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Honda Jazz Forums => Honda Jazz Mk1 2002-2008 => Topic started by: JonnyJazz on May 15, 2022, 03:11:02 PM

Title: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on May 15, 2022, 03:11:02 PM
The car went in for a new front wheel bearing but it seems the clowns doing the job have done it some serious harm. I’m told the car was driven out of the workshop but then all drive to the wheels was lost. There was a suggestion the driveshaft splines were worn out but I think I’m being fed BS as it drove perfectly fine before they touched it.
Anyone have any idea what they could have buggered up?   

Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: madasafish on May 16, 2022, 04:10:06 PM
Driveshaft nut not tightened.
Ask to see the driveshaft..Look at the splines.

If they cannot produce it,then they broke it.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: aphybrid on May 17, 2022, 06:06:11 AM
The car went in for a new front wheel bearing but it seems the clowns doing the job have done it some serious harm. I’m told the car was driven out of the workshop but then all drive to the wheels was lost. There was a suggestion the driveshaft splines were worn out but I think I’m being fed BS as it drove perfectly fine before they touched it.
Anyone have any idea what they could have buggered up?

If the splines were worn should they not have informed you prior to rebuild?
Is the garage part of a trade organisation, if so seek recourse through that if no direct resolution.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on May 17, 2022, 07:10:28 AM
Yes indeed, if the splines were worn or damaged this should have been highlighted before the job went any further, but I doubt there was anything wrong with them at that stage. It could well be the hub nut not being tightened correctly which could be a problem when we go to tow it away later this week. 
The job was being done gratis as a favour by a friend of a friend, any financial redress will not be possible.   
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on May 19, 2022, 07:06:52 AM
Something odd happened when we went to collect the car yesterday. I started the engine, put it in gear, released the clutch and it drove! We put the tow strap away and departed in convoy with the tow car.

About a mile down the road there was a red traffic light. When it came to pulling away, as the clutch was released there was a distinct clunk similar to when a gearbox jumps out of gear and that was it – no drive.
We pushed the stricken Jazz off the main road into a side street, hooked up the tow strap and dragged it 10 miles the rest of the way.

The question is, how come it drove after standing for a while after the wheel bearing job was done? The loss of drive I experienced was just the same as described by the people that did the job.

Now, even with the engine running all gears can be selected without the clutch being depressed. The pedal seems normal to me so this suggests that either there is a problem with the clutch/release mechanism or more seriously – there is a problem with the gearbox. Has anyone out there ever had this happen on their car?         
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: olduser1 on May 19, 2022, 09:29:56 AM
Remote diagnosis can be tricky, in your issue the source is the 'garage' who carried out the work - your first port of call.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on May 19, 2022, 04:50:52 PM
Just got in the car, started the engine put it in gear and it drove up the drive and reversed back again. It seems the disengagement of drive happens when the engine and gearbox warm up.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: Jocko on May 20, 2022, 04:44:45 PM
It sounds to me like a clutch issue. If it has anything to do with the wheel bearing the shaft should be spinning even though the car is not driving. The fact you can select any gear without depressing the clutch sounds like a clutch issue though what, I haven't a clue.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: sparky Paul on May 23, 2022, 09:56:10 PM
I had this once when the centre of the clutch plate broke away from the friction part, on a big Nissan.

Intermittent drive for a short while, then no drive at all. Everything felt normal, clutch pedal, gear stick, but no drive. A new clutch fixed the problem.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: madasafish on May 25, 2022, 09:15:11 PM
I had this once when the centre of the clutch plate broke away from the friction part, on a big Nissan.

Intermittent drive for a short while, then no drive at all. Everything felt normal, clutch pedal, gear stick, but no drive. A new clutch fixed the problem.
Ditto with a Rover 800 with 2l Petrol.
Reversed into garage overnight - fine.
Put into first gear in morning to drive out-bang .No drive.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on May 26, 2022, 10:17:42 AM
Problem here is that it will drive a short distance before it fails again. Leave it a while and it will drive again but I dare not take it out on the road and get stranded. It will have to wait until this weekend or next, I'm too busy to look at it at  present but the first thing I'm going to check is the slave cylinder.     
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on June 07, 2022, 08:45:53 AM
All fixed with a second hand driveshaft. 
Some idiot had ground down the splines at the gearbox end and refitted it with no C clip so it was free to go in and out of the diff as it pleased.
Such unbelievable stupidity I've not encountered before. 
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: NoelM on June 07, 2022, 10:14:59 AM
Looks like you need to have a few strong words with whoever you took it to in the first place
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: Jocko on June 07, 2022, 06:53:43 PM
Splines probably were not ground down but worn down by slipping in and out. It may well have been like that for long enough. Getting the wheel bearing done just loosened it enough to fail completely.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on June 08, 2022, 04:51:32 PM
It looks ground down to me.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: embee on June 08, 2022, 06:01:37 PM
Definitely looks ground down to me. Curiouser and curiouser.
Just watched a bit of a youtube vid of changing a Jazz shaft and it shows very clearly the shaft end and wire circlip at around 3min30sec here


The end should have the spline features showing.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: Lord Voltermore on June 08, 2022, 06:28:04 PM
Ground down, but I dont think deliberately by a mechanic. But possibly still negligence.    To me it looks more like damaged when the shaft popped out of the mating splines on the gearbox hub.These mating spline slots would be rotating, trying to drive the car  and may have randomly mangled the tip of the  now stationary drive shaft.       

I  saw something on here recently which suggests the drive shaft may be an intentional weak link,because its easier to replace a damaged shaft than gearbox parts.   In which case the gearbox part may be hard enough metal to mill away softer metal on the shaft without suffering much damage itself. 

Its possible the C clip  fractured and  fell off earlier  due to excess play and vibration from the faulty wheel bearing.  Or the other way round.  The C clip may have broken  ,causing excess play that damaged the wheel bearing.   Or the C clip may have been omitted on an earlier repair  job.

I havnt looked at the video yet  so  I cant say  if the mechanic  would have known the C clip was missing  ,  or whether he should have known there should be one.    I cant see what advantage it would have given him deliberately grinding the shaft in such a botched way. 
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: Jocko on June 08, 2022, 07:09:40 PM
For the Mk 1, you do not remove the driveshaft to replace the wheel bearing. In fact, there is a warning: NOTE: Do not pull the driveshaft end outward. The driveshaft inboard joint may come off.

Just checked. It is the same for the Mk 2.
Do not pull the driveshaft end outward. The driveshaft inboard joint may come apart.
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: JonnyJazz on June 11, 2022, 08:53:03 AM
Jocko is quite right, there is no need to remove the shaft to do the bearing. I think they pulled the spider out of the inner CV joint and therefore had to remove it to put it back in.

Also, I can see why an incompetent would grind it. On fitting the replacement I found it would only go half way into the diff and then stop. Looking into the diff, there is a groove in the splines, so if the shaft is not perfectly aligned the end of the shaft won't go in. It needs to be wiggled about while being tapped with a soft hammer in order to get it go right in.
In addition, the clip has to be centralized in its groove as this will also foul the inner groove. I held the clip in place with grease. I suspect the idiots working on this car could not work this out, so butchered it instead.
   
Title: Re: New front wheel bearing, then no drive
Post by: embee on June 11, 2022, 11:19:34 AM
Agree with ^this ^ theory.
 >:(