

No, simply put LKAS will keep you above 45mph in your lane while RDMS will keep you on the road.

[ColinB]

So, in terms of functionality, they are both doing the same thing which is trying to keep the car within a lane.

No, simply put LKAS will keep you above 45mph in your lane while RDMS will keep you on the road.

Without wishing to get too pedantic, they are the same thing. Staying on the road amounts to staying in lane; it's just that the nearside of the lane is bounded by a road edge or verge rather than a white line.

[Jazzik]

My suggestion without getting too pedantic  : Book a test drive and experience the difference for yourself. You may also wonder why Honda thinks up 2 names and different controls...

[ColinB]

You may also wonder why Honda thinks up 2 names and different controls...

Yup, that’s exactly why I’m asking the question. There are two systems with identical functionality (keeping the car within a lane) and only minor differences of detail (speed and lane edge delineator), but different names, sensors, controls, etc ... why have they done that? Others have commented on how confusing some of the electronic controls are, so why have this unnecessary complexity? Is there a reason, or did Honda just have two design teams who didn’t talk to each other?

[Jazzist]

With my new Jazz I have the experience that on a 60 km (37 mph) road it tries to force a steering correction in the beginning, but when the RDMS notices that it "doesn't help" it more or less realizes that it is a normal situation, he stops the warning movements at the wheel. So I can live with it.

[shufty]

...One puts you back in the lane if you have veered out the other stops you veering out in the first place.
So I don't class them as being the same thing at all.

[Thingy]

You may also wonder why Honda thinks up 2 names and different controls...

Yup, that’s exactly why I’m asking the question. There are two systems with identical functionality (keeping the car within a lane) and only minor differences of detail (speed and lane edge delineator), but different names, sensors, controls, etc ... why have they done that? Others have commented on how confusing some of the electronic controls are, so why have this unnecessary complexity? Is there a reason, or did Honda just have two design teams who didn’t talk to each other?

They do not have the same functionality. RDMS is to prevent you leaving the road. LKAS will keep you central within your lane. If you lift your hands off the wheel (just slightly) it will even steer you round bends. You can only do this for a few seconds before the car shouts at you.

[embee]

Is it that one is passive, one is (slightly) active?
My 2018 has lane warning, but it is just a warning, no steering input capability.

I am no luddite, but this stuff really is getting beyond a joke. I'll take as much passive safety as you like (ABS, airbags, stability control etc), as long as it isn't "intrusive" into the driving. Having to live with something which can give "false" interaction (rough road edges etc) and has to be temporarily disabled by menu selection each time just gets tedious.

Having come from the auto industry I often use a comparison with, for example, modern tech where there are continual updates and having to select menus and settings. If when you got into your car it asked you to select ignition timing, fuel enrichment, idle speed, voltage correction etc etc before you could start it, you'd be pretty disillusioned. In engine calibration the engineers did all that for you, just turn the key and drive. That's how consumer products should work, the techy stuff should be largely invisible. Once you start noticing it, then it is lacking.