Mk4 2021 Jazz Brake failure

[Cobb2]

Thanks Spodric - an excellent You Tube find. It actually made me laugh at the irony, which was needed since I have now been told by the Dealer that the likely date of the part arriving is not now the 15th April but 23rd. Doesn't sound as if its coming by Air. Also I still have not heard back from the Honda escalation team despite phoning their first line customer service 3 times and sending an email and a letter. The phone calls stated I would have a reply within 3 working days. Perhaps they are having to carefully think out how they can deal with this major problem. I hope they can.

[madasafish]

Write to the MD more in sorrow than anger detailing dates etc,, on on sheet of paper so it is readable.
Too long and it will be passed down, short, polite and to the point and he/she can read it themselves.
(Apologies for teaching to suck eggs:-)

[Lord Voltermore]

 I would suggest that any complaint  also subtly reminds  the person reading it that they need to pass it to a higher authority to protect their own  back .   Complaints may never reach  someone competent enough to realise just how serious it is due to the Peter Principle'    (The Peter Principle is an observation that the tendency in most organizational hierarchies, such as that of a corporation, is for every employee to rise in the hierarchy through promotion until they reach a level of respective incompetence.)

Someone will decide its their job to protect more senior management from being bothered by such 'minor complaints' and wrongly decide the buck stops with them,  causing horrendous damage to Hondas reputation and profits.     Either someone in in Honda UK or Honda Japan if the complaints reach that far.

When  Senior managment later investigate what went wrong   they will find their scapegoats.  The last person in line  who made the  incompetent decision, and  their manager who may not have been aware but will be criticised for not supervisong properly.   Both could lose their jobs. 

Here is a paste from a post on the HondaEforums   

"FWIW I know someone whose other half is working at a UK dealer. They have seen several failures in the last couple of months (mainly hybrid Jazz models) and they have been in discussions with HUK who are "under extreme pressure to recall these cars".

[bobby boy]

The Mark 4 jazz and CRV brake problem have been featured on the honestjohn site, pressure must be building up on Honda to take  action to remedy this problem to protect their reputation for reliability.

[ColinB]

…. HUK who are "under extreme pressure to recall these cars".

I’d guess that one of the things Honda are wrestling with is deciding what they need to recall. The earlier post from the Honda e owner suggests he managed to fix his car by scavenging a part from a different model. That suggests this is a standard part fitted across (probably) all their EV and hybrid models. So do they all need to be recalled?

The other thing that comes out of that owner’s post is his suggestion that dealers might be implicated by botching a brake fluid change. If there’s even a tiny bit of truth in that, the liability lies with the dealers not with Honda, so why should they recall anything?

All very messy unfortunately.

[Chis52]

I think the wording of the translation of the recall in Japan carries more weight than any potential mis-servicing of the brake fluid. I quote, “… the brake operating simulator, assembly oil used during manufacturing may seep into the pressure sensor due to an inappropriate manufacturing process. Therefore, during use, the resistance part within the sensor may corrode, causing the output value to become abnormal, causing the warning light to illuminate, the failsafe to activate and the force required to operate the brake pedal to be increased.”

[Chis52]

My car went in for checking yesterday. Just had a call from Maidenhead Honda to inform me that, as suspected, it is a failure of the brake simulator. Quote for fitting a replacement part, including VAT and fitting costs is just over £2K. They also said the 12volt battery needs replacing, at an additional £190. I said that I was aware that other owners of the 2020 model are suffering the same problem and also quoted the wording of the Japan recall i.e “inappropriate manufacturing process”, they agreed to contact Honda UK, requesting a goodwill gesture. They currently do not know the timescale for obtaining a replacement part.
My next move will depend on the reply from Honda UK.

[Chis52]

Just had an email from the Honda garage who confirmed the brake fault on my car. They asked Honda for a goodwill gesture considering the car is only 3.5 years old and has done 9,000 miles. They have responded by offering to pay 40% of the part cost only. This will be their only and final offer. This means the cost will now be £987.64 inc VAT for the part and £504 for labour. A total cost to me of £1490.64.
My response to the garage was that whilst I not at all happy with this mean spirited gesture from Honda I feel forced to accept in order reduce the delay in getting the car back on the road. Nevertheless I intend to seek legal advice about a claim under the sale of goods act and will also do my best to publicise this problem to various consumer organisations e.g. Which? and BBC Watchdog. I suggest that all other owners of this lemon of a car follow a similar path.

[Cobb2]

Thanks for the update Chis52.
My charge was to be around £1800 - so nearer £1350 after goodwill- so your dealer seems to be charging more unless they are including your 12v battery replacement in that. Have they given you a potential time scale yet?
I have contacted DVSA with various details about this Honda problem and after filling in a form I have responded to some further questions they asked. They are contacting Honda about it and expecting a reply from them within 7 days. Meanwhile I intend to now send a letter and email to Honda Europe in Bracknell (which Honda UK became some years ago apparently) and address it to a a suitable director after looking up details on Companies House Gov UK. If there are no suitable replies from Honda to this or my communications to them I will then contact various Consumer bodies.
 

[Chis52]

No estimate yet for a timescale on the replacement. I did ask the dealer to make it a high priority request but I won't hold my breath. Do you have a postal address for Honda Europe? Let me know if you find the name of a director to write to and I will do the same.

[Daffodil]

I emailed the Managing Director “more in sorrow than anger” (madasafish - thank you).

His name is Monsieur Jean-Marc Streng and his email is   jean-marc.streng@honda-eu.com

My subject for the email was Preserving Honda’s Reputation in the hope it would be read rather than ditched as a complaint.

I was polite but concerned. I sent him the translation of the Japanese Recall. I also asked him if I should be sending details to the DVSA (as Cobb2 has already done).

Let’s wait and see.

[peteo48]

Don't know how relevant this is but, a 100 yards down the road from me, there was a Mk4 Jazz in Midnight Blue identical to mine but a bit older. There is now a brand new Yaris in the drive.

I saw the owner today and she was willing to talk to me. She said the Mk4 Jazz will be the last Honda she ever buys and, yes, she had the brake issue which she described as scary and expensive. Her car was off the road for six weeks. "I couldn't wait to get rid of the bloody thing" she said.

Honda need to do a full recall and quick.

[Marcow02]

Does anyone know which buildyears of the mark4 Jazz have the potentiali brakeproblem?
Does a 2023 car still has the faulty part?

[Tinny]

My first post.  Pleased to have found you all.

The brake simulator on my 2020 Honda Jazz failed on 10 February and took 5 weeks to repair.  It was 6 weeks out of warranty and had done less than 10,000 miles. Honda Uk gave me a 40% discount.  I paid because I needed to get the repair carried out as quickly as possible.

I took the issue up with the Honda dealership but they were totally unsympathetic.  No courtesy car was offered and there were no updates from them during the five weeks.  When the car was returned to me there was an issue with the steering and I have been back to the dealership several times.  The dealership does not have a complaints process. 

Amongst other things, they told me that it’s very common for low mileage cars to have faults.

Yesterday I received a call from the owner of the dealership, who I have never met.  He told me that he had heard I was an unhappy customer, asked for brief deatils of the issues and then stated that I was now banned, together with my car, from ever going to any of the Honda dealerships he owns in the local area.  Total call time - less than 5 minutes.

I have emailed Honda uk for their comments.

Both Honda reliability and Honda customer service are seriously underperforming with regard to the brake simulator issue. It looks like the legal route is the only one that Honda will respond to.

Would be happy to be proved wrong.

[Kremmen]

Banned for complaining is disgusting. Not what I would expect from a Honda dealership

Name and shame ?