Clubjazz - Honda Jazz & HR-V Forums
Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk3 2015 - 2020 => Topic started by: Maraz on February 16, 2020, 07:18:31 PM
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Hi, I'm new here (and also new to the Jazz brand - but I love IT!).
The biggest issue I got with my new car is the absence of a spare tyre.
I know this issue was already been contentious in this forum, and I've read some very good posts. However, after looking under the trunk's board and removing the plastic structure - I was surprised to see no bolt or hole for a bolt. It seems impossible to convert to space saver without damaging the car, isn't it? Any suggestion how to safely secure the tyre?
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Assuming you have brought a brand new car, the under board volume has been reduced, such that it will not accommodate a normal spare wheel. I’m not familiar with the space saver wheel dimensions, but I doubt it will accept that either, hence the supply of tyre repair gunge!
I was initially concerned myself when I brought my Mk3 Ex, but simmered down, when I realised how old I was (80+) and would probably be incapable of changed a wheel, by the roadside myself, not to mention the safety issues involved with the general standard of driving nowadays 🤠
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Yes - I'm 71 with a bad back amongst other things and wouldn't change a wheel myself these days. I'd call out the rescue service if the gunk couldn't get me home or to the nearest garage.
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Thanks. Am I the only one feeling irritated by having no backup in the trunk?
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If the space is big enough then put a spare wheel in there (current production of European Jazzes don't have a big enough space). There should be a hole for a fixing bolt under the carpet (if there is one) but if there isn't then don't lose any sleep. Pack some old clothes and tools around the wheel to stop it moving around when you are driving. OK. It's not secured in event of a crash but is still restrained by the boot floor and if you turn the vehicle upside down then a moving spare wheel is well down the list of worries.
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No, to be fair Maraz, I think you make a good point. It's just that as an old geezer I wouldn't be changing a wheel myself these days. I have done so, several times, in the past.
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Yes - I'm 71 with a bad back amongst other things and wouldn't change a wheel myself these days. I'd call out the rescue service if the gunk couldn't get me home or to the nearest garage.
If you have a spare wheel, then if the gunk doesn't work, a rescue service could fit your space saver wheel and get you on your way a lot quicker than if they have to get a recovery truck out to you.
I bought a space saver wheel, though the last puncture was many years ago, but a couple of years ago I hit a pothole that not only flattend the tyre, but damaged the wheel, and having a space saver meant I was mobile very quickly
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I went for 3 years in my Jazz without getting a puncture and without a spare wheel but I was anxious about not having one.
So when I bought my HR-V, I ordered one with the car. After a few weeks I got a puncture and used the space saver to get me to the garage. They fixed the puncture and sent me on my way. The repairer commented that if I had used the 'gunk' then he would not have been able to repair it and I would have been faced with the cost of a new tyre to replace one that had done less that 1,000 miles. What a good decision that turned out to be.
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I went for 3 years in my Jazz without getting a puncture and without a spare wheel but I was anxious about not having one.
So when I bought my HR-V, I ordered one with the car. After a few weeks I got a puncture and used the space saver to get me to the garage. They fixed the puncture and sent me on my way. The repairer commented that if I had used the 'gunk' then he would not have been able to repair it and I would have been faced with the cost of a new tyre to replace one that had done less that 1,000 miles. What a good decision that turned out to be.
Gunk is deadly to those integral ( direct ) TPMS sensors as well...... but not the ABS version :)
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I went for 3 years in my Jazz without getting a puncture and without a spare wheel but I was anxious about not having one.
So when I bought my HR-V, I ordered one with the car. After a few weeks I got a puncture and used the space saver to get me to the garage. They fixed the puncture and sent me on my way. The repairer commented that if I had used the 'gunk' then he would not have been able to repair it and I would have been faced with the cost of a new tyre to replace one that had done less that 1,000 miles. What a good decision that turned out to be.
Gunk is deadly to those integral ( direct ) TPMS sensors as well...... but not the ABS version :)
Can u please explain further. Ty
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I went for 3 years in my Jazz without getting a puncture and without a spare wheel but I was anxious about not having one.
