Enjoyment of driving the Mk4 Jazz

[jazzaro]

That sounds like a scary experience. Machine does not know better than the man. I would feel a lot safer with you driving using all those years of experience than I would a computer programme.

This is precisely what I used to hear years and years ago, when first ABS then ESP have been put as standard in our cars, from  plenty of "experienced drivers" sure to be able to brake and reduce understeer better than a software.

Nothing dangerous about EPS or ABS, but all the other c r 4 p ----    Drivers just need to pay attention, and all these 'aids' are just having the opposite affect - they make people think they can sit in the back seat and watch a movie...

ABS and EPS were designed to help in emergency situations,  but is seems other stuff can cause emergencies....

LKAS is designed for avoiding emergencies, keeping you in your own lane.
Automatic braking systems try to stop or reduce the car speed when the driver does not perceive something in front of him, pedestrians, bikers...
To be honest, I don't drive in a different way from my Jazz MK3 when I use an old Ford Fiesta, no bags, no ABS, no power steering..  I know that my safety systems can help me in case of my failure, but I've never caused a failure thinking that "ok, I've the autobrake, the car will stop itself...". The point is different: the driver must learn to use these new devices, LKAS will not disturb if the driver will use the direction lights, as the automatic brake will not disturb if the driver will keep a safe distance from other vehicles. These cars cannot be driven like a MK1 Fiat Panda.
 

[Jocko]

All these devices are the things that the MG5 doesn't have, making it "unsafe" in some people's eyes.

[jazzaro]

All these devices are the things that the MG5 doesn't have, making it "unsafe" in some people's eyes.

The MG5 is less safer than other cars better equipped, obvoiusly. A MK4 Jazz will brake itself if the driver will be dazzled by the sun or high beams, while the MG5 will crash.
As I wrote before, 25 years ago people used to say the same words talking about cars with and without ABS, considering that a driver is ALWAYS perfect, this cannot happen.

[Kremmen]

As pointed out, if you indicate, the LKAS doesn't wobble the wheel, or whatever it does.

Now, when I'm on the motorway for example at 05:00, not unusual, with nothing in front or behind but I see a lorry about to join at a junction,  I drift into lane 2 to give him a lane to pull into.

There is no one to indicate to so I don't. I've made that decision. The last thing I want is the car trying to keep me in lane 1.

[John Ratsey]

Now, when I'm on the motorway for example at 05:00, not unusual, with nothing in front or behind but I see a lorry about to join at a junction,  I drift into lane 2 to give him a lane to pull into.

There is no one to indicate to so I don't. I've made that decision. The last thing I want is the car trying to keep me in lane 1.

But surely you should be indicating your move so that the lorry about to join can see that you're moving across?

Nonetheless, LKAS is looking for evidence that the driver letting his car drift hasn't nodded off or is too busy looking at their phone.

To me, LKAS makes sense but RDMS is a nuisance on most British roads and it's rare that I make a journey without having the distracting of needing to disable that hidden hand on the wheel. If it were clever enough to stop me unintentionally driving off the tarmac it would be useful but making a fuss because I've crossed over the road centreline to give clearance when passing a parked vehicle is a nuisance.

[jazzaro]

Now, when I'm on the motorway for example at 05:00, not unusual, with nothing in front or behind but I see a lorry about to join at a junction,  I drift into lane 2 to give him a lane to pull into.

There is no one to indicate to so I don't.

There is the lorry, watching in the mirror if you're freeing lane 1.
In any case, if you tell your car that you want to change lane using the direction light, the LKAS will stay off.

[Kenneve]

Hi Guys

Many thanks for all your comments, much appreciated.

I relation to the braking issue, I guess I did not indicate before moving out to miss the stationary car.
However the braking was initiated by the Collision Mitigation Braking System, which as I understand it does not rely on indicators. It is simply the camera seeing an object in its way, in this case some 25-30yds ahead and I was already moving out.

Moving on, I do like the ACC and the fact that it will slow you down when coming up behind a slower moving vehicle, I have it set to the longest distance, to give plenty of warning.
Average MPG still creeping up, after todays outing, mostly local miles it was up to 67.5mpg.
My gut tells me I probably wont get much more than 70mpg, but heh, who's counting when you get to those sort of figures

[Kremmen]

To part answer the 2 comments I got.

On an uphill slip road, I've seen the lorry top well before he sees me so there is no chance of him seeing my indicators, especially if we are alongside. It's a case of using the situation at the time and you're quite right that there are some situations where indicating is a must/ courteous.

Horses for courses but LKAS holds no prisoners, even with no one else around you must indicate or else.

[jazzaro]

To part answer the 2 comments I got.

On an uphill slip road, I've seen the lorry top well before he sees me so there is no chance of him seeing my indicators, especially if we are alongside. It's a case of using the situation at the time and you're quite right that there are some situations where indicating is a must/ courteous.

Horses for courses but LKAS holds no prisoners, even with no one else around you must indicate or else.

In Italy, just after passing the exam for the driving license, you start forgotting rules; the first is "follow speed limits", the second is how to run in a roudabout, the third is "use you direction lights".  LKAS and similar devices will help us to be  good and polite drivers again. 

[Westy36]

In Italy, just after passing the exam for the driving license, you start forgotting rules; the first is "follow speed limits", the second is how to run in a roudabout, the third is "use you direction lights".  LKAS and similar devices will help us to be  good and polite drivers again. 

I've driven in Italy before. Enthusiastic would be the best term for the driving! 

In the UK, we refer to giving taking our cars for a hard revvy drive as giving it an 'Italian Tune Up!'.

[John Ratsey]

It appears, people with LKAS might be allowed to leave the car in charge https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-56906145. Will that be a step backwards for safety?

[Kremmen]

Yes, but initially only on motorways and only up to 37mph !!!

Now there's an accident waiting to happen.

[Kenneve]

Now there's an accident waiting to happen.

On the evidence of my original post, I couldn't agree more!!
I for one will not be going down that route any time soon.

[Downsizer]

It appears, people with LKAS might be allowed to leave the car in charge https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-56906145. Will that be a step backwards for safety?

How will LKAS then respond when the driver’s wife says “you’ve chosen the wrong lane again”?

[Foksadure]

We'd better get used to self-driving cars becoming commodities, just like computers or mobile phones already are:

https://epic.org/foia/epic-v-ai-commission/EPIC-19-09-11-NSCAI-FOIA-20200331-3rd-Production-pt9.pdf#page=55

One can't keep control of everything when it comes to applied technology. Barely an illusion of some sort of control, at best.