Author Topic: A nightmare of a journey.  (Read 7273 times)

culzean

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2021, 02:32:33 PM »
Another nightmare journey...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-55506891

Look at those tyres. Landrover Discovery drivers think they are impregnable but those tyres look totally useless for speeding along cold, wet, icy roads.

Animals licking road salt is pretty common,  even when it is already on a vehicle.  We went to local beauty spot a few years ago and I noticed sheep taking an interest in cars on the carpark, when I looked there were 'lick' marks on the rear bumpers - the car park attendant said the sheep where there a lot of time 'licking bumpers'.  Also seen wagtails ( other birds may do it ) pecking squashed insects off the front bumpers and number plates of parked cars, like those cleaner wrasse on the coral reefs.  https://www.saltwateraquariumblog.com/bluestreak-cleaner-wrasse-care-guide-quick-facts/   except these birds are cleaning the front of your car.

As for 4X4 drivers,  most don't even know about the laws of physics,  let alone that they are breaking them with dodgy / unsuitable tyres on a heavy vehicle.  I went to a MotoX meeting with my brother in his 4x4 with locking diffs for offroad,  the 4x4 were getting directed to the sloping part of the carpark and some were getting stuck on the slippery grass ( including us by the way ) - summer tyres just do not cut it in slippery conditions....
« Last Edit: January 02, 2021, 02:40:26 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Westy36

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2021, 06:13:42 PM »
Some 4x4 drivers think that having four driven wheels means they are not subject to the laws of physics.  :(

No problems going, it's the steering and stopping that's the problem

Same as the one I had a couple of years ago

there was black ice all over the place around here, I witnessed one 4x4 driver in front of me decide he was overtaking all the cars doing 30mph, only to deposit his shiny new Range Rover in the hedge bottom 200 yds further down the road at the next bend. Six hours later, I was making the same journey, and there was a Vauxhall Mokka in exactly the same spot, only he had hit the electricity pole and snapped it in two. I bet that rattled his fillings!

I think LOL would be appropriate for your 2018 post. Muppets. Problem is, they are very dangerous and unaware.

I think it's also partly down to the 'Volvo' syndrome. Modern cars come with that many safety features, air bags and abbreviations such as ABS, EBD, SIPS etc etc etc that it lulls people in to a false sense of security. My first car was a Morris Marina, and I learnt early about traction and braking.

Hmmm, compulsory re-test every 10 yrs to cut down on the muppetry we all witness every day on UK roads? Its a thought. Not a vote winner and will never happen, but it would certainly make our roads a lot safer if drivers concentrated on actualy driving.

sparky Paul

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2021, 09:00:55 PM »
Hmmm, compulsory re-test every 10 yrs to cut down on the muppetry we all witness every day on UK roads? Its a thought. Not a vote winner and will never happen, but it would certainly make our roads a lot safer if drivers concentrated on actualy driving.

It would certainly weed out quite a few incompetent drivers, and maybe those who genuinely don't understand the dangers posed by adverse conditions, but unfortunately much of the stupidity you see is entirely intentional, often as a result of impatience.

Jocko

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2021, 09:14:08 PM »
What would be of benefit would be compulsory skid pan training. When my step-daughter's ex passed his test (later in life as he had been a biker until then), we gave him skid pan training at Knockhill. There they get training on both front and rear-wheel drive vehicles. He thought it was the most worthwhile training he had had, despite his company having put him through the Pass Plus training.

richardfrost

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #19 on: January 02, 2021, 10:45:48 PM »
What would be of benefit would be compulsory skid pan training. When my step-daughter's ex passed his test (later in life as he had been a biker until then), we gave him skid pan training at Knockhill. There they get training on both front and rear-wheel drive vehicles. He thought it was the most worthwhile training he had had, despite his company having put him through the Pass Plus training.

Every three months at work I have to do a round of three, sometimes four sets of mandatory training, to keep me compliant with my industry's regulations. I see no reason why driving, which is a potentially lethal activity, should not have something similar. Annual mandatory online trading an tests. Five year mandatory assessed driving review, which would not cost you your licence but might impact what your next mandatory training might be.

culzean

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2021, 11:58:36 AM »
but unfortunately much of the stupidity you see is entirely intentional, often as a result of impatience.

spot on...
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Westy36

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2021, 12:44:09 PM »
You all make some great points..........unsurprisingly!   :D It's nice to know I'm not alone in taking driving seriously.

