LED and other headlamp upgrades and new MOT

[guest7288]

Having read the MOT regs which become effective from May this year, I see that LED bulbs and xenon lights wil be an automatic fail. The only way to have these and be legal is if the whole headlamp is up graded.

That is a shame because I have fitted LED lights and they are far better than the standard halogen ones. I don't really want to go back to the standard bulbs as they are  very poor by today's standards. It seems thaat the best option is to go to Phillips Racing Vision which offfer a very good light at a reasonable price and will be legal.

I'd be interested to hear other peoples thoughts as you may know of a better way round this.

https://www.philips.co.uk/c-p/12342RVS2/racingvision-car-headlight-bulb

[Kenneve]

Hi Derm

Many thanks for posting the info about the MOT. Is it possible you can point me in the direction the new law relating to LED bulbs, I've found the item relating HID but can't find one relating to LED.

Like you, I have recently upgraded to LEDs, from the company that others have used on this forum, certainly not cheap, but an amazing difference in brightness. The supplier states that they will pass a MOT, but I guess if what you say is correct, then he is a little out of date.

I know of course that there are much cheaper LED bulbs on the market, but I suppose they are the reason why the regs are being tightened, certainly there are cars on the road that do dazzle and should fail the MOT.

I went through the process of trying other 'high brightness' bulbs ie 120% 130% even 150% bulbs, mostly from Halfords, but I found no real difference in their output. Do you think the Phillips versions are any better?

[culzean]

Having read the MOT regs which become effective from May this year, I see that LED bulbs and xenon lights wil be an automatic fail. The only way to have these and be legal is if the whole headlamp is up graded.

That is a shame because I have fitted LED lights and they are far better than the standard halogen ones. I don't really want to go back to the standard bulbs as they are  very poor by today's standards. It seems thaat the best option is to go to Phillips Racing Vision which offfer a very good light at a reasonable price and will be legal.

I'd be interested to hear other peoples thoughts as you may know of a better way round this.

https://www.philips.co.uk/c-p/12342RVS2/racingvision-car-headlight-bulb

Just do what a lot of HID users have been doing for years, put cheapo filament bulbs in for mot and then take them back out.

[Jocko]

I can see nothing in the draft for the new MOT for LED lights, only HID.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/671818/mot-inspection-manual-for-classes-3-4-5-and-7-from-20-may-2018-draft.pdf
However, construction and use regs do make LED conversion illegal unless you change the entire enclosure.

[guest1372]

The 'matters of testing' site has a note on this from a couple of years ago, and the requirements for HID are auto self-leveling and headlight washers which are mostly lacking in retrofit units. They also referred to an 'LED headlight system', I think this has been clarified (tightened up) to include anything with an LED bulb in it.  I'll add the link when I find it.

The current manual says this:
Vehicles equipped with High Intensity Discharge (HID) or LED dipped beam headlamps may be fitted with headlamp washers and a suspension or headlamp self levelling system.
Where such systems are fitted, they must work; however, it is accepted that it may not be possible to readily determine the functioning of self levelling systems. In such cases, the benefit of the doubt must be given.
Headlamp washers may work in conjunction with the windscreen washers (when the dipped beam headlamps are switched on) or by a separate switch.

High brightness headlamp type approval requires washers/levelling I believe, so the test seems to be coming into alignment with that.
----edit----
This VOSA note effective 1/1/2012 is helpful, but it refers to an 'LED headlamp system' rather than 'LED bulb'.
http://www.partinfo.co.uk/files/MOT%20Changes%20-%20Lighting.pdf

'Headlamp washing and levelling systems are mandatory for all vehicles fitted with LED headlamp systems ....'

The draft May 2018 manual page 7&8 make it quite clear HID conversions are failures but LED bulbs seems to be a grey area, too many references to washers 'if fitted'.

At least reversing lights make their debut in the 2018 test, and there is some interesting clarity about original fitment DRLs fitted to new cars from May 2018, which states 'DRLs may not operate when the engine is not running, or when the parking brake is applied, or when the park position is selected on automatic transmissions. '

Lastly in reference to Derms comment, even a halogen bulb might not be 'legal' if it's too bright which brings into question some of the 130% names given to replacement bulbs, 130% compared to what?
--
TG

[guest7288]

I have re-read the regulation and there is nothing specifically said about LEDs whilst there is about HIDs. I have read that LED bulbs fitted within the standard reflector unit will not give the right pattern. I will speak with the MOT tester at the garage we use and get their view.

I know it has been said by one on here to just change the bulbs before the test. This implies that the person does not care whether he is within the law or perhaps even blinding others with his headlights and to make such a post is actually irresponsible and if his insurance company were to see that, he may become uninsured.

Sadly these days, as we know from many celebrities twitter feeds, throw away comments often come back to bite us. I am sure the poster did not intend any illegalty or harm.

In my researching yesterday I did come about some commnet about LED upgrades which spoke of them being illegal. This is why I raise this here as there are many on here who know far more about this than I do. I do prefer to be legal even though there is barely a traffic officer out there who knows enough about this or if there are, they are now in such few numbers that getting caught is highly unlikely.

Where the issues may arise is in the case of a night time collision on a back road when the opposing vehicle alledges they were blinded by the oncoming vehicle's lights. If a vehicle examination were to reveal retro fit LED lights then the implications for insurance liabilty may be tested a long was beyond the £20 or so ponds of changing the lights.

Risk is an individual choice and we all assess risk to meet our own comfort scale. Sadly I believe that there are many out there who have upgraded their headlamps and I often feel blinded by the light of some cars. Perhaps if they read some of the discussions that take place on forums suach as this they make more informed decisions.

One thing that I did not know his that after up-grading headlamps, the alignmnet should be checked for conformity.

