Author Topic: Retrofit OEM cruise control  (Read 33523 times)

JazzLeon

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Retrofit OEM cruise control
« on: August 06, 2016, 11:25:34 AM »
Has anyone tried to retrofit the OEM cruise control? And did it work?

I have a 2011 1.4 GG3 Jazz with the steering wheel as shown below:



And I have this one ready to install:



I've tested the dash cluster and the cruise control lights work. I read something on a 4 pole connector to the brake pedal. Does anyone know where I can find this? Crawling under the dash hasn't made me any smarter...

If it will not work I'm anyhow changing the plastic wheel for the leather one.  8)

Thanks!
« Last Edit: October 22, 2017, 09:12:25 PM by JazzLeon »

guest1372

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2016, 05:22:59 PM »
Might require the option to be enabled in the ECM/PCM, if so that would need Honda HDS software & interface.
--
TG

JazzLeon

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2016, 09:50:59 PM »
Thanks. That's one thing I already have in my mind.

But anyone around with actual experience?

guest5185

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2016, 12:07:56 AM »
Isn't there a lot more to it than the controls?

Does the cruise control work via the engine or braking or both?

culzean

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2016, 10:10:49 AM »
works through same mechanism as the feed to the speedometer - just controls engine revs to keep vehicle speed the same,  can still go faster than the set speed downhill as only engine braking (not ABS) available.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

guest1372

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2016, 11:51:39 AM »
Thanks. That's one thing I already have in my mind.
But anyone around with actual experience?
No actual experience but maybe you'd like some information.

I'll write in general terms for a wider audience and assume the GE is the same as the GG.

Anyone investigating the wiring in the steering column and steering wheel should take precautions to avoid triggering the airbag - i.e. disconnect the battery.

Standard cruise control (CC) does not brake, it only controls throttle position to maintain speed.

The control buttons, blanking plate & wiring loom are interchangeable between the different steering wheels.

Honda often seems to omit the wires from the loom if an option is not fitted.  The multi-pin connectors will be the same size & format but you may need to add extra pins from a similar Honda plug, there are different sized pins in green and white plugs.

The airbag trigger, audio control, info/reset buttons, and cruise controls must pass through the cable reel in the steering column.  This usually is a standard part and has enough separate wires to support the options, but the connector from the cable reel on the dashboard side may be missing pins and wires for the feature you want to add (i.e. cars without steering wheel audio controls do not have wires from the cable reel to the audio head unit but two wires and pins can be added to support this feature).

The basic parts needed to support cruise control are - output shaft speed sensor, throttle position sensor, throttle actuator, throttle pedal position, brake pedal switch and clutch pedal or auto position switch.  In their basic form these are on every car, but cruise control cars have a 2-pole 4-pin brake pedal switch, and a second clutch position switch B instead of the travel adjustment bolt.

The Jazz GE has two primary electronic units - the ECM/PCM engine/powertrain control module, and the GCM gauge control module which supports much more than just the instruments, e.g. it stores the odometer and service interval counter, plus it manages the keys / security functions, and interprets button presses.  These two modules are connected by the communication network CAN-bus, a differential pair of signal wires CAN-high & CAN-low.

The cruise control buttons are only connected to the GCM, it in turn then sends/receives CAN-bus commands to the ECM/PCM.  The pedals and transmission switches & sensors are connected to the ECM/PCM.

The CC wiring for the dashboard side of the cable reel is:

Pin Colour Function
10  GRY    Button illumination +ve feed
 9  BLK    Button illumination ground  >>  to ground point G501
 1  ORN    Set/Cancel/Resume/Horn +ve switch feed
 2  BLK    CC main switch ground  >>  to ground point G501
15  PNK    CC main switch  >>  to GCM pin 22
13  RED    Set/Decel  >>  to GCM pin 20
14  BLU    Resume/Accel  >>  to GCM pin 19
-   -      Cancel = both Set+Resume pressed


The GCM gauge control module is connected to the ECM/PCM on all cars:
30  WHT    CAN-high  >>  A3
29  RED    CAN-low  >>  A4


The wiring for the brake pedal switch is:

Pole Pin Colour Function
 1    1  WHT    Permanent +ve battery via fuse #24 15amp
 1    2  LT_GRN to ECM pin A42  BKSW
 2    3  YEL    Ignition +ve battery via fuse #12 10amp
 2    4  BRN    to ECM pin A41  BKSWNC


The wiring for (M/T only) clutch switch B is:

Pin Colour Function
 1  WHT    ECM/PCM control signal to A43
 2  BLK    To ground point G401

For (A/T only) the shift lever position is reported by:
 6  BLU/YEL ECM/PCM B29  >>  ground when in D or S
 1  BLK     Ground


The vehicle speed sensor is:
 1  YEL/RED VCC1 5v
 2  BLK/WHT Signal to ECM/PCM B38
 3  GRN/WHT Ground


The complete wiring for the CC related ECM/PCM connections are:

Pin Colour  Function
A3  WHT     CAN-high
A4  RED     CAN-low
A41 BRN     BKSWNC
A42 LT-GRN  BKSW
A43 WHT     Clutch switch B (for M/T) CRMT-CLS
B29 BLU/YEL Transmission range switch (for A/T) ATP-FWD
B38 BLK/WHT Output shaft (countershaft) speed sensor
C3  YEL     Throttle actuator ECTSM-
C4  YEL/RED Throttle actuator ECTSM+
C12 BLU     Throttle sensor VCC3
C20 RED/BLK Throttle sensor THLA
C21 RED     Throttle sensor THLB
C43 GRN     Throttle sensor SG3


ECM/PCM connectors A, B & C are 49 pin although not every pin is used.

