New Jazz is really expensive...or is it?

[richardfrost]

I am getting close to the time when I begin properly considering my next car and am doing my research. For context, I have a 2005 Jazz 1.4 SE which my son and his partner use, and a 2016 Toyota Rav4 AWD Hybrid which is for my own exclusive use. I am replacing the Toyota as I no longer have a need for such a large car and at 40-45 mpg on a good day it is overkill for my journey profile these days, as I approach retirement. Prior to the RAV4 I had an HR-V and before that a 2013 Jazz, which was bloody marvellous. I should never have swapped it for the false promise of the HR-V.

I am not ready to commit to full electric due to range anxiety and decent plug in hybrids all start at £30,000 or so. I want to be able to do day trips of up to 250 miles without needing to recharge. I think that means a hybrid is my best bet.

I want a heated seat as it is absolutely the best thing ever for my bad back and I have mine on 90% of the time. I want the capability to deal with steep windy roads because of where I live, but don't necessarily need 4WD if I can put appropriate tyres on the car. I want a small car with a reasonably sensible ride height  as I can't be 'getting down' into a car all the time - sorry, no Civic for me! I need four doors and a decent load space with the seats down for the occasional staycation or trip to the tip.

I looked at the new Jazz price and it looks quite steep. Upwards of £22,000 for the EX grades. But then I looked at a whole heap of other cars, from a couple of Suzukis, the Polo, the Fiesta (perhaps the best of the rest) and they all look cheaper. Until you start to load on all the things that the Jazz comes with as standard. From the Hybrid system, 'automatic' gears (I know), heated seats (hooray), gadgets, LED lights, the space, I could go on.

There are three things I am pondering on for before I commit...

1. The atrocious choice of colours available right now - that's not going to change anytime soon!

2. The availability of ex demos, early trade ins and whatnot.

3. The chance to have a good look at the new Toyota Yaris Hybrid. This car I think could be the only real contender for the Jazz for me. And there is also the distant thought of the 'jacked up' Crosstar equivalent Yaris they are launching early in 2021.

First world problems I know. And this is the part of choosing the next car that I really start to enjoy.

[John Ratsey]

Not forgetting the reversing camera although, for some reason, the Crosstar is lacking the HR-V's useful dipping nearside wing mirror.

I've always looked on the Yaris as being a little smaller than the Jazz but it appears that the Yaris Cross is larger - approximately 4" longer than the Crosstar so it's likely to have more boot space. The Crosstar's boot isn't generous. I would have set the rear seats a couple of inches further forwards to give more boot space but I suspect that Honda wanted fuss-free folding of the rear seats (ie no headrest removal) when the front seats are fully back.

Personally, I feel that Honda's eCVT is a technically better solution than using a mechanical CVT gearbox.

[Muldoon]

I am getting close to the time when I begin properly considering my next car and am doing my research. For context, I have a 2005 Jazz 1.4 SE which my son and his partner use, and a 2016 Toyota Rav4 AWD Hybrid which is for my own exclusive use. I am replacing the Toyota as I no longer have a need for such a large car and at 40-45 mpg on a good day it is overkill for my journey profile these days, as I approach retirement. Prior to the RAV4 I had an HR-V and before that a 2013 Jazz, which was bloody marvellous. I should never have swapped it for the false promise of the HR-V.

I am not ready to commit to full electric due to range anxiety and decent plug in hybrids all start at £30,000 or so. I want to be able to do day trips of up to 250 miles without needing to recharge. I think that means a hybrid is my best bet.

I want a heated seat as it is absolutely the best thing ever for my bad back and I have mine on 90% of the time. I want the capability to deal with steep windy roads because of where I live, but don't necessarily need 4WD if I can put appropriate tyres on the car. I want a small car with a reasonably sensible ride height  as I can't be 'getting down' into a car all the time - sorry, no Civic for me! I need four doors and a decent load space with the seats down for the occasional staycation or trip to the tip.

I looked at the new Jazz price and it looks quite steep. Upwards of £22,000 for the EX grades. But then I looked at a whole heap of other cars, from a couple of Suzukis, the Polo, the Fiesta (perhaps the best of the rest) and they all look cheaper. Until you start to load on all the things that the Jazz comes with as standard. From the Hybrid system, 'automatic' gears (I know), heated seats (hooray), gadgets, LED lights, the space, I could go on.

There are three things I am pondering on for before I commit...

1. The atrocious choice of colours available right now - that's not going to change anytime soon!

2. The availability of ex demos, early trade ins and whatnot.

3. The chance to have a good look at the new Toyota Yaris Hybrid. This car I think could be the only real contender for the Jazz for me. And there is also the distant thought of the 'jacked up' Crosstar equivalent Yaris they are launching early in 2021.

First world problems I know. And this is the part of choosing the next car that I really start to enjoy.

Some interesting analysis. I suppose all prices are relative and if you spec up the others exactly it won't be too far off. I think a lot of the reason for the price increase is the technology / computers / batteries compared to a simple petrol manual gearbox Jazz. However based on feedback the batteries last a long time and you would expect 100% reliability which may point to long ownership to offset the initial higher purchase price - compared to swapping every few years and losing a lot of cash in depreciation. If nothing else comes close to combining all the positive features then why p/ex in the future unless for a full EV when they get properly developed as you say in maybe 10 years or so.

I think all new Yaris are hybrid, but based on the recent standard hatchback launch they are a backwards step, even smaller than the obsolete model. The crossover model may fix this but a while off launch.

[peteo48]

I am someone who has pondered long and hard about getting an EV. We only have one car and whilst I think a used EV would be an ideal second car my mileage doesn't justify owning two vehicles.

