Author Topic: MPG for those interested  (Read 213922 times)

Will Once

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #705 on: November 18, 2024, 12:25:48 PM »
It’s complicated … excuse the long post, but I’ve been thinking about this a lot since I got my Jazz advance.

The manual says that ECON mode adjusts the performance of the climate control system and changes the accelerator pedal response. What that means in practice depends on how you drive.

Climate control off
If you turn the climate control off (especially AC) you should get better mpg than climate control + ECON mode. ECON reduces the climate control, but it can’t reduce it if is turned off.

Climate control manually reduced
There ought to be some mpg savings if you reduce the demand you make on the climate control especially air con. ECON mode ought to make some additional mpg savings.

Auto climate control. ECON should make reductions here. Let’s imagine that we start the car on a hot day. The auto AC on its own will cool the car as quickly as it can with high fan and AC. ECON will increase the time it takes to get to your target, which should shave off some mpg.

High/ low accelerator pedal response
The accelerator pedal response thing is harder to judge. One thing is certain - if you respond to ECON mode by pressing the throttle more than normally you will undo some or all of the benefits of ECON mode. ECON mode might make some mpg reductions if you accelerate more gently than you would otherwise have done.

My guess is that we all have a rough idea of how much acceleration we want. ECON mode makes us press the throttle more to get to that ideal. So it depends on how we react to the ECON mode blunting the acceleration. Drive like a nun or a hooligan or something in between?

Bottom line?
If you want to save the most mpg, then turn off or down anything electrical especially aircon. Do the sensible bits of hyper-miling by reducing acceleration and top speed. Use B mode to harvest as much energy as you can. ECON mode probably won’t do much for you, but you might as well have it on. The little green plant looks cheery.

If you use the climate control, either on auto or manual then ECON gives you an intermediate setting between fully on and fully off. Ought to be useful provided that you don’t compensate.

If you like to accelerate hard then ECON mode might not do much (all other things being equal).

I think …

Lord Voltermore

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #706 on: November 20, 2024, 11:45:38 AM »
Will Once.  Opening the windows can also speed up cabin cooling. But it increases  aerodynamic drag so may not improve mpg.    And this time of year  using heated seats rather than cabin heating can  improve mpg. Especially from a cold start.

I never use ECON mode. I dislike  the 'dead' feeling of suppressed throttle response.  Like many owners I dont find it difficult using a gentle throttle and moderating  my speeds etc  without it.   Also Mrs LV will quite often  ignore automatic climate control and switch aircon off  manually.     

I have  only done  about 1300 miles so far in my Advance. I tried out econ mode and occasionally used B mode in my previous EX, but  have not yet used either in my advance  Despite this its average so far on the fibometer is 66.2 mpg.   Happy with that.
 
« Last Edit: November 20, 2024, 11:48:52 AM by Lord Voltermore »
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coldstart

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #707 on: November 24, 2024, 04:09:23 PM »
Will Once.  Opening the windows can also speed up cabin cooling. But it increases  aerodynamic drag so may not improve mpg.    And this time of year  using heated seats rather than cabin heating can  improve mpg. Especially from a cold start.

I never use ECON mode. I dislike  the 'dead' feeling of suppressed throttle response.  Like many owners I dont find it difficult using a gentle throttle and moderating  my speeds etc  without it.   Also Mrs LV will quite often  ignore automatic climate control and switch aircon off  manually.     

I have  only done  about 1300 miles so far in my Advance. I tried out econ mode and occasionally used B mode in my previous EX, but  have not yet used either in my advance  Despite this its average so far on the fibometer is 66.2 mpg.   Happy with that.

Interesting thoughts! - I beg to differ on some points, though:

The open windows on the first few hundred yards won't be so taxing on the air drag (unless you are a really sportive driver - which would make me think, that you have bought the wrong car in the first place).

I rather like the "dulled" response - I have now driven well over 12'000 miles with my Jazz all in ECON-mode and never missed anything acceleration wise (maybe I'm getting old...)

I can only keep repeating that my MPG is "ruined" by my long motorway travels to France - driven only locally it would be in the high seventies and I love the car for it!

brianyipian

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #708 on: January 15, 2025, 05:47:44 AM »
It’s complicated … excuse the long post, but I’ve been thinking about this a lot since I got my Jazz advance.

The manual says that ECON mode adjusts the performance of the climate control system and changes the accelerator pedal response. What that means in practice depends on how you drive.