Wouldn't it be nice if most people just did one thing when driving. Concentrate on the job in hand. If you're in the drivers seat, then give it your full attention as you did when taking your test, and drive.

26,610 people were killed or seriously injured on UK roads in a year. 1770 deaths, meaning 24,840 were seriously injured. 68 people every day!  How come this doesn't make the news? Why is this number acceptable? What cost to society in purely financial terms if nothing else?

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/754685/quarterly-estimates-april-to-june-2018.pdf

culzean

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2021, 03:15:35 PM »


26,610 people were killed or seriously injured on UK roads in a year. 1770 deaths, meaning 24,840 were seriously injured. 68 people every day!  How come this doesn't make the news? Why is this number acceptable? What cost to society in purely financial terms if nothing else?


You can certainly stop most road deaths by preventing any vehicles from ever moving anywhere,  just like you can stop plane crashes by grounding all planes....  There has to be a risk benefit calculation for pretty much anything humans  ( or any animal ) does.   Shutting down all road and air traffic would prevent deaths from that activity but would cause deaths elsewhere from starvation or lack of medicines.  Stopping all road and air traffic would effectively shut down civilisation as we know it - so the risk benefit calculation comes down firmly on the side of letting traffic continue.  over 600,000 people ( say 12,000 per week ) die in UK every year from all causes, the road deaths are a tiny fraction of that.  You would never see on the news that 12,000 people died in the past 7 days would you.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

sparky Paul

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2021, 04:21:09 PM »
I never understand why they did away with public information films, they seem to have been able to resurrect them for coronavirus.

Especially the one that teaches people how to use roundabouts, that would be a good start  ::)

Westy36

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2021, 04:28:39 PM »
You can certainly stop most road deaths by preventing any vehicles from ever moving anywhere,  just like you can stop plane crashes by grounding all planes....  There has to be a risk benefit calculation for pretty much anything humans  ( or any animal ) does.   Shutting down all road and air traffic would prevent deaths from that activity but would cause deaths elsewhere from starvation or lack of medicines.  Stopping all road and air traffic would effectively shut down civilisation as we know it - so the risk benefit calculation comes down firmly on the side of letting traffic continue.  over 600,000 people ( say 12,000 per week ) die in UK every year from all causes, the road deaths are a tiny fraction of that.  You would never see on the news that 12,000 people died in the past 7 days would you.

I am not suggesting we do stop traffic. Air, road, rail or marine. Risk is part of how we have evolved. I have done lots of things over the years that have been risky and found that risk to be exhilirating. Biking being a case in point. However, I still find the figures unacceptable. Road safety is not taken seriously enough in this country. Almost ignored by our government and not enforced because of cuts to police numbers.

Road safety is an extremely important issue to me, and I think it deserves more attention than it is given.

culzean

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2021, 05:18:35 PM »
You can certainly stop most road deaths by preventing any vehicles from ever moving anywhere,  just like you can stop plane crashes by grounding all planes....  There has to be a risk benefit calculation for pretty much anything humans  ( or any animal ) does.   Shutting down all road and air traffic would prevent deaths from that activity but would cause deaths elsewhere from starvation or lack of medicines.  Stopping all road and air traffic would effectively shut down civilisation as we know it - so the risk benefit calculation comes down firmly on the side of letting traffic continue.  over 600,000 people ( say 12,000 per week ) die in UK every year from all causes, the road deaths are a tiny fraction of that.  You would never see on the news that 12,000 people died in the past 7 days would you.

I am not suggesting we do stop traffic. Air, road, rail or marine. Risk is part of how we have evolved. I have done lots of things over the years that have been risky and found that risk to be exhilirating. Biking being a case in point. However, I still find the figures unacceptable. Road safety is not taken seriously enough in this country. Almost ignored by our government and not enforced because of cuts to police numbers.

Road safety is an extremely important issue to me, and I think it deserves more attention than it is given.

