Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - 2020 => Topic started by: swampy on October 18, 2017, 11:00:37 AM
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Hi all
Just joined the forum and close to taking the plunge on a new Jazz EX.
I'd be interested to know how you rate your Jazz for refinement on the Motorway at say 70-80mph in terms of engine noise, road noise and wind noise.
Am getting rid of my Mk6 Golf 1.6 Tdi after it's exhaust gas recirculation valve failed - 6 months after it had the so called emissions fix applied.
Not expecting it to quite as refined as the Golf but hoping it's not too much of a step down.
Your opinions much appreciated.
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I would say my experience with Jazz cars (now on my 4th) over the years has been very good.
I'm not one for speeding much, just set the cruise control to 70, sit back and enjoy the journey, I suppose my longest trip in a day has been up to Scotland, roughly 325 miles and did not suffer any undue affects from the journey.
I can't speak for VW, most of the previous cars has been Rover products , metros, 200 series etc and a Freelander and I can say that the Jazz is equally as comfortable, if not better.
My fuel consumption is usually in the mid 50s on such journeys.
So I would say, go for it, I don't think you will regret it.
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As above, I usually run at 70 on cruise control, long journey mpg 50+, around town 47ish. After decades of diesel driving it is blissfully quiet and smooth. It gets a bit vocal above 4,000 revs but that is only briefly during hard acceleration. Initially it may feel a bit sluggish after a turbo diesel, but you soon learn how to get the best out of it, don't be afraid to use the full rev range! Honda car engines are designed to give their best at high revs.
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It's pretty quiet at 60mph (which is what I usually do - cruise control in lane one then relax), its slightly louder at 70mph. If you push it beyond the speed limit it can get a bit noisy but no worse than most cars in its class. A VW might be a bit quieter but I don't find anything objectionable to the Jazz at speed - you can still hold a normal conversation with the other occupants.
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This is a very subjective question, and people will have very different ideas about what constitutes a refined motorway car.
Are you buying from a dealer in which case you should be able to test drive. Buying privately should still be able to try on motorway.
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This is a very subjective question, and people will have very different ideas about what constitutes a refined motorway car.
I have a GD5. 1,2 litre and I am happy enough with it at 70. But it is purely subjective.
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As long as you remember that the Jazz is a (big) supermini biased towards urban use you won't go far wrong. It is an adequate motorway car but it is not meant to be a lane three burner.
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Subjectively, I find my Jazz acceptable at 70 on the motorway, you don't have to shout to be heard by back seat passengers. Can't comment on 80 as that would be breaking the law. However my Rolls Royce and my wife's Jaguar are quieter ;D
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This is a very subjective question, and people will have very different ideas about what constitutes a refined motorway car.
Are you buying from a dealer in which case you should be able to test drive. Buying privately should still be able to try on motorway.
Well I did many motorway miles in my 1.4 GD, from Shropshire down to Lands End and also up as far as Dundee in bonny Scotland, also once a month I did M54 / M6 / M5 / M42 / M40 return trip from Shropshire to our companies head office in Thame Buckinghamshire. Have to admit it was an easier Journey in the Civic (Civic is hardly affected by 'bow wave' of large lorries on motorway and crosswinds in general), but I have also driven to Scotland and Cornwall in my wifes GE 1.4 Jazz (it has cruise control and the Civic doesn't) without a problem. Have not driven a MK3 so cannot comment, but I bet it is a better ride then GD / GE.
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I think the new Mk4 2018 Jazz with its 1.5 litres 128 bhp I-VETC engine, is going to be a much better bet
for the motorways, either in this country, or abroad.
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The Mk3 I had on loan, a couple of weeks back was brilliantly smooth and quiet. Every bit as quiet as the CRV the month before that. Granted, it was brand new, with only 200 miles on the clock.
(https://i.imgur.com/G8raRFL.jpg)
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I think the new Mk4 2018 Jazz with its 1.5 litres 128 bhp I-VETC engine, is going to be a much better bet
for the motorways, either in this country, or abroad.
Personally I don't like the look of the mk3 and mk4 looks like more of the same. I do however like the look of the new Civic, after 2011 the Civic also got a bit strange, but have seen a couple of latest Civics and it looks Gooood!