So when I bought my HR-V, I ordered one with the car. After a few weeks I got a puncture and used the space saver to get me to the garage. They fixed the puncture and sent me on my way. The repairer commented that if I had used the 'gunk' then he would not have been able to repair it and I would have been faced with the cost of a new tyre to replace one that had done less that 1,000 miles. What a good decision that turned out to be.
Gunk is deadly to those integral ( direct ) TPMS sensors as well...... but not the ABS version :)
Can u please explain further. Ty
One system measures the actual tyre pressure - direct, the other detects changes in wheel speed relative to its opposite one that might be due to a tyre deflation.
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There are 2 main kinds of TPMS (tyre pressure monitoring system )
1. Direct - this has a battery powered pressure sensor inside the rim that transmits pressure information to a receiver in the car. The direct measurement of pressure means this can display actual tyre pressure when car is stationary.
2. Indirect - this relies on the pulses from the ABS sensors on each wheel hub, when a tyre starts to lose pressure ( goes flat at the bottom ) the 'rolling radius ( distance from centre or hub to the road surface ) reduces, this means for any given speed the wheel has to rotate faster ( it is in effect a smaller diameter wheel ) - this means that the rate at which the pulses arrive at the ECU from that wheel increases, when the ECU compares the frequency of the pulses it will see a mis-match from the punctured wheel and flash up an icon of a flat tyre on the display.
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There are 2 main kinds of TPMS (tyre pressure monitoring system )
1. Direct - this has a battery powered pressure sensor inside the rim that transmits pressure information to a receiver in the car. The direct measurement of pressure means this can display actual tyre pressure when car is stationary.
2. Indirect - this relies on the pulses from the ABS sensors on each wheel hub, when a tyre starts to lose pressure ( goes flat at the bottom ) the 'rolling radius ( distance from centre or hub to the road surface ) reduces, this means for any given speed the wheel has to rotate faster ( it is in effect a smaller diameter wheel ) - this means that the rate at which the pulses arrive at the ECU from that wheel increases, when the ECU compares the frequency of the pulses it will see a mis-match from the punctured wheel and flash up an icon of a flat tyre on the display.
Does that mean at some point the battery will run out? Ty
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There are 2 main kinds of TPMS (tyre pressure monitoring system )
1. Direct - this has a battery powered pressure sensor inside the rim that transmits pressure information to a receiver in the car. The direct measurement of pressure means this can display actual tyre pressure when car is stationary.
2. Indirect - this relies on the pulses from the ABS sensors on each wheel hub, when a tyre starts to lose pressure ( goes flat at the bottom ) the 'rolling radius ( distance from centre or hub to the road surface ) reduces, this means for any given speed the wheel has to rotate faster ( it is in effect a smaller diameter wheel ) - this means that the rate at which the pulses arrive at the ECU from that wheel increases, when the ECU compares the frequency of the pulses it will see a mis-match from the punctured wheel and flash up an icon of a flat tyre on the display.
Does that mean at some point the battery will run out? Ty
The Jazz has the indirect ABS system ( except for model year 2015, when they tried direct TPMS but then went back to ABS system ), so no battery to worry about - you can change from winter to summer wheels and re-calibrate the TPMS from the car display. Problem with the direct method is that the battery will run out ( they say they last 5+ years ) but other than that if you want to fit summer and winter wheels you need to buy another compatible set of sensors for new wheels and the ECU can only remember 4 sensors at a time, so when wheels get changed in spring and autumn you have to take car to a specialist to get the different sensors programmed into system, which is normally about £50 twice a year. Many people with direct TPMS opt for 'all season' tyres and keep same wheels all year round, it is a lot cheaper.
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I've just bought a 2016 Jazz EX (66 reg), without a spare wheel, and have the same concern about tyre repair kit vs spare tyre. I've always carried a spare, even though I've rarely needed one, but just feel happier with the reassurance it gives when driving further afield.
Now I can't decide between the space saver kit or a full size spare. I'm sure the well is deep enough in my car for a full size one, but when I phoned a Honda dealer to check, he said it wouldn't be and the boot floor would have a bump in it. He recommended the space saver kit instead at a cost of £334 incl tools & fitting, which I though a bit high!!