Climate control off
If you turn the climate control off (especially AC) you should get better mpg than climate control + ECON mode. ECON reduces the climate control, but it can’t reduce it if is turned off.

Climate control manually reduced
There ought to be some mpg savings if you reduce the demand you make on the climate control especially air con. ECON mode ought to make some additional mpg savings.

Auto climate control. ECON should make reductions here. Let’s imagine that we start the car on a hot day. The auto AC on its own will cool the car as quickly as it can with high fan and AC. ECON will increase the time it takes to get to your target, which should shave off some mpg.

High/ low accelerator pedal response
The accelerator pedal response thing is harder to judge. One thing is certain - if you respond to ECON mode by pressing the throttle more than normally you will undo some or all of the benefits of ECON mode. ECON mode might make some mpg reductions if you accelerate more gently than you would otherwise have done.

My guess is that we all have a rough idea of how much acceleration we want. ECON mode makes us press the throttle more to get to that ideal. So it depends on how we react to the ECON mode blunting the acceleration. Drive like a nun or a hooligan or something in between?

Bottom line?
If you want to save the most mpg, then turn off or down anything electrical especially aircon. Do the sensible bits of hyper-miling by reducing acceleration and top speed. Use B mode to harvest as much energy as you can. ECON mode probably won’t do much for you, but you might as well have it on. The little green plant looks cheery.

If you use the climate control, either on auto or manual then ECON gives you an intermediate setting between fully on and fully off. Ought to be useful provided that you don’t compensate.

If you like to accelerate hard then ECON mode might not do much (all other things being equal).

I think …

I've noticed one more thing.  With ECON mode on, the ICE will charge the battery more frequently and liberally. 

I've been trying to drive strictly in standard mode for the past few days, and I've noticed that the engine turns on much more frequently on a flat road even when the battery is above 30% capacity. 

When I was waiting at a red light, the ICE wouldn't turn off completely while the battery was at 4 bars.  I decided to see if turning ECON mode on will turn off the ICE...  and it did!  I kept the ECON mode on for just a bit longer, and I was driving on full EV mode until the battery dipped to 3 bars, and the ICE resumed charging.

For the past 700 km, where I've strictly used standard mode to drive around city and highway, my consumption is 0.5L/100km higher than my previous trips.  at 4.5L/100km. 
-  On highway cruise, I didn't notice a big jump.  In fact, I was able to achieve ~3.5L/100km consumption on flat highway roads cruising at around 70-90km/h.  (with standard mode)

I'll continue to test around. 

Downsizer

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #709 on: January 18, 2025, 06:52:04 PM »
The latest Which annual car guide still rates the Jazz a best buy, but says the motorway test fuel consumption averaged only 39.2 mpg.  This seems unusually low as I assume they stuck to speed limits, but I don’t yet have enough personal motorway experience to comment.

aphybrid

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #710 on: January 20, 2025, 09:20:08 AM »
Latest couple of fills showing winter and motorway effects mpg overall sitting at 54.4
« Last Edit: January 25, 2025, 08:36:32 AM by aphybrid »

John Ratsey

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #711 on: January 22, 2025, 08:27:00 PM »
The latest Which annual car guide still rates the Jazz a best buy, but says the motorway test fuel consumption averaged only 39.2 mpg.  This seems unusually low as I assume they stuck to speed limits, but I don’t yet have enough personal motorway experience to comment.
I saw that and wondered if the test was done on a very cold day with a strong headwind. Honda's official mpg for the WLTP extra high cycle (up to 75mph) is about 10 mpg higher than Which?'s number and is more plausible but about 20 mpg lower than the result for the other WLTP test cycles. The Jazz is much more economical at 60mph than 70.
2025 Jazz Advance, previously 2022 HR-V Elegance, previously 2020 Jazz Crosstar

Downsizer

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #712 on: January 26, 2025, 07:07:16 PM »
Which say that they conduct their tests on a rolling road in the lab, simulating wind resistance. They use the WLTP cycle but also a sustained motorway speed test, which is presumably where the 39.2 figure comes from. They also test with dipped or driving lights and air conditioning on.

aphybrid

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #713 on: February 15, 2025, 10:51:38 AM »
Latest fill update, "winter" effect evident, also combined with 2 hours motorway running with speed set a 73mph. average overall dipping with these.

Enfrance

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #714 on: February 15, 2025, 01:49:04 PM »
 I’ve had my 2021 Jazz for just 24 hours and am very pleased with it but, the mpg being quoted on the dash is only 37.3 which isn’t as good as the 2019 Civic 1 litre I traded in. Despite its age it has only 915 miles on the clock so it must have sat in the drive of the disabled previous owner for long periods of time. I’m a complete novice to hybrid driving so any guidance would be very helpful.