The 1.8iVTEC 140bhp naturally aspirated engine fitted to Civic up till this year is a real Gem, very flexible and lots of oomph, and capable of good mpg. Latest Civic has 129 or 182 turbo petrol ponies under bonnet.
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I have found the Mk3 cvt much more relaxed on motorways, and with a better ride, than the Mk 2 manual. I tend to drive at 68 mph on cruise control (true 64 mph), to minimise lane-changing, and this gives an indicated 60+ mpg, about 56 actual. The cvt gives revs of well under 2500 at this speed, which I find very comfortable and quiet. A faster speed would save a few minutes on a three hour trip, but why have the extra stress?
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The Mk3 I had on loan, a couple of weeks back was brilliantly smooth and quiet. Every bit as quiet as the CRV the month before that. Granted, it was brand new, with only 200 miles on the clock.
I am surprised at this because my mk 3 CVT is much quieter and smoother at 19000 miles that it was at 200. In fact when I first got it I was a little disappointed by engine noise compared to my fully in Mk 2.
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I am surprised at this because my mk 3 CVT is much quieter and smoother at 19000 miles that it was at 200. In fact when I first got it I was a little disappointed by engine noise compared to my fully in Mk 2.
I am not saying it won't get better once it gets more miles on it. Just that it was smooth and refined, with no cabin rattles, as I would expect from a new motor. My GD5 has almost 100,000 miles on the clock, and some days sounds like a bag of bolts. Mind you, the other day I was sitting at a set of lights and I thought the engine had cut out. The rev counter said it was running, but I had to blip the throttle just to confirm it was still going.
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Mind you, the other day I was sitting at a set of lights and I thought the engine had cut out. The rev counter said it was running, but I had to blip the throttle just to confirm it was still going.
I had that experience in my Mk2 but not Mk3.
However my opinion is probably not reliable as I rely on very high powered hearing aids and it might be down to how my aids amplify different parts of the Mk2 and Mk3 spectrums.
My Mk3 is wonderfully refined if I turn the aids off!
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Many thanks for all your comments - I don't think it'll disappoint me on the motorway from what you've said.
Am going ahead and will place an order for an EX very soon. Will probably sell my Golf privately and buy from an online broker to save some cash - but deciding which broker isn't straightforward.
Trying to focus on brokers with a good track record and not necessarily the absolute cheapest ones to avoid any dodgy ones.
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I bought my ex through Carwow and saved quite a bit 2 years ago.
Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk
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I do confess to having a couple of Dings from the starter / flywheel starter ring when I've tried to start my already running car ;D
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I know the answer you'll get in a VW forum, and the one you'll get in a Honda forum so there is a bit of confirmation bias here, but you should really see if you can test drive one to satisfy yourself first. I quite regularly have rental cars and the Golf is more comparable to a Civic hatch (or Astra, Focus etc.) than a Jazz. The Jazz is quite a lot lighter and a bit smaller, although internal space is good especially rear seats. You will notice the difference on the motorway - any lighter car will feel less planted than a heavier one. The direct comparison is probably with the Polo.
The biggest shock will be going from a high torque diesel to a revving petrol engine but it does suit the car fine, it's just feels a bit alien after driving a diesel Golf.
--
TG
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Just on CVTs (and definitely not wanting to start another debate on the subject) I am very interested in this 2,500 revs at 70 mph thing. The manual Mk2 is doing 3,500 revs (give or take) at 70 and I find it OK at that speed but losing a 1000 revs must increase refinement.
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If you check the gear ratios on the Honda website you will find that the CVT has a higher top ratio and a higher final drive ratio than the MT. This is why it accelerates slower than the MT car and has slightly better fuel consumption (under test conditions).
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I am surprised at this because my mk 3 CVT is much quieter and smoother at 19000 miles that it was at 200. In fact when I first got it I was a little disappointed by engine noise compared to my fully in Mk 2.
I am not saying it won't get better once it gets more miles on it. Just that it was smooth and refined, with no cabin rattles, as I would expect from a new motor. My GD5 has almost 100,000 miles on the clock, and some days sounds like a bag of bolts. Mind you, the other day I was sitting at a set of lights and I thought the engine had cut out. The rev counter said it was running, but I had to blip the throttle just to confirm it was still going.
