Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums

Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk2 2008-2015 => Topic started by: smilertoo on January 11, 2019, 04:00:20 PM

Title: CVT vs Manual
Post by: smilertoo on January 11, 2019, 04:00:20 PM
Hi, im looking to upgrade my Mkl1 2004 to a Mk2 2010+. Would i lose anything picking a CVT this time? more expensive to maintain/repair/run etc?
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Jocko on January 11, 2019, 04:45:50 PM
Have you tried a CVT? There are many on here that who rave about them and think they are the bees knees. I tried a CVT and, despite driving automatics for years, found it too "fussy". Some people love them, others hate them
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: smilertoo on January 11, 2019, 04:55:01 PM
I tried a cvt toyota yaris hybrid, i quite liked it and would have moved to one of those if they werent so small.
* It's the only auto i've ever driven so i dont know what you mean about fussy, was like driving a toy...press and go.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Johncb500 on January 11, 2019, 05:15:06 PM
I have a 61 plate CVT Jazz.
The gear box works great.in D.approx 2Krpm at 70mph.Real lazy drive. Put it in S.and use paddles .it goes like  a rocket.
Even normal D. It goes well.the kickdown is quick and quiet.

Sent from my SM-G361F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Jocko on January 11, 2019, 06:12:33 PM
All the automatics I have ever driven are "press and go". By "fussy" I was referring to the initial high revs. To someone who seldom exceeds 3,000 rpm I found it annoying. But I agree that many people love them. I prefer a "conventional" automatic.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: VicW on January 11, 2019, 06:45:03 PM
Hi, im looking to upgrade my Mkl1 2004 to a Mk2 2010+. Would i lose anything picking a CVT this time? more expensive to maintain/repair/run etc?

You should  be advised that the Jazz did not have a CVT gearbox from late 2008 to early 2011. It had a self changing manual gearbox called the iShift which was not popular. The CVT was reintroduced with the facelift model in early 2011.

Vic.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: culzean on January 11, 2019, 07:20:53 PM
Hi, im looking to upgrade my Mkl1 2004 to a Mk2 2010+. Would i lose anything picking a CVT this time? more expensive to maintain/repair/run etc?

You should  be advised that the Jazz did not have a CVT gearbox from late 2008 to early 2011. It had a self changing manual gearbox called the iShift which was not popular. The CVT was reintroduced with the facelift model in early 2011.

Vic.

Other car makers had equivalent of I-shift and had problems, looks like Honda effort was one of the better ones. Many problems to do with biting point and repeatability of power take up. If car makers had used a magnetic powder clutch in their designs they may have been more successful, the powder clutch on my wife's punto cvt was the best part of the car.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Defender on January 11, 2019, 08:42:56 PM
I have one of the first 2012 CVT Jazz's, it was registered at the end of May 2011.
I've had it since the end of November 2012 and I love it, even though the original need for it has now gone, I find it such a useful vehicle that I can't really find a reason to change it!
As some one has stated it's turning 2250 rpm at 70mph, which is part of the reason I chose the CVT.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: peteo48 on January 11, 2019, 09:49:52 PM
Yes - as Defender says - the leisurely cruise at 70 mph makes it a very relaxing drive on longer journeys. I'm used to small petrol cars doing about 3500 rpm at 70 so the just over 2000 rpm at 70 makes for a very quiet cruise.

I was sceptical about the CVT but I am a convert!
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: smilertoo on January 11, 2019, 09:56:20 PM
CVT sounds ok, does anyone know if those giant sunroofs let in noise or are easy for vandals to break? I see a lot of 2nd hand Jazz's with them.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: John Ratsey on January 11, 2019, 10:20:26 PM
The potentially annoying aspect of the CVT is, when you push hard on the accelerator, the delay between the engine accelerating and the vehicle accelerating (a bit like pulling something along on a bit of elastic). This is by design as it's to get the engine up to the appropriate speed to deliver the power. This is very noticeable on the Mk 3 where the engine has to get out of its more efficient, but low torque, Atkinson cycle mode but less noticeable on the Mk. 2. In other respects the CVT is smooth and generally very reliable.

Something to check for is that the CVT fluid has been changed every two years. The handbook may show it as every four years but Honda have changed the recommendation to two years after the clutch judder problems on older vehicles due to the build-up of deposits in the transmission.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Johncb500 on January 11, 2019, 10:46:51 PM
CVT sounds ok, does anyone know if those giant sunroofs let in noise or are easy for vandals to break? I see a lot of 2nd hand Jazz's with them.
Large sunroof no problems
Just wear Sun glasses

Sent from my SM-G361F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: nigelr on January 11, 2019, 11:04:16 PM
I've had both a Jazz Mk1 CVT and now a Jazz Mk2 manual. I liked the CVT but you have to learn how to drive them to avoid the "rubber band effect" of the engine racing and the car's acceleration catching up. However, under normal driving the CVT is very efficient and effective. I must say though, I do like the manual gearbox on my Mk2 - the CVT is a little more fuel-efficient though, which is good for an automatic, where the opposite is usually true. I averaged about 46mpg in my old CVT and get about the same in my Mk2 manual. Hope that helps.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: smilertoo on January 11, 2019, 11:30:52 PM
Hi, i'm not worried about letting in light throug the sunroof, it just looks like it would be VERY expensive to replace. It's not just bent windscreen glass is it?

*nm...google has pointed out various problems with them ranging from excess heat in summer to being a weakness like i thought they must be.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: guest4871 on January 12, 2019, 12:39:54 PM
excess heat in summer

It comes with a sun blind! Open, it makes a car interior bright and airy on overcast/ bright days. Closed, it screens the interior from the sun's direct rays on bright hot days so there is no excess heat. I doubt if it is any more expensive than repairing a damaged roof. So I won't worry unduly.



Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: coffeecup on January 12, 2019, 01:19:37 PM
I prefer the i-shift over the CVT, however i never drive in Auto (apart from when i have an ice cream in one hand)Mother-in -law has a CVT, i don't like the lag.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: smilertoo on January 14, 2019, 11:48:56 PM
I know CVT doesn't have a clutch etc to go bad but has anyone here has the actual transmission itself fail? How much can you expect to pay for that repair? CVT seems to put all its eggs in one basket (auto transmission) and if that goes it might be a very expensive fix.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Jocko on January 15, 2019, 08:49:37 AM
Ozzie decided his was uneconomical to repair and had to replace it. Mind you, it had done 256K miles!
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: poul on January 15, 2019, 08:57:30 AM
I know CVT doesn't have a clutch etc to go bad but has anyone here has the actual transmission itself fail? How much can you expect to pay for that repair? CVT seems to put all its eggs in one basket (auto transmission) and if that goes it might be a very expensive fix.


I had a 2012 jazz lovelyu car with no problems at all and the cvt box went broke, my Honda dealer should have over 6000 pund to fix and Honda would not pay anything because car was 6 years and 150000 km, so god a good deal and bought a new jazz 2017 with cvt.  lovely car.  So it can god bad and it is expensive
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Kenneve on January 15, 2019, 11:39:03 AM
As has been said many times, whether to drive a Manual, I-shift or CVT gearbox all comes down to personal choice.
For me, I've not driven a manual box since 2003, the I-shift is rubbish and the CVT the best thing since sliced bread ;D
However you can bet, the next post will say something entirely different ::)
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: evijaymohan on January 15, 2019, 11:50:20 AM
I am driving mazda semiautomatic for last 4 years, I got used to it by taking foot of the gas , when i feel like gears should be changed , just like manual. Was difficult on slopes though.

Driving 2011 ES CVT since 2 weeks, Mostly its a pleasure , very smooth, slopes are smooth as well. It suits my kind of driving , I do not press the accelerator hard. I do use the S mode on roundabouts/overtaking/joining motorway, overall its good, happy about choosing it

but somehow after your drive, you feel some pressure on the right foot. Don't know how to explain. If i compare to a torque converter, you won't feel the quickness though.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Kenneve on January 15, 2019, 12:25:31 PM
Regarding the comments about the CVT being 'fussy' and the 'rubber band effect'
It's not so many years ago that automatic gearboxes, of any sort, where unheard of in small engine cars.
At that time the minimum engine capacity in such vehicles was, in the order of 2 litres or more.
For any small engine, to develop its power, it has to rev much higher than a large engine, hence the 3000+rpm in the Jazz
Any automatic gearbox has a 'rubber band effect' to some extent, but of course it is not so noticeable in a large engine vehicle, since the engine does not need to rev so high, to develop the required power.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: John Ratsey on January 15, 2019, 04:04:11 PM
I know CVT doesn't have a clutch etc to go bad but has anyone here has the actual transmission itself fail? How much can you expect to pay for that repair? CVT seems to put all its eggs in one basket (auto transmission) and if that goes it might be a very expensive fix.
There must be a lot of CVT Mk. 1 Jazzes still on the road. The best known problem they encountered was the "judder" which resulted in Honda halving the recommended interval for CVT fluid changes. The judder could be cured by a combination of flushing and trying to maltreat the transmission in order to clear the accumulated crud.

Regarding the comments about the CVT being 'fussy' and the 'rubber band effect'
It's not so many years ago that automatic gearboxes, of any sort, where unheard of in small engine cars.
At that time the minimum engine capacity in such vehicles was, in the order of 2 litres or more.
For any small engine, to develop its power, it has to rev much higher than a large engine, hence the 3000+rpm in the Jazz
I would add that putting a turbo on a small engine can significantly boost the low end torque and reduce the need to add revs in order to get some power. Does the Jazz Sport CVT show the rubber band problem?
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: barcam on January 16, 2019, 09:01:18 AM
When I bought my Jazz earlier in the year I drove both the 1.3 and the sport 1.5 CVT. I much preferred the overall response of the CVT  with the 1.5 engine. The revs away from rest with the 1.5 were much lower than the 1.3 and the extra power made it a lot easier and safer to pull out into traffic.

I love the CVT and have never regretted my purchase of the Honda Jazz Sport.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: peteo48 on January 16, 2019, 10:39:14 AM
I think the marriage of the 1.5 engine and the CVT gearbox is working very well from several reports on this forum. I'd be tempted by a 1.5 but a change is a long way off having only had this car for 11 months.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: smilertoo on January 16, 2019, 11:43:00 AM
I've never seen a 1.5l jazz advertised.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: barcam on January 16, 2019, 12:40:22 PM
I've never seen a 1.5l jazz advertised.

Have look at the Honda UK website and Autotrader. The used demo cars are appearing now, have test drive.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: madasafish on January 16, 2019, 01:47:25 PM
I have driven my CVT 2012 ES for 6 years. Lovely and smooth and very relaxing in traffic jams. 2200 rpm at 70mph is fine as well. Got floppy paddles which I never use. No issues. DIY fluid change - easy..

I list below all the problems I have had with it:-
.
Title: Re: CVT vs Manual
Post by: Kazcoco on January 18, 2019, 11:10:18 PM
Hi all
Bought wife 1.5 CVT two weeks ago for health reasons
Covered 800 miles in it both love it and CVT just as good as all previous autos I've had jaguars Volvo's Mazda all very much the same bar engine size they were all 2 ltd plus but in sport mode this starts at three thousand revs and has a good pickup to stay up with traffic .
In drive it takes a lot longer to pickup paddles aid this and are refreshing fun lol
Overall we both love it and prefer it over my cx5 auto .