With all the seatbelts, crumple zones, ABS, airbags and other tech like lane assist and auto braking cars are safer than ever, unfortunately the same cannot be said for the distracted impatient people who are in control of the accelerator and steering wheel, many people seem to prefer the horn to the brakes, and not to mention indicators. Maybe it is the feeling safety of drivers inside their cage that means they take more risks. It is time to to treat people who kill people with a car as harshly as if they had stabbed them, the punishment for dangerous or careless driving that results in someone dying is not harsh enough..
« Last Edit: January 05, 2021, 05:24:06 PM by culzean »
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Kremmen

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #26 on: January 05, 2021, 06:37:52 PM »
Mobile phones must be one of the biggest causes of accidents these days. The number I see and the quality of driving goes through the floor.
Let's be careful out there !

Westy36

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2021, 07:37:40 AM »
With all the seatbelts, crumple zones, ABS, airbags and other tech like lane assist and auto braking cars are safer than ever, unfortunately the same cannot be said for the distracted impatient people who are in control of the accelerator and steering wheel, many people seem to prefer the horn to the brakes, and not to mention indicators. Maybe it is the feeling safety of drivers inside their cage that means they take more risks. It is time to to treat people who kill people with a car as harshly as if they had stabbed them, the punishment for dangerous or careless driving that results in someone dying is not harsh enough..

I agree. As I said above, "I think it's also partly down to the 'Volvo' syndrome. Modern cars come with that many safety features, air bags and abbreviations such as ABS, EBD, SIPS etc etc etc that it lulls people in to a false sense of security."

Impatience is a key here too. We lead busy lives and the roads are every busier. You've only to look at average speeds in London for example to see why. Even in outer London the average speeds have dropped by 1mph over the last decade to just 19.3 mph. https://www.london.gov.uk/questions/2019/19767 - I still chuckle at folk in vanity supercars in central London being overtaken by 50cc scooters!

Punishment, well cameras do not replace actual traffic cops. We need more police. Our PM has got 20,000 on the way. I've not seen them yet, but..... We need proper traffic cops and not multi tasking units that are used to attend other incidents. Actual dedicated roads policing officers.

When I started driving in 1989, the roads were controlled by a fleet of Rover 827 and Vauxhall Senators. I've been stopped, educated and even once fined for speeding. You knew there was a good chance that poor driving would be spotted by and at best you would get a proper dressing down, and at worst punished. A real actice deterrent. Let alone the added benefit of vehicle safety standards with the likes of bald tyres. A roadside ANPR can't do that.

Technology. In car tech is out of control. I see too many smart phones and sat navs blocking windscreens. It is an offence, but enforcement remains the issue. Same is true with mobile phone useage, the points and fine could increase, but if there are no traffic police?

 

culzean

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2021, 08:02:52 AM »
On motorbike forums people in 4 wheel vehicles ( not just cars ) are referred to as 'cagers' -  and the vehicles as 'fug-boxes'  -  riding a motorbike is a real lesson in being vulnerable on the road,  I have my LED headlight and a couple of 10watt LED spotlights on all the time I am riding in daylight ( never ride at night these days ),  most motorbike headlights are like Volvo headlights these days - come on with ignition and impossible to turn off,  but you still see bikes with no lights on, maybe they fiddled the wiring. A few bikers still prefer a loud exhaust to having lights on,  they repeat the mantra 'loud pipes save lives' - but that car in the junction ahead or the oncoming car overtaking can't hear the loud pipes.... and they are the danger.
Some people will only consider you an expert if they agree with your point of view or advice,  when you give them advice they don't like they consider you an idiot

Westy36

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Re: A nightmare of a journey.
« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2021, 08:38:30 AM »
"Smidsy" - Sorry mate I didn't see you. That's what they say when they pull out in front of you. I ride with my headlamp on. When approaching a junction, if I am not certain I've been seem, moving about in my lane with a weave and use of horn usualy does the trick.

I recall reading an article by Richard Hammond many years ago. He was talking about his Yamaha FS1E 50cc needing an MOT in February each year, and how the 16 miles round trip to the MOT station on such an underpowered (although not when you're 16 they're not! ) vehicle on slippery rural roads acted as a bit of a reset button. It reminded him about other road users and viewing hazards for what they might be, potentialy life changing encounters. I think it would do most folk the world of good to experience the same. Maybe a couple of hours on a 125cc and a couple of hours on a pedal cycle ideally, to remind them of what roads are like outside of their supersafe metal boxes. Reset their driving to surviving without a never ending list of letters confirming the safety stuff fitted ESP / ESC, ABS / TC / ASR / XDS/ XDS+ etc.

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