After driving diesels for many years, I find the almost inaudible tickover a little disconcerting.
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The original question was about refinement for motorway cruising, and the answer must be subjective because different people have different perceptions. At motorway speeds, I find the engine noise is drowned out by the wind and tyre noise. That's probably similar to other cars in the same class, but if you're used to a bigger heavier car you might find it quite un-refined. Make sure your test drive includes a fast stretch of road.
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That's good advice Colin - most test drives are too short and there's nothing wrong with asking to try the car out on in a situation that concerns you the most.
More and more these days there is a car for every type of situation - this is all to the good but it makes decision making that bit harder. Well worth doing the research.
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That's good advice Colin - most test drives are too short and there's nothing wrong with asking to try the car out on in a situation that concerns you the most.
More and more these days there is a car for every type of situation - this is all to the good but it makes decision making that bit harder. Well worth doing the research.
Cars these days are so much better than they have ever been it is hard to find a situation they can't handle well. You really have to work out how much time you actually drive on a motorway. and not be put off a car by thinking it may not be ideal for something you only do 1% of the time anyway, but is great for the other 99%.
Sure the Jazz can be a bit revvy, but so are most petrol cars - and it does not hurt them one bit. People used to Diesels accept the tickover noise and sometimes vibration without a problem, but if you are used to the lower down power of a Diesel (which run out of puff as the revs rise and top out just over about 4K anyway, so have limited rev range) driving a petrol car can leave you thinking they are 'under-powered' when that is far from the truth, and arguably a modern diesel requires quite a lot of maintenance and this can outweigh any fuel saving for a private low to medium mileage owner.
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Driving my GD5 today, I was doing 2500 rpm at 60 mph. The engine was masked by tyre and wind noise. At no time did we have to raise our voices to hold a conversation. And a new Jazz is just so much better than my 11 year old 1.2 Litre.
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Am going ahead and will place an order for an EX very soon. Will probably sell my Golf privately and buy from an online broker to save some cash - but deciding which broker isn't straightforward.
It may also be worthwhile looking through the ex-demonstrators listed on Honda's website https://usedcars.honda.co.uk/en/used-cars/approved-cars (https://usedcars.honda.co.uk/en/used-cars/approved-cars). You get the full warranty, possibly some extras (mats as a minimum) and perhaps the 5 year service plan chucked in. And you can still haggle over whatever price is listed.
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I've just come back from visiting my ageing Dad in North Wales. 190 miles each way (from Brackley(*))
On the way up (Wed) I sat in lane one with CC set at between 50 and 60 according to traffic and roadworks. Pump to pump was 63mpg and I barely had to adjust the audio volume.
Coming back today I sat around 70mph where I could which was most of the journey. Audio volume had to be turned up quite a bit but it wasn't unpleasant. Pump to pump was 49mpg although the weather probably didn't help.
Make of that what you will. What I make of it (for what it's worth) is that there's more than enough power under the bonnet to mix it up in lane 3. Also - it costs you quite a lot to do that ;)
(*)Northants. The other Brackley (which the BBC weather seems to think is more important) appears to be a collection of farm buildings in the nether regions of Scotland.
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The 1.8iVTEC 140bhp naturally aspirated engine fitted to Civic up till this year is a real Gem, very flexible and lots of oomph, and capable of good mpg.
Have to agree and on a recent motorway journey averaging 70 mph with cruise control on I was getting 46 mph which with a 1.8 engine and a heavier car than the Jazz I was quite happy with.
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[quote author=andruec link=topic=9555.msg52948#msg52948 date=1508611099
Coming back today I sat around 70mph where I could which was most of the journey. Audio volume had to be turned up quite a bit but it wasn't unpleasant. Pump to pump was 49mpg although the weather probably didn't help.
[/quote]
It is possible to gear up the audio volume/speed relationship, so that you don't have to adjust it. However, I've forgotten how I did it! It must be buried in the manual somewhere.........
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The speed/volume adjustment is on by default. Unfortunately it doesn't quite do the job at high speeds.
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It's on page 318. I have my volume mainly set to 12 and usually don't need to adjust it on speeds up to 70 mph. I am fortunate that I don't yet need hearing aids but maybe it would be different if I did.