I looked at the Cox Motor Parts site (as recommended by a few people on this forum) and it suggests that a full size one will fit, but I don't want the hassle of getting one that doesn't and then having to return it.
Anyone got the same model as me and carry a full size spare? Or would the space saver be a better option?
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I looked at the Cox Motor Parts site (as recommended by a few people on this forum) and it suggests that a full size one will fit, but I don't want the hassle of getting one that doesn't and then having to return it.
Hi and welcome :)
IIRC the "problem" with the full size wheel is that you'll need to make yourself a shelf to go over it, whereas the Honda space saver kit includes a polystyrene filler that means the boot's floor is structurally ok.
There's been a few threads about it, I went for the less hassle of the Honda kit.
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Hi John, and thanks for the welcome :)
Have you driven on the space saver wheel? I know it would probably get me home or to a garage ok - as long as I wasn't too far from civilisation - but is it as reliable and safe as driving on a full spare? Any downsides I should be aware of?
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@pidj - A space saver is perfectly safe to use as long as you follow the instructions on maximum distance and speed. Always fit on the rear axle, even if the puncture is to a front wheel.
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My 2018 EX, has a full size, original, spare wheel. Courtesy of Ebay.
The flimsy boot floor, is supported by 40 year old, recycled, greenhouse cedarwood staging.
Not pretty. But it works very well. (And, no-one sees it).......
(https://i.postimg.cc/XJ9YLdYD/IMG-20180619-150400.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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My 2018 EX, has a full size, original, spare wheel. Courtesy of Ebay.
The flimsy boot floor, is supported by 40 year old, recycled, greenhouse cedarwood staging.
Not pretty. But it works very well. (And, no-one sees it).......
(https://i.postimg.cc/XJ9YLdYD/IMG-20180619-150400.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
That looks perfectly fine to me....and what a great idea! I may have to steal it.... ;)
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Have a 2016 1.3 S CVT and just gunk supplied despite fittings for a spare. Always like a spare as nails dont usually puncture in the approved position. Have fitted a space saver but to get the Honda foam insert is silly price. Have supported the flimsy floor with plywood and wood supports using space saver as support. As this cuts down space for Jack, foot pump etc. I am looking at making plywood sheet to place on top of the boot floor, similar shape to rubber boot mat. Estimate this will give plenty of strength for luggage support, give loads of room under floor and round spare. Might even leave gunk and compressor in as double back up. Aim to varnish board to seal it and then cover in carpet/carpet tiles. Might improve sound proofing. Anyone tried this? If so does it work ok?
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Came across this puncture kit on a motorbike forum, great for motorbike as is light and small to carry, even with the 16 gram CO2 cylinders. Could be used on a car as well ( if you have a pair of pliers to pull nail or screw out ) - if you carry a pump in boot would not need the Co2 adaptor or cylinders. Hard to carry a pump on a motorbike though.
https://www.motorcycle.com/products/plugging-away-stopgo-vs-dynaplug-tubeless-tire-repair
https://www.amazon.co.uk/DYNAPLUG%C2%AE-ULTRALITE-TUBELESS-PUNCTURE-MOTORCYCLES/dp/B00UQPUZUE/ref=sr_1_4?crid=1XYZUMIQI8AZ&dchild=1&keywords=dynaplug+tubeless+repair+kit&qid=1613410875&sprefix=dynaplug+%2Caps%2C166&sr=8-4
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00U6AI2H2/
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B007CXDMJO/
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Hi. I have a 68 plate jazz. It came with the gunk. I bought on ebay a spacesaver wheel.
It fits OK in the wheel well along with my hydraulic jack and wheelbrace. As said a few rags packed around it means it doesn't clatter about over the potholes !!
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If you do put a spare wheel in the boot, it's worth devising some way of securing it, or cut the carpet to access the threaded hole for the standard securing screw.
If you were unfortunate enough to have a serious accident, you wouldn't want it hitting you at the back of the noggin.
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Whilst I've not had a puncture in over a decade I'm disappointed the MK4 has no facility to carry a space saver.
Without one you're at the mercy of the breakdown services as the gunk is only for slowish punctures. The last 3 punctures I did have, 2 of them gunk wouldn't have worked.
