Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - 2020 => Topic started by: Redstart on February 06, 2021, 08:24:30 PM
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Hi all. Has anyone had any experience in fitting led bulbs to their jazz? Or would it be better to obtain two led headlight assemblies?
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Please note that since January 2021, the MOT Inspection manual has been updated to include LED bulbs.
Section 4.1.4 now states the following:
“Existing halogen headlamp units should not be converted to be used with high intensity discharge (HID) or light emitting diode (LED) bulbs. If such a conversion has been done, you must fail the headlamp.”
https://www.autobulbsdirect.co.uk/blog/are-led-headlights-legal-in-the-uk/
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Hi all. Has anyone had any experience in fitting led bulbs to their jazz? Or would it be better to obtain two led headlight assemblies?
Read this thread, https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=10619.msg66592#msg66592
If you bulb is a standard H4 twin filament or H1 + H7 combo you can get LED bulbs. If H1 + H7 combo like on a Civic I suggest just getting the dip beam bulbs, as they get used 95% more than the main beam.
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Hi all. Has anyone had any experience in fitting led bulbs to their jazz? Or would it be better to obtain two led headlight assemblies?
Read this thread, https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=10619.msg66592#msg66592
If you bulb is a standard H4 twin filament or H1 + H7 combo you can get LED bulbs. If H1 + H7 combo like on a Civic I suggest just getting the dip beam bulbs, as they get used 95% more than the main beam.
That thread is from 2018 and says it’s physically possible to fit LED bulbs. Jocko’s post is from a 2021 source and says that any such bulbs would be an MOT fail. Presumably something’s changed in the intervening years and it’s now been decided that such a retrofit is dangerous in some way ... so it wouldn’t be a good idea to do it. Or have I misunderstood?
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That's how I understand it. I had been intending to put classic car leds headlamps in when a bulb failed. I presume the problem is that many replacement leds have a poor beam pattern which dazzle. I don't know why they didn't rely on testing the beam. Seems like overkill to me.
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The problem is the blanket rules change for the MOT, from 1st Jan, any car with retrofitted LED headlight bulbs 'should' fail. I can imagine some testers will overlook those with a good beam pattern.
The new rule is probably to dissuade people from using the increasingly popular cheap LED bulbs more generally. I think there has been some anecdotal evidence of failures on beam pattern, pass on retest, and repeat failure next year... i.e. the bulbs being swapped out by the MOT garage, then refitted by the owner.
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Before the change to the MOT regulations, the law said that it was illegal to fit LED bulbs to ANY exterior vehicle light that was not designed to use LEDs and marked accordingly. Doesn't stop people from fitting them and apparently the MOT is only interested in headlights.
We can all tell when we come up behind a car with retrofitted number plate LEDs, but you cannot tell that on a new car designed to have LEDs over the number plate.
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Before the change to the MOT regulations, the law said that it was illegal to fit LED bulbs to ANY exterior vehicle light that was not designed to use LEDs and marked accordingly. Doesn't stop people from fitting them and apparently the MOT is only interested in headlights.
We can all tell when we come up behind a car with retrofitted number plate LEDs, but you cannot tell that on a new car designed to have LEDs over the number plate.
I concentrate on keeping a good distance from the car in front for safety reasons, rather than so close to investigate the type of bulb etc that is fitted to number plate lights.
Just my own choice but much safer.
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Hi all. Has anyone had any experience in fitting led bulbs to their jazz? Or would it be better to obtain two led headlight assemblies?
Read this thread, https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=10619.msg66592#msg66592
If you bulb is a standard H4 twin filament or H1 + H7 combo you can get LED bulbs. If H1 + H7 combo like on a Civic I suggest just getting the dip beam bulbs, as they get used 95% more than the main beam.
That thread is from 2018 and says it’s physically possible to fit LED bulbs. Jocko’s post is from a 2021 source and says that any such bulbs would be an MOT fail. Presumably something’s changed in the intervening years and it’s now been decided that such a retrofit is dangerous in some way ... so it wouldn’t be a good idea to do it. Or have I misunderstood?
It's phisiaccaly possible to fit Led bulbs in H1, H4 and H7 sockets, but they will be a illegal rubbish because the emission points are not in the same position (and size) of the tungsten filament coil. No aftermarket led bulb can have the E10 or E112 or E37 mark.
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I concentrate on keeping a good distance from the car in front for safety reasons, rather than so close to investigate the type of bulb etc that is fitted to number plate lights.
Just my own choice but much safer.
You don't need to be close, you can tell from 100 yds away. The number plate shouldn't be illuminated brighter than the tail lights
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I concentrate on keeping a good distance from the car in front for safety reasons, rather than so close to investigate the type of bulb etc that is fitted to number plate lights.
Do you never pull up behind a car at traffic lights or some other junction? Have you never been overtaken by a car on a dual carriageway, or overtaken one? As sparky Paul says, they are so bright and usually bluish in colour that you cannot miss them.
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Those super bright LED number plate lights are hilarious. They <broad stereotype alert> tend to be fitted to a certain type of car, an older german motor with aftermarket wheels and lowered etc.
Total waste of money in my book. Standard bulbs are fine, no need to change them.
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I have recognized the same you mentioned, added with Volvos here in Finland. Despite that stereotype, which I don't feel fitting myself, I installed E-approved sealed LED license plate light to one older car just to get rid of continuous light (not just bulb) replacements due to corrosion. LED lights are much brighter than originals and I found that beneficial when reversing in dark. The light draws clear line on the ground showing very precisely where the rear end of the car is.