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I think I must be driving a different Jazz!
Tyre and wind noise at 70mph are minimal, in fact I commented only the other day to the wife how you can have a conversation without having to raise your voice. Engine noise? You hardly know that the engine is running.
Radio speed/volume is still at default and a set volume of about 9 is quite sufficient.
The ride I find to be very acceptable.
All in all I like my EX.
Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk
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My speed/volume adjuster sits in the front passenger seat. I never need to touch the CD player. Cannot remember when I last had to change a disc!
When I am driving alone I never play music. First car I have ever done that. I like to hear the engine note when I am in town. Easy to stall it otherwise.
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I think I must be driving a different Jazz!
Tyre and wind noise at 70mph are minimal
Choice of tyre and tyre pressures can make a huge difference here. So too can road surfaces. I never have to raise my voice to talk to my wife. But what noise you do hear in the cabin is predominantly road and wind noise, as against engine noise.
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I think I must be driving a different Jazz!
Tyre and wind noise at 70mph are minimal, in fact I commented only the other day to the wife how you can have a conversation without having to raise your voice. Engine noise? You hardly know that the engine is running.
Radio speed/volume is still at default and a set volume of about 9 is quite sufficient.
The ride I find to be very acceptable.
All in all I like my EX.
Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk
+1 albeit I have the radio slightly louder.
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Those who are saying it's quiet - what model do you have and in particular what size tyres? I have the EX-T and that means the lower profile tyres. It might also be worth noting that as I was driving a long distance I was playing music from my phone over Bluetooth (so that the sat nav instructions come over the car speakers). The reproduction quality is a bit poor over BT and I have to adjust the volume to match what my iPod produces. I moaned in another thread that I wish the infotainment unit maintained a different volume setting for each input.
But regardless the noise levels weren't unpleasant and nothing out of the ordinary for a 'super mini'. It would've been perfectly possible to carry on a conversation without raising voices.
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I have a Mk 1, GD5, which has the 175/65T14 tyres. These are skinny, compared to the tyres fitted to Mk 3 vehicles.
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The speed/volume adjustment is on by default. Unfortunately it doesn't quite do the job at high speeds.
The adjustment is not just on or off. You can change the sensitivity. I increased mine to give better audio at higher speeds.
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The speed/volume adjustment is on by default. Unfortunately it doesn't quite do the job at high speeds.
The adjustment is not just on or off. You can change the sensitivity. I increased mine to give better audio at higher speeds.
SVC normally has 3 levels and off, but because exterior noise level depends so much on road surface I find it better to leave on a low setting and turn the volume knob if I need more, that is why us mere humans beat machines, the SVC needs to monitor ambient noise levels as well as vehicle speed and then weight the adjustment to match human hearing LOL.
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That was a query i had. Its the wifes car and just driven from Windsor to Edinburgh. Sure from my c class its more noisy but notnthe engine just road noise but have to say after a while it performed brilliantly a cvt average speed 65 sometimes 70 sometimes higher aveage mpg 60.1 but remember its not designed as a motorway cruiser but dealt with it well i have to say
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Yes - the CVT is definitely a contributor to relaxed motorway cruising. On the flat, at 70 mph, you are doing 2,500 rpm (ish) whereas in a manual car of most other makes you'd be doing 3,500.
If I did a lot of motorway driving - rep type mileage of 100 miles plus a day - I'd want something bigger and more powerful with a less stressed engine and more metal round me.
But, for a small car, the Jazz is a competent motorway cruiser - and that applies to all marques.
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i have noticed on the motorway on cruse control if i come to a grade in 6th gear it will ask for a down shift but if i am driving the same route with no cruise it wont
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The CRUISE will increase throttle to maintain speed as you hit an incline, resulting in the request to change down... without cruise you probably keep your foot in the same place, hence no request.
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The CRUISE will increase throttle to maintain speed as you hit an incline, resulting in the request to change down... without cruise you probably keep your foot in the same place, hence no request.
Yes, and the cruise is very sensitive, so quicker to increase gas than a common driver.