What happens when the AA do turn up ? They aren't going to 'give' you a spare wheel and I wouldn't want them taking a perfectly good wheel in exchange so how does it work ?
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Hi John, and thanks for the welcome :)
Have you driven on the space saver wheel? I know it would probably get me home or to a garage ok - as long as I wasn't too far from civilisation - but is it as reliable and safe as driving on a full spare? Any downsides I should be aware of?
A Mark 2 Jazz story: I drove from Warwick 70 miles home along the M6 on a space saver fitted to the rear wheel. At 50mph! No problems.
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What happens when the AA do turn up ? They aren't going to 'give' you a spare wheel and I wouldn't want them taking a perfectly good wheel in exchange so how does it work ?
The AA use a universal spare wheel to get you to a tyre repair place, so the repair/replacement can be done.
https://www.theaa.com/about-us/newsroom/innovation-and-technology/aa-multi-fit-wheel
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A Mark 2 Jazz story: I drove from Warwick 70 miles home along the M6 on a space saver fitted to the rear wheel. At 50mph! No problems.
I did about the same in our mark 1, driving back from North Yorkshire.
Whilst the wheel was fine, I didn't reckon much to the vehicles up my arse at 50mph, especially on the windy country lanes - those spacesavers have limited grip on the corners.
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What happens when the AA do turn up ? They aren't going to 'give' you a spare wheel and I wouldn't want them taking a perfectly good wheel in exchange so how does it work ?
The AA use a universal spare wheel to get you to a tyre repair place, so the repair/replacement can be done.
https://www.theaa.com/about-us/newsroom/innovation-and-technology/aa-multi-fit-wheel
Useful info, thanks.
I guess that works during 'office hours' when tyre shops are open but I tend to drive from Heathrow to Reading around 05:00. I wonder what happens in the dead of night.
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My 2019 Jazz came with a repair kit, (these kits are a bit hit and miss as to effectually repairing a puncture)
I purchased a space saver wheel,Jack and wheelbrace off Ebay. The wheel fits snugly in the boot well along with the tools and other bits and bobs that I carry. There is no means to fasten the wheel to the boot floor, but I'm satisfied it's secure enough. I also carry a motorcycle puncture repair kit that has proven it's worth several times on my bikes and on my previously owned BMW 3 series that had run flat tyres.
This preparation may save a wait of several hours before the road rescue service can get to you.
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What happens when the AA do turn up ? They aren't going to 'give' you a spare wheel and I wouldn't want them taking a perfectly good wheel in exchange so how does it work ?
The AA use a universal spare wheel to get you to a tyre repair place, so the repair/replacement can be done.
https://www.theaa.com/about-us/newsroom/innovation-and-technology/aa-multi-fit-wheel
Useful info, thanks.
I guess that works during 'office hours' when tyre shops are open but I tend to drive from Heathrow to Reading around 05:00. I wonder what happens in the dead of night.
https://www.24hrmobiletyres.co.uk/
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I purchased a space saver wheel,Jack and wheelbrace off Ebay. The wheel fits snugly in the boot well along with the tools and other bits and bobs that I carry. There is no means to fasten the wheel to the boot floor, but I'm satisfied it's secure enough.
Don't underestimate the damage a 15Kg plus spare wheel can do in the event of a serious accident - the boot floor and rear seats won't stop it.
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Don't underestimate the damage a 15Kg plus spare wheel can do in the event of a serious accident - the boot floor and rear seats won't stop it.
Good advice. I recall some road safety advice years ago, along the lines of in an impact, a rear passenger without a seat belt would be the equivalent of your being hit by a rhino.
Sobering video:
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One of my step-daughters got in the back of the car and didn't buckle up. When I asked her to fasten her belt, she said: "it's only a couple of miles". So I said: "right, out and walk. You are not travelling behind your mum or me with no belt on". She fastened her belt, and I have never had to say another word since.
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I purchased a space saver wheel,Jack and wheelbrace off Ebay. The wheel fits snugly in the boot well along with the tools and other bits and bobs that I carry. There is no means to fasten the wheel to the boot floor, but I'm satisfied it's secure enough.