You can test the CC button functions and pedal responses in Honda HDS by monitoring the PGM-FI data list.

You can test the gauge control unit to see if the two cruise control indicators illuminate by performing the gauge test function in HDS or:

- Hold down the Select/Reset button
- Turn light switch on
- Turn ignition switch to ON(II)
- Turn lights off-on-off
- Release Select/Reset then press it 3 times

- Use Select/Reset or Odo/Trip to trigger tests.

- Switch off ignition to exit.

JazzLeon

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2016, 12:03:29 PM »
Wow, very impressive. This is useful to check if my Jazz is set up for cruise control.

Thank you!

guest6586

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2017, 07:56:55 PM »
I'm taking my chances and pull this older thread up. There are some good information about retrofitting cc.


So, there sure is a lot of discussion over the internet about this retrofit. But there really isn't any decent DIY for this. Is it because it's impossible or is it just too big job to do?

There is also a very good post of retrofitting the steering wheel audio controls: http://www.fitfreak.net/forums/2nd-generation-ge8-specific-diy-repair-maintenance-sub-forum/61277-diy-steering-wheel-audio-controls.html

So for me the situation is that I have 2011 Jazz with audio and board computer controls on steering wheel. I've ebayed myself leather steering wheel (from 3000km driven) Jazz with audio, board computer and cruise control buttons. I've also done the gauge test and CRUISE is illuminated on dash.

So what's next? How to check if I have the correct brake switch? What else there should be?

Let's find this out together!

guest5079

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2017, 02:52:33 PM »
Sorry to disagree with Culzean as I have written in my post experienced on two separate occasions  braking when going down hill in cruise control. BUT ONLY AT 70 mph. I am certain the brakes are being applied as on other lesser slopes in lower speeds in cruise control, engine braking is not enough to stop run away and requires me to apply the brakes.

guest1372

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2017, 06:45:47 PM »
So what's next? How to check if I have the correct brake switch? What else there should be?
It should have the number of wires and colours as listed, although it might be difficult to see, there could be a part number visible.  I believe the cruise control needs the two separate signals (low > high & high > low) so it can eliminate the possibility of wiring or switch failure; a standard car just needs to illuminate the brake lights.  It's probably the same reason for the second clutch switch. 
--
TG

culzean

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2017, 07:04:39 PM »
TG confirms that standard CC has no connections to enable it to operate brakes.  Adaptive cruise control may well be able to use brakes, but ACC has a radar distance sensor to detect the vehicle in front.  Any autonomous braking would also have to operate brake lights.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

guest1372

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2017, 10:54:19 PM »
TG confirms that standard CC has no connections to enable it to operate brakes.
Not entirely sure I've said that - although there are no obvious extra electronic brake controls on CC cars vs. standard cars.  The vehicle stability control (ESC/ESP/DSC) technology might be used to retard the vehicle and limit it's speed.
--
TG

guest6586

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2017, 06:43:37 AM »
So what's next? How to check if I have the correct brake switch? What else there should be?
It should have the number of wires and colours as listed, although it might be difficult to see, there could be a part number visible.  I believe the cruise control needs the two separate signals (low > high & high > low) so it can eliminate the possibility of wiring or switch failure; a standard car just needs to illuminate the brake lights.  It's probably the same reason for the second clutch switch. 
--
TG
Okey, I'll try to check that. Even though it might be a hard job, do I need to rip of some carpets or so? Any image would help a lot!  ;D

Do someone think that there is some differences between usa/europe/japan jazz/fit models?

JazzLeon

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2017, 09:11:48 PM »
My apologies tot the late reply. I've only one switch on the clutch pedal. So it seems like retro fitting the OEM cruise is not possible in a plug and play mode.
 
And since a airbag recall is needed, I'm finally going to upgrade tot a leather steering wheel. I'm going to change al the controle over and delete the cruise buttons.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2017, 09:17:27 PM by JazzLeon »

guest7326

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Re: Retrofit OEM cruise control
« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2018, 11:38:19 PM »
Dear JazzLeon,

I wanted to write that, since you have a clutch switch, you should be ok. The CC wiring posted by TG specifies only one cable going to the GCM,  the 1  WHT    ECM/PCM control signal to A43.

Did you ever conduct the test TG mentioned to activate the CC indicator lights in the dash?

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