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I don't use the motorway much but did a 350 mile round trip to visit my daughter in Surrey. It was all motorway and I kept the speed to 65 mph. I found it quite noisy, especially from the rear.
My previous cars were Audi A6 and SEAT Alhambra, both diesels, and they were significantly quieter.
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I don't use the motorway much but did a 350 mile round trip to visit my daughter in Surrey. It was all motorway and I kept the speed to 65 mph. I found it quite noisy, especially from the rear.
I find the bulk of the noise in my Mk1 comes from the rear. Tyre noise is far greater than engine noise.
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I don't use the motorway much but did a 350 mile round trip to visit my daughter in Surrey. It was all motorway and I kept the speed to 65 mph. I found it quite noisy, especially from the rear.
My previous cars were Audi A6 and SEAT Alhambra, both diesels, and they were significantly quieter.
Probably tyre noise, it seems to be the biggest source of noise on a Honda, I find that for some inexplicable reason Honda seem to fit noisy tyres as original equipment - a change of tyres makes a world of difference.
I tried to start engine a couple of times in our Mk1's when it was already running, then got into the habit of looking at rev counter to see if engine was running or not. The engine in MK2 not quite as quiet. Don't know about MK3 though, but I would imaging compared to a diesel it has to be quieter.
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Probably tyre noise, it seems to be the biggest source of noise on a Honda, I find that for some inexplicable reason Honda seem to fit noisy tyres as original equipment - a change of tyres makes a world of difference.
Definitely tyre noise, though I have tyres that are rated as "quiet" fitted to mine. On different road surfaces it goes from silent to cacophony!
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I don't use the motorway much but did a 350 mile round trip to visit my daughter in Surrey. It was all motorway and I kept the speed to 65 mph. I found it quite noisy, especially from the rear.
My previous cars were Audi A6 and SEAT Alhambra, both diesels, and they were significantly quieter.
Tyres will obviously have some effect on the road noise but by far the main reason is the lack of sound deadening/damping. The MK3 is already pretty good compared to previous generations but I guess to keep the cost and weight down Honda have had to skimp on the sound insulation.
In my previous car, the EP3 Type-R, it was the same. Once I put some sound deadening in, it made a much bigger difference than low noise tyres ever made.
I find with European cars, there is generally more sound insulation as well as thicker steel panels/doors etc which usually helps reduce noise.
I think if you want a refined Jazz, some insulation in the wheel arches, boot floor, doors and the firewall/bulkhead area will make a considerable difference. But having used the MK1 for over 10 years, the MK3 is already an improvement so we're not going to do any more.
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Refined? No but drove London to Edinburgh 1.3 CVT and much better than expected. My Mercedes I could say was refined the Jazz not so much but was very capable
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Refined? No but drove London to Edinburgh 1.3 CVT and much better than expected. My Mercedes I could say was refined the Jazz not so much but was very capable
I think that's a fair comment. Whisper quiet "wafting" at 70 mph on the motorway does require a bigger car. I note that some upmarket brands now have double glazing!
For a small car though, the Mk3 Jazz is decent.
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My 3yr old Mk 3 Sport CVT managed over 53mpg average on a 120 mile trip just recently. Cruise control on most of the motorway route, average 70mph most of the way. Honda engines like the revs more if you like max performance, but the difference with most cars, is that they hold up much better, and you would be very unlucky if you didn't top 100 - 200k miles with any major engine problems. Mine is very young with less than 20k, but other members will no doubt testify as to reliability?
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My Jazz is a mk1 so isn't really relevant to this thread but I thought I would mention in anyway.
It's okay for motorway cruising but the engine sits at high RPM so it's quite loud and it doesn't really seem all that relaxed at high speed. The low weight of the mk1 combined with the high body sides also means that the winds loves to push you around.
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My Jazz is a mk1 so isn't really relevant to this thread but I thought I would mention in anyway.
It's okay for motorway cruising but the engine sits at high RPM so it's quite loud and it doesn't really seem all that relaxed at high speed. The low weight of the mk1 combined with the high body sides also means that the winds loves to push you around.
My Mk 1 is a 2006 and at motorway speeds I do not find the engine noise as bad as the tyre/wind noise. I also don't feel the wind pushing me about much more than it did my Volvo S40. I don't try and fight the wind.