The range thing is frustrating. I do very few round trips of more than 50 miles but I do do some - let's say 6 a year plus one UK holiday (in normal times). One trip we do is a 120 mile round trip to friends in North Wales. Most of this is on motorway. A friend who has a 40 kwh Leaf told me that I would have to drive like a granny to avoid charging at some point. As an academic exercise I checked the status of chargers at Chester Services and at Bodelwyddan (not sure of spelling) and on one day all the chargers were down. I couldn't put up with this uncertainty. On top of that the EV industry still can't decide on a universal charging system. The Leaf has Chademo which I gather is the new Betamax!

So I went for one of the last Mk 3s. I do think the new Jazz, though, is a step change for the better. Performance and economy are all greatly improved as is the driving experience. If I did a bigger mileage I would be very tempted.

I think the EV landscape will look very different in 5 years time - better in every respect.

[madasafish]

I am someone who has pondered long and hard about getting an EV. We only have one car and whilst I think a used EV would be an ideal second car my mileage doesn't justify owning two vehicles.

The range thing is frustrating. I do very few round trips of more than 50 miles but I do do some - let's say 6 a year plus one UK holiday (in normal times). One trip we do is a 120 mile round trip to friends in North Wales. Most of this is on motorway. A friend who has a 40 kwh Leaf told me that I would have to drive like a granny to avoid charging at some point. As an academic exercise I checked the status of chargers at Chester Services and at Bodelwyddan (not sure of spelling) and on one day all the chargers were down. I couldn't put up with this uncertainty. On top of that the EV industry still can't decide on a universal charging system. The Leaf has Chademo which I gather is the new Betamax!

So I went for one of the last Mk 3s. I do think the new Jazz, though, is a step change for the better. Performance and economy are all greatly improved as is the driving experience. If I did a bigger mileage I would be very tempted.

I think the EV landscape will look very different in 5 years time - better in every respect.

We had the same thoughts.

But my policy is to NEVER be the first adaptor of anything.. You pay premium prices and usually within 5 years the initial offering will be so out of date in all areas.

I would look to buy a s/h EV Jazz for £10k in 5 years time..

[olduser1]

UK retail prices cover the advertising & free coffee at the delership, why not by online or from one of the supercarmarkets who shift volume. Friends of mine have been happy with Motorpoint - few almost new Jazz at present needs stock maybe October.
Or hunt down none Honda looking to move on p ex Jazz off the forcourt.
There are 100's of used cars out there relatively few buyers given the virus.
Avoid brand new from dealer unless substantail discount.
PS Motorpoint have 2 Yaris Hybrids CVT on sale just over £12k

[123Drive!]

Have you try the Kia Niro Hybrid. Seems good value for a two years old car with good spec.

[richardfrost]

Well the Yaris is not available with heated seats so that’s that. Looking at the Ford Puma now or what and see the specs for the jacked up Yaris, when they appear.

[culzean]

Well the Yaris is not available with heated seats so that’s that. Looking at the Ford Puma now or what and see the specs for the jacked up Yaris, when they appear.

Have you looked at Suzuki,  The 1.4 boosterjet engine in my brothers Grand Vitara AWD is beautiful, it is so driveable as it has linear torque all the way from just above tick over to about 4500 revs... The Vitara may be too big for you but Suzuki has a big range of models of all shapes and sizes with boosterjet engines, and Suzuki very near the top of reliability stats.   I will get a Suzuki when I get another car ( to match my Suzuki V twin motorbike ).

https://www.testdriven.co.uk/suzuki-vitara-swift-s-cross-48v-mild-hybrid/

[richardfrost]

I did look at Suzuki as 8 remembered you extolling them in the past, but alas I must have a heated seat and they don’t do them as far as I can see.

[Jazzmeister]

Wouldn't be better to just stick with the RAV4

They are great vehicles and the fuel economy is decent, selling it and getting something newer also means you'll need to take a fairly hefty financial hit.

[richardfrost]

Wouldn't be better to just stick with the RAV4

They are great vehicles and the fuel economy is decent, selling it and getting something newer also means you'll need to take a fairly hefty financial hit.

Not going to take much of a hit as bought a one year old ex company car from the Toyota fleet. I like the RAV4 and it is set up for Winter with some Nokians on board. So my thinking is wait a few more months actually. But I do need to change as it is just too big a car for what I need. I was happy with a smaller car before and moved up in size fi4 circumstances which no longer apply.

[Jazzmeister]

Wouldn't be better to just stick with the RAV4

They are great vehicles and the fuel economy is decent, selling it and getting something newer also means you'll need to take a fairly hefty financial hit.

Not going to take much of a hit as bought a one year old ex company car from the Toyota fleet. I like the RAV4 and it is set up for Winter with some Nokians on board. So my thinking is wait a few more months actually. But I do need to change as it is just too big a car for what I need. I was happy with a smaller car before and moved up in size fi4 circumstances which no longer apply.

Smaller being easier to move around with and park?

I'd drive a bigger vehicle if it was as efficient as your RAV4 and a RAV4 is a really nice vehicle.

[richardfrost]

You have to work really hard to get it above 42mpg on the fibometer. Managed it today on the 50 mile outward journey and pootling about at the other end but the return journey came in at 39mpg. It’s not that efficient as it’s the previous generation hybrid and has a 2.5l petrol engine. There’s just the two of us now and a small dog so I really don’t need such a large vehicle going forward.

[culzean]

I really don’t need such a large vehicle going forward.

Cars are designed to go forward, they also go in reverse but not nearly so often..