Don't underestimate the damage a 15Kg plus spare wheel can do in the event of a serious accident - the boot floor and rear seats won't stop it.
If the car is rolling over a spare wheel definitely causes injuries when hitting your head. But of course same applies to everything you are carrying in the boot.
My mother was lucky not to get hit by a portable TV when she rolled over her car 30 years ago. TV went through the side window.
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My Jazz have fixing brackets in the boot.
I use them.
Anyone want to be hit by a box of angry bees? Not me.
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My Jazz have fixing brackets in the boot.
I use them.
Anyone want to be hit by a box of angry bees? Not me.
I don't think anyone would want to help you either! ;D
Tethering is a good point - you could at least affix the spare wheel to a secure tethering point with a bit of chain and a d-link, or a steel cable.
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My Jazz have fixing brackets in the boot.
I use them.
Anyone want to be hit by a box of angry bees? Not me.
In the 1960’s I helped a friend to move a hive of bees 20 miles in West Yorkshire with me in the passenger seat of an A35 van leaning into the back to hold the lid on the hive. A large pothole resulted in an emergency stop and we got out quickly to wait for the bees to settle down. Never again!
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My Jazz have fixing brackets in the boot.
I use them.
Anyone want to be hit by a box of angry bees? Not me.
In the 1960’s I helped a friend to move a hive of bees 20 miles in West Yorkshire with me in the passenger seat of an A35 van leaning into the back to hold the lid on the hive. A large pothole resulted in an emergency stop and we got out quickly to wait for the bees to settle down. Never again!
I collected a swarm from outside Birmingham, duly put them in a box and drove home up the M6.
After about 20 miles, I felt movement on my jeans around the crotch area (!) and surprise it was a bee.
Two miles later it was 10 bees - . Fortuantely services were near AND I was wearing a beejacket - the veil was not in use for driving - and I stopped, found the hole, gaffer taped it up and wnt along happily. Lost the 10 bees though at the service station...
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I transferred a large aquarium of tropical fish once. That was a treat!
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I purchased a space saver wheel,Jack and wheelbrace off Ebay. The wheel fits snugly in the boot well along with the tools and other bits and bobs that I carry. There is no means to fasten the wheel to the boot floor, but I'm satisfied it's secure enough.
Don't underestimate the damage a 15Kg plus spare wheel can do in the event of a serious accident - the boot floor and rear seats won't stop it.
I assume you also strap down all suitcases, shopping etc every time you have them in the car. Believe me I'm well aware of what damage can happen in vehicle collisions and roll overs.
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I bought an identical alloy wheel for my 2018 SE with an excellent Michelin ESaver for £55 plus £15 for the retaining wheel boot clamp and jack from a breaker. The spare is secured with the aforementioned clamp which screws down onto the boot floor.
Don’t pay more than £75 for a good alloy and good tyre, much better value than a SSaver.
I understand the post 2018 Jazzes have a different boot floor which can’t accommode a spare tyre.
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I assume you also strap down all suitcases, shopping etc every time you have them in the car. Believe me I'm well aware of what damage can happen in vehicle collisions and roll overs.
Actually, I do secure heavy luggage when travelling on holiday, and the dog too, who has a harness. As for shopping, I don't drive everywhere with shopping in the boot, nor are the contents of your average shopping bags going to kill you at the speeds most people do on local roads.
I'm not trying to be smart, I'm just pointing out that putting the boot mat over it does not make it secure. If you're happy with the way you have the wheel secured, that's great - I'm just pointing out that having a 15Kg lump loose in the boot is not safe in an accident.
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I assume you also strap down all suitcases, shopping etc every time you have them in the car. Believe me I'm well aware of what damage can happen in vehicle collisions and roll overs.
Actually, I do secure heavy luggage when travelling on holiday, and the dog too, who has a harness. As for shopping, I don't drive everywhere with shopping in the boot, nor are the contents of your average shopping bags going to kill you at the speeds most people do on local roads.
I'm not trying to be smart, I'm just pointing out that putting the boot mat over it does not make it secure. If you're happy with the way you have the wheel secured, that's great - I'm just pointing out that having a 15Kg lump loose in the boot is not safe in an accident.
+1, good post.
Plasma.