[Jocko]

This article from GEM, a well respected and supported motoring organisation, is quite clear regarding the illegality of retrofit LED exterior lamps (not just headlamps).
https://www.motoringassist.com/motoring-advice/news/fit-led-lighting-car-legally/
Rob Marshall has served as GEM Motoring Assists’ technical advisor, since 2009

[culzean]

The Phillips luxeon ZE-S led chips are designed specifically to be same shape and size as filament in a normal bulb. Up until the Phillips chips came out it was impossible to get a legal beam pattern from an led chip because they were not correct shape - I have posted photos of my wife's Jazz GE beam pattern and it is better than the filament bulbs, definitely not dazzling and neither of us has ever been flashed by an oncoming vehicle. Just to check I have parked on  a dark road and walked ahead of  the car about 40 metres and gone from a crouch to  standing up to check for glare. There are a lot of cheap and nasty HID and LED bulbs out there and they have all been lumped together - I cannot see Philips putting their name to a dodgy LED bulb.

I have tried many of the high output filament bulbs on the market, due to miles I used to cover they did not last more than 12 to 15 months and quality of light was nowhere near the Philips LED - I will be keeping them for sure. I did find Phillips filament bulbs tended to have best beam patterns.

I have done a lot of B road driving in my life and been the victim of HID retrofits and maybe even dodgy LED as well, but some of the worst lights for glare are mostly German headlights, don't know how they ever got type approval and how they pass MOT but apparently the fact that they were fitted by car maker means they are OK.

[Jocko]

Philips headlight bulbs, completely illegal for road use.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/322741993941?rt=nc

[guest7288]

'Philips headlight bulbs, completely illegal for road use.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/322741993941?rt=nc'

This is rather misleading as you have said that all Phillips headlight bulbs are illegal for road use. I don't think that is correct andthat that is what you intended to say. I think this is an unintentional libellous statement and could amount to a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation; a written defamation.

Is that what you intended, perhaps clarify what you really meant to say!

[Jocko]

The bulb I have linked to, made by Philips, is illegal for road use in the UK. It can only be fitted to vehicles for off road use (rallying and the like). The point of my post is that not all vehicle bulbs manufactured by Philips (or many other major manufacturers) are legal to fit to a vehicle used on UK roads. Anything more than 65 watts is not permitted in the UK.

[guest1372]

Basically road legal means compliant and marked with ECE37.

In reference to the Philips X-tremeUltinon LED H4
"Here at PowerBulbs, we do sell LED headlights. These are made by Philips in their factory in Germany to the highest quality standards. Whilst they are not road legal, the bulbs are designed with specialist technology that make them a lot safer to use and won't dazzle other drivers."
https://www.powerbulbs.com/blog/2017/09/led-headlights-road-legal
--
TG

[guest7288]

You phrase you information carefully and clearly state they are not road legal yet you publicise their benefits. You also fail to say why they are not road legal so you only partially inform your customers. Morally I am not sure this is appropriate or ethical. You could identify the need to change the lighting unit, that would be open, or even mention that after fitting lights should be re aligned. You do neither It is your business and until they outlaw sales I doubt nothing will change.

One thing that is a danger is people driving cars like the Jazz with under powered poor H4 halogen lamps that give them minimal vision of the road ahead. Pedestrians crossing the road or bikes without lights can not be seen clearly because of the glare of oncoming modern headlights some which may have been supplied by you, road legal or otherwise.

Phillips is a responsibe company

[guest5079]

Perhaps it is unfortunate that the law is an ass. The interference of the EU has made life difficult for Joe public with its ambiguities. Here we have an argument  about LED bulbs and Philips. Why does Philips make the things if they are legal in one EU country and not another, we are supposed after all to be governed by one organisation.( Profit of course) BUT we are all working under different rules. Being controversial our con and use, lighting etc laws were pretty good.
Having been both a MOT tester and a police officer, I can understand the confusion. I dealt with an accident involving a car with a tractor and trailer. Not being authourised I had to call Traffic for advice over the multiple faults with the trailer.  To be blunt Traffic just ran the other way as the legislation on farm vehicles was and no doubt still  is a mine field. I gave a farmers Moggy 1000 truck a pass on it's MOT only to have the local plod screaming at me as the truck did not have a drivers door mirror. It did not have to have one as it was not a requirement at the time as long as it had a rear view mirror. Vehicles have got considerably more complicated in recent years and legislation is written by civil servants who do not seem to understand the complications of enforcement. Basically until there is 'stated case' on something, very few coppers or the CPS will want to take on something like LED headlight legislation. For vehicle type prosecutions, defence will whistle up an expert on the subject and usually the Magistrates are left in a quandry because they, in my day had to rely on their own judgement. If we take Philips for example, they have a legal department that can probably run rings around the average solicitor in court. Of course with CPS it's not in the public interest. ( can't justfy the money and so people continue to flout the law). As well as some MOT testing stations needing a lesson in what is required we need many more enforcement officers out there and as well as the question of the legality of  HID headlights it would be nice if the average motorist managed to have TWO working headlights AND that applies to Large commercial vehicles as well. After all that is an easy one to enforce. ie ALL lights fitted MUST be in working order.

[culzean]

I have frequently been a victim of so called legal high end German headlights which are very blue and dazzling beam distribution. I am more than happy with quality and distribution of light from Phillips chips, which are designed to accurately mimic the twin filaments in an H4 bulb, which have both radial and axial offset positions to each other,  something the single compact electric arc  in an HID bulb can never do with its simple solenoid operated shutter system. If a +150% filament legal to use bulb lives up to its promise it will be about 80watt output, about the same as Philips LED,  but colour temp of LED is better, and extremely long life.