So is there a golden rule for achieving decent mpg and what are the best settings on the car for doing so?

I fit the apparent demographic for the Jazz being 85 but thankfully quite fit. The heated steering wheel was a seller for me.


Kremmen

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #715 on: February 15, 2025, 03:17:31 PM »
37.3 is very low, but, could be if you only perform short journeys and this time of year have heating, lights, etc

I'd suggest going for a 30 mile+ journey along uncongested roads and see what it returns
Let's be careful out there !

Lord Voltermore

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #716 on: February 15, 2025, 03:37:24 PM »
I’ve had my 2021 Jazz for just 24 hours and am very pleased with it but, the mpg being quoted on the dash is only 37.3 which isn’t as good as the 2019 Civic 1 litre I traded in. Despite its age it has only 915 miles on the clock so it must have sat in the drive of the disabled previous owner for long periods of time. I’m a complete novice to hybrid driving so any guidance would be very helpful.

So is there a golden rule for achieving decent mpg and what are the best settings on the car for doing so?

I fit the apparent demographic for the Jazz being 85 but thankfully quite fit. The heated steering wheel was a seller for me.
It may be because  the dealer recently  reset the trip meter  to zero  or it reset itself when they ,or you, put some petrol in the car. If shortly after this reset  the car is held up in traffic  with the engine running , but not moving very far, or you sit in the car learning its  'clever tricks, or its in a workshop being serviced,  the computer will register  quite a lot of petrol being used  by the engine but very  little distance covered.  This will be converted to a very bad, and misleading , MPG figure.
To illustrate  this you may have noticed the little row of green eco  performance trees displayed . Its the computers assessment of how economically you drove on that trip.  ;D In normal driving I get lots  of green leaves.   But if I start the car briefly to move it on the drive or check something on the  display etc  I get bare trees.  The computer is most unimpressed with how much gas I guzzled on that 'trip'.   :P

If you swop the trip meter between A  and B you may see a different, more typical  MPG displayed. But even this one may not be great if, as the mileage suggests, the previous  owner only did short journeys.As  Kremmen says  short distances with the engine cold  will see MPG at its worst.   


When I took delivery of my brand new car  with very few miles on the clock( ,and those mostly stop/ start on and off the ship , into the dealers yard ,pre delivery inspection  etc ) , the mpg displayed  was similar to yours.  It remained a terrible  average for the first  50 miles or so  when it rapidly improved to my more typical 66 mpg.     
Main advice for good mpg is drive it with a  gentle throttle. Try to get a 'feel' for when the car is happy.  Sometimes just   easing back on the throttle a little  brings good improvement in mpg with little loss in speed.
Some find using Econ mode helps by stifling throttle response a bit. Some prefer using B mode rather than D mode   But check out then pros and cons of each on this site and see how you get on.

Heated steering is great. Heated seats even better.. Using these  for the  first few miles on a cold engine instead of cabin heating improves mpg. 
« Last Edit: February 15, 2025, 04:26:42 PM by Lord Voltermore »
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Enfrance

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #717 on: February 15, 2025, 05:33:27 PM »
My Lord,  :) thank you for all that. It’s very interesting and I have seen the row of green leaves while sitting at some lights. I will take your advice and do a 30 minute trip and see if it helps.

The various choices for driving modes should be fun

Like everyone on here I keep a note of all of my mileage and fuel, old habits die hard, so it will be interesting to see how it turns out.

I will report back when I have something positive to offer.

Enfrance

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #718 on: February 19, 2025, 09:11:56 AM »
After all the helpful advice I did the following.
I zeroed trip A and then drove for 38 miles on an A road with a mixture of villages and terrain in Lincolnshire. After just one mile I was told the car was doing 141mpg which I thought was pretty good but eventually at the end of the drive it was down to a realistic 58 mpg which I think is very acceptable.

Since then, driving round town has produced up to 63 mpg.

The one thing that I am surprised at is how much the capacity of the battery fluctuates.

Many thanks for your advice.


Kremmen

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Re: MPG for those interested
« Reply #719 on: February 19, 2025, 09:13:59 AM »
The battery meter should normally fluctuate between 3 and 7 bars

Once it gets to 7 and you're driving in EV mode it can reduce quite quickly
Let's be careful out there !

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