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I've not noticed LED number plate lights either but I have seen some ridiculously bright and dangerous LED headlights.
I followed Culzeans recommendation to fit ClassicCar LED's, even though they were technically illegal but people were getting through MOT's with them because the beam was so good.
I must say I've really been impressed with them but I have an MOT coming up the end of the month so I'll probably have to put the old bulbs back in just to make sure, a shame really.
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Hi all. Has anyone had any experience in fitting led bulbs to their jazz? Or would it be better to obtain two led headlight assemblies?
Read this thread, https://clubjazz.org/forum/index.php?topic=10619.msg66592#msg66592
If you bulb is a standard H4 twin filament or H1 + H7 combo you can get LED bulbs. If H1 + H7 combo like on a Civic I suggest just getting the dip beam bulbs, as they get used 95% more than the main beam.
That thread is from 2018 and says it’s physically possible to fit LED bulbs. Jocko’s post is from a 2021 source and says that any such bulbs would be an MOT fail. Presumably something’s changed in the intervening years and it’s now been decided that such a retrofit is dangerous in some way ... so it wouldn’t be a good idea to do it. Or have I misunderstood?
It's phisiaccaly possible to fit Led bulbs in H1, H4 and H7 sockets, but they will be a illegal rubbish because the emission points are not in the same position (and size) of the tungsten filament coil. No aftermarket led bulb can have the E10 or E112 or E37 mark.
Jazzaro you need to look at Philips LED chips ( I posted a drawing of them last time you said it was impossible ) they are exactly same size, shape and position in reflector, and as other users on here have noticed the beam shape and cut off actually better than filament originals. The LED chips that cause the problem are single large round or square LED chip in cheaper bulbs that result in a totally bad light distribution. I have also posted photographs of beam distribution of headlights of our Jazz, but you still say it is impossible, the very best LED bulbs headlight revolution tested were the Philips chip ones.
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For a long time the UK lighting regs referred to "filament lamps" requiring E marks, and this is what caused the ambiguity. If a lamp wasn't a filament, did it have to comply with the regs as stated? (rhetorical question). I don't think the regs stated categorically that LED lamps MUST NOT be used because they didn't really exist to any extent at the time the regs were written. It was a philosophical debate, "A" must comply with rules, but "B" isn't specifically prohibited. I haven't looked at the latest lighting regs (can't be bothered to be honest), but at least the MOT rules have clarified the situation for that purpose.
Some of the big lighting manufacturers (Philips etc as stated by culzean) are now marketing LED replacement headlamp "bulbs", and by all accounts they are both efficient and effective, but of course would not pass a UK MOT. As with many things regarding retrospective-regulation, I'm not entirely sure the MOT revisions quite hit the target with any real precision, a bit of a shotgun solution, but at least it's pretty clear now. You're not allowed to do this because we say so, not because it is sensible.
A similar case is my Suzuki Cappuccino, a very small "kei-car" engineered for the Japanese domestic market. It had a third stop light mounted on the top of the boot ("high level stop light"), but when they did a limited homologation for the UK (1100 cars were officially imported) it was found the HLSL was not high enough to meet the UK regs so they fitted a dummy light with no LEDs fitted. They couldn't simply unplug a real one because any light fitted must work, so an empty dummy was fitted (exactly the same casing, just no LEDs fitted), which thus wasn't a light so didn't need to work. This caused MOT failures because they were rare cars and the MOT testers weren't familiar with the homologation intricacies. 2 things then, one was that it had to be explained for the MOT, but more significantly it was mush safer to have a working HLSL even if it was a couple of inches too low than to not have one working. All owners I know of fitted an LED array inside the dummy and have a working HLSL, safer and simpler (though technically not compliant). Rules and regs, rules and regs.
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A similar case is my Suzuki Cappuccino, a very small "kei-car" engineered for the Japanese domestic market.
8) They are awesome cars with 600cc turbo engines, lovely. Feel free to post a photo. Honda did the Beat.
kei cars are fascinating. I've never owned one, but they do interest me, especialy the commercial versions.
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Here is another good video from Headlight Revolution showing the importance of getting the LED light source in the correct place in reflector designed for filament bulb.
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So is it just the higher end facelift models that have LED lights fitted as standard?
Harry
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Thanks for all of the info.
Very interesting. I suppose I might have to sell a Rembrandt and buy two LED headlight units !!
The correct positioning of the bulb took me back to my biker days, when I put a H4 into my bikes tungsten headlight. It only worked correctly one way. The other way used to light up the undersides of bridges !!
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So is it just the higher end facelift models that have LED lights fitted as standard?
That's right. Elegance and Dynamic are equipped with LED headlights, Trend and Comfort with halogens.
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Thanks for all of the info.
Very interesting. I suppose I might have to sell a Rembrandt and buy two LED headlight units !!
The correct positioning of the bulb took me back to my biker days, when I put a H4 into my bikes tungsten headlight. It only worked correctly one way. The other way used to light up the undersides of bridges !!
It helps if you remember when fitting an H4 bulb that the widest of the three location 'tongues' on the bulb flange ( at 120 degrees to each other ) points vertically upwards and it will only fit into holder and be aligned / located properly when inserted that way.
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So is it just the higher end facelift models that have LED lights fitted as standard?
That's right. Elegance and Dynamic are equipped with LED headlights, Trend and Comfort with halogens.
Thought so, not sure the exact UK equivalents to Elegance and Dynamic. Mine is the EX-Navi and has them